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This is how social media starts roping you in.

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This is how politics starts roping you in.

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This is how cult leaders will recruit you into a cult.

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It's the number one way that we influence another view of the micro compliance.

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And hypnosis is a great example of this.

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Like I can have a person laying on the floor unconscious in maybe a minute and a half.

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And it's very easy to do.

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Anybody can learn to do it.

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But one of the things you'll see me do at the beginning of that is like give me your hand,

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but both hands out like this and flip them over.

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You look all the way up and look all the way down.

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Or make them do like 50 things.

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None of the things that I just did with them are meaningful.

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Everything was micro compliance.

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You don't realize that you're going through massive amount of compliance.

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So in order to get your behavior to change or influence another human being,

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use what works for brainwashing.

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Because our brains have not developed one more wrinkle in the last 200,000 years.

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So a regular example of this is novelty.

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Anything novel, hijacks our brain.

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So if you're trying to change your beliefs or want to lose this weight,

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change something up in your life, change your wardrobe,

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repaint the walls in your office.

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You need to tell the animal part of our brain here.

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Because this has been proven on FMRI studies

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that the decision shows up before we're conscious of it.

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What about human to human skills?

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So people are starving to have great conversations that are very influential.

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Which means that if I'm an attorney, I can sway a jury.

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If I'm a hostage negotiator, I say people's lives.

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If I'm a parent, I raise better kids.

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Because I can communicate in a way that gets the outcome that I'm looking for.

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And you can do that with any of these techniques.

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Like negative dissociation.

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The childhood development triangle.

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So there's this thing called the PCP model.

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And when it comes to influencing human beings,

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that is the most important thing that you could ever understand.

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That might just be the most important skill in the world.

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So let's do some role-playing.

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All right.

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Guys, I've got a favor to ask before this episode begins.

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69% of you that listen to the show frequently

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haven't yet hit the follow button.

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And that follow button is very smart.

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Because it means you won't miss the best episodes.

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The algorithm, if you follow a show, will deliver you

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the best episodes from that show very prominently in your feed.

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So when we have our best episodes on this show,

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the most shared episodes, the most rated episodes,

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I would love you to know.

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And the simple way for you to know that

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is to hit that follow button.

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But also, the fact that, I think what,

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41% of you have chosen to follow this show

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that listen to it regularly

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is the reason why we've been able to improve everything.

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It's the simple, easy, free thing

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that you can do to help us make this show better.

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I would be hugely grateful if you could take a minute

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on the app you're listening to this one right now

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and hit that follow button.

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Thank you so, so, so much.

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Chase, the world is changing rapidly before our eyes.

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On so many fronts, in terms of geopolitics,

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but also in terms of technology with this whole AI thing,

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that's rapidly accelerating.

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And with that, you've got things like robotics there on the way.

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And Elon Musk saying that we'll have

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10 billion humanoid robots in the world in the future.

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And these are going to be intelligent robots

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because the software within them is now artificial.

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And it's incredibly intelligent.

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One of the things people say to me a lot

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is in a world where we're going to have all this intelligence.

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What jobs are going to remain?

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And one of the points of consensus

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from interviewing all these great AI experts

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is that human skills, any skills that are irreplaceably human,

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social skills, people skills are going to be of extreme value.

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You spend a lot of time teaching people these skills.

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I asked you a question just before we started recording.

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The question I asked you is,

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what is the thing you like talking about the most

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that you think adds the most value to people?

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What did you say?

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Helping people understand how to guide human decision

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and have great conversations that are very influential.

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What does that mean in real specific practical terms?

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It means that if we're in a conversation,

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I become more likely to help you achieve the outcome

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that I see for you.

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So if I'm a leader, then I can do that.

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If I'm an attorney, I can sway a jury.

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I can make a jury pick a certain decision.

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If I'm a hostage negotiator, I say people's lives.

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If I'm a parent, I raise better kids

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because I can communicate in a way

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that gets the outcome that I'm looking for from another person.

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That might just be the most important skill in the world.

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I think it is.

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Increasingly so in a world of AI

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where computers are going to be able to handle

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a lot of this sort of intelligent white color

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related stuff for us.

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And we're going to be rendered useful only

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for that which humans can do, which is probably this stuff.

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Yeah.

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The IRL in real life, human to human stuff.

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And I think people are starving for it.

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You've got a podcast that's non-performative.

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And people are attracted to realism.

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There's so much that's artificial and performative

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that people are starving for realism already.

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And this is pre-AI.

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This was starting to blow up

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because it just gave us a sense of something that was real.

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We are in an epidemic right now of loneliness

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where people are disconnected from each other.

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And these human skills are going to matter more than ever

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as AI comes out.

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I was thinking about what you teach

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in terms of human behavior

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and getting the best out of people

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and in influencing people to do what you want them to do.

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And AI does a lot of that.

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It does.

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It seems like it's been programmed to understand human behavior

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and to get me to like it.

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So let's get into some of that human behavior

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that you think is critical in a world of AI.

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In a world of AI,

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if the skills that matter the most

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are human to human skills,

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where does one begin?

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Let's understand humans first.

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Like how could AI compromise a person?

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And when it comes to influencing human beings,

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the most important thing that you could ever understand

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whether you're a CEO, a mom or a dad

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is this thing called the PCP model.

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And PCP is a three step cascade

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that happens inside the human brain

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when we get influenced

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whether we're doing something massively extreme

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like some mentoring in candidate type stuff

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or we're just having a sales call

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and we make a sale.

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Everything goes through PCP.

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So P is perception.

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So the first step to really changing somebody's outcome

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getting you to make a decision later on

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is to change how you're viewing this situation.

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So when people talk about owning the frame of a situation

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or redefining what a situation means right there

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is changing the perception of it.

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If we're just talking about AI,

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AI can say yes, Steve and I see what you mean

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and I can see why you're frustrated.

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You know, one of those like standard responses

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but here's what this is really about

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and it gives you this layer that makes you say,

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oh shit, like this is it's going deep.

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So now it's hit the P on the PCP model.

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So it's modified your perception of a situation.

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And how is it specifically done that there?

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Is it because it's acknowledged my point of view

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but then given a new one?

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Yes.

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So if it just given me a new one,

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I might not have believed it.

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But because it first acknowledges my point of view

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before delivering it a different one,

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that's more effective.

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Yes.

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So and the biggest mistake that people make with language

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is language should be resonating and not directing.

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If you want to speak well,

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you're not directing people to think certain things

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or to feel certain things.

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It should resonate with what they're already feeling

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and then start guiding them.

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So you're getting into their river,

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so to speak and flowing with that first.

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Okay, so let's do some role playing.

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All right, I say to you,

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Chase, I think the sky is purple.

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Your job is to carry out the perception shift.

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Yeah, what would you say to me?

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So if somebody says something that is an idea

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that's far out there,

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I'll always acknowledge it.

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And I would say like every human being is different

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and it's fascinating how many rods and cones

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we have in our eyes, how we all perceive things differently.

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And it's amazing when you see one thing

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that you might see something that's purple

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and I see the exact same thing.

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We may be seeing the identical color,

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but our brains are just interpreting it differently

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or maybe we have a different word for it.

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And it's amazing how much we agree on

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and we just don't realize how much aligned

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we are with a situation in life.

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That makes sense.

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So I've never had to respond to somebody

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calling this guy purple,

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but if I can modify how you perceive a situation,

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so let's say we're at a business networking event

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and I walk up to you

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and I say, let's say I call out the script,

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openly call out in the script.

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And I say it's amazing how many people

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are just running the script of,

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I need to look like a business professional.

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I can't say anything that makes me look emotional.

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I can't say anything that's personal.

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I have to hand out a business card.

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I have to put on this persona.

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So I'm just openly saying the script

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that's running inside that person's head.

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And I'm making you aware of it,

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which means that I'm changing your perception of the situation.

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So anything I can get you aware of

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that's running inside of your own head,

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I can massively start transforming your behavior.

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And we'll get to identity here in a minute,

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but any script that you call out,

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you're weakening its power.

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So like if you shook my hand super aggressively,

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or somebody shook my hand like a pretend alpha male,

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and you call out exactly what they're wanting to happen.

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And you say, wow, the handshake is really firm.

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I just read an article a few weeks ago

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that only alpha males do that.

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And you say the quiet part out loud.

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So any script that's running in the background,

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some kind of social script,

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if I can surface that,

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then I become a lot more powerful over the situation

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because I've lessened the power of a script.

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Any script that we push down

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is going to be a lot more powerful in that person,

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increasing power.

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On that example of the very over-the-top handshake,

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by calling it out, what have you done?

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What have you done in my head?

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So I'm the one that's just squeezed your hand really tight,

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because I want to be an alpha male.

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You call it out.

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What does that do?

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It disarms me,

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or it makes me feel great?

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No, and I'm not saying that's a tactic anybody should do,

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but if there's a script running,

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here's what we're supposed to do.

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You and I are on a podcast.

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We're supposed to make eye contact with each other.

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We're supposed to nod throughout this entire thing.

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I'm making both of us more aware of this,

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and that gives us a little permission to break away from it.

262
00:10:35.280 --> 00:10:36.480
Oh, it's a break away from it.

263
00:10:36.480 --> 00:10:36.960
Yeah.

264
00:10:36.960 --> 00:10:40.880
So your desire to be the alpha male in the handshake situation

265
00:10:40.880 --> 00:10:42.800
would be temporarily kind of broken,

266
00:10:42.800 --> 00:10:44.880
because I'm openly saying out loud

267
00:10:44.880 --> 00:10:46.560
what you didn't want to say out loud.

268
00:10:46.560 --> 00:10:47.760
Oh, okay.

269
00:10:47.760 --> 00:10:48.400
Does that make sense?

270
00:10:48.400 --> 00:10:48.880
Oh, okay.

271
00:10:48.880 --> 00:10:50.160
So you're kind of cooling it out,

272
00:10:50.160 --> 00:10:52.640
but without making fun of it.

273
00:10:53.200 --> 00:10:55.200
Yeah, okay.

274
00:10:55.200 --> 00:10:58.320
So after I shift your perception,

275
00:10:58.320 --> 00:11:00.560
all I need to do is get you to see a situation

276
00:11:00.560 --> 00:11:02.080
a little bit differently.

277
00:11:02.080 --> 00:11:04.240
And if you turn on the news, oh my God,

278
00:11:04.240 --> 00:11:06.640
are you going to see this all day, every day?

279
00:11:06.640 --> 00:11:08.320
The perception changes.

280
00:11:08.320 --> 00:11:10.080
Oh, you thought it was about this?

281
00:11:10.080 --> 00:11:11.040
Guess what?

282
00:11:11.040 --> 00:11:12.080
Here's what they did today,

283
00:11:12.080 --> 00:11:13.520
and they did this blatantly,

284
00:11:13.520 --> 00:11:15.360
and now it's in your face.

285
00:11:15.360 --> 00:11:17.920
They do all of this stuff to shift your perception.

286
00:11:19.120 --> 00:11:22.240
And in order to get your behavior to change,

287
00:11:22.320 --> 00:11:24.240
once I shift your perception,

288
00:11:24.240 --> 00:11:27.120
then I change the C in this model.

289
00:11:27.120 --> 00:11:28.640
And the C is context.

290
00:11:29.840 --> 00:11:34.000
And context is the most important thing in the world.

291
00:11:34.000 --> 00:11:35.840
And nobody's talking about it.

292
00:11:35.840 --> 00:11:37.520
Probably everyone watching this

293
00:11:37.520 --> 00:11:39.360
or listening to this right now

294
00:11:39.360 --> 00:11:41.440
is going to get naked today.

295
00:11:42.720 --> 00:11:43.840
They'll get in a shower,

296
00:11:43.840 --> 00:11:45.920
they'll get in a bath, whatever it is.

297
00:11:45.920 --> 00:11:49.120
But some almost everybody's going to get naked.

298
00:11:49.120 --> 00:11:50.400
We're probably not going to do it

299
00:11:50.400 --> 00:11:52.000
in the middle of an office building,

300
00:11:52.080 --> 00:11:52.800
like at work.

301
00:11:53.440 --> 00:11:56.480
Context dictates what behavior is permissible.

302
00:11:57.360 --> 00:11:59.360
So if you go back to 19,

303
00:11:59.360 --> 00:12:00.720
I think it was 1957,

304
00:12:01.680 --> 00:12:03.920
there's this guy running a stage hypnosis,

305
00:12:03.920 --> 00:12:05.280
like comedy show,

306
00:12:05.920 --> 00:12:07.520
you know where they bring people up on stage

307
00:12:07.520 --> 00:12:08.560
and make them do silly stuff.

308
00:12:09.360 --> 00:12:12.960
And one of the guys that's up on stage,

309
00:12:12.960 --> 00:12:15.920
she's knocked out and he's doing all this crazy stuff.

310
00:12:16.720 --> 00:12:19.040
He's an off-duty police officer.

311
00:12:19.040 --> 00:12:21.760
So he has a concealed handgun.

312
00:12:22.720 --> 00:12:24.400
But one of the skits in this

313
00:12:24.400 --> 00:12:26.320
or one of the bits that this comedian does,

314
00:12:26.960 --> 00:12:29.760
he tells the people that all of you are sheriffs.

315
00:12:29.760 --> 00:12:31.120
And you can't leave the stage,

316
00:12:31.120 --> 00:12:34.880
but everybody in the audience right here is rowdy.

317
00:12:34.880 --> 00:12:36.320
They're making lots of noise.

318
00:12:36.320 --> 00:12:37.680
You need to tell them to keep it down.

319
00:12:38.960 --> 00:12:40.000
So this starts.

320
00:12:41.040 --> 00:12:42.000
And the hip-toe says,

321
00:12:43.040 --> 00:12:44.720
now they're not even listening to you.

322
00:12:44.720 --> 00:12:46.080
They're not respecting you.

323
00:12:46.080 --> 00:12:46.880
And then he says,

324
00:12:46.880 --> 00:12:48.640
you can't leave the stage,

325
00:12:48.640 --> 00:12:50.080
but one of them's pulling out a gun.

326
00:12:51.040 --> 00:12:52.880
And this off-duty police officer

327
00:12:52.880 --> 00:12:55.440
pulls out his service weapon

328
00:12:55.440 --> 00:12:57.200
and starts firing into the crowd.

329
00:12:57.200 --> 00:12:58.080
This is a true story.

330
00:12:58.080 --> 00:12:58.880
True story.

331
00:12:58.880 --> 00:12:59.200
Really?

332
00:12:59.200 --> 00:12:59.680
Yeah.

333
00:12:59.680 --> 00:13:00.960
But is he a monster?

334
00:13:02.800 --> 00:13:03.520
Of course not,

335
00:13:03.520 --> 00:13:07.200
because context dictated what he would do.

336
00:13:08.320 --> 00:13:10.800
So if I can change context

337
00:13:10.800 --> 00:13:12.240
to where what I want you to do

338
00:13:12.960 --> 00:13:14.640
is just an automatic thing,

339
00:13:15.360 --> 00:13:16.880
I can make you do anything.

340
00:13:17.840 --> 00:13:21.680
The real skill is just being able to shift perception

341
00:13:21.680 --> 00:13:22.560
and context.

342
00:13:23.440 --> 00:13:25.680
If you can just shift perception and context,

343
00:13:25.680 --> 00:13:27.760
you can radicalize someone on the internet

344
00:13:27.760 --> 00:13:29.760
and turn them into a shooter.

345
00:13:30.720 --> 00:13:33.200
You can radicalize somebody politically

346
00:13:33.200 --> 00:13:35.840
and make them ex-communicate their entire family

347
00:13:35.840 --> 00:13:36.720
over a Thanksgiving.

348
00:13:37.600 --> 00:13:39.520
I'll give you an example from UK.

349
00:13:40.880 --> 00:13:42.480
In 1979, I think,

350
00:13:42.480 --> 00:13:44.320
there was a fire in Manchester

351
00:13:44.320 --> 00:13:46.080
in Woolworth's department store.

352
00:13:47.040 --> 00:13:49.120
And it was during the daytime.

353
00:13:49.120 --> 00:13:51.920
Doors were open and it turned out

354
00:13:51.920 --> 00:13:53.440
that most of the people that died

355
00:13:54.160 --> 00:13:55.360
were in the restaurant.

356
00:13:56.160 --> 00:13:58.640
And the restaurant was right by the door.

357
00:13:59.280 --> 00:14:00.720
So the fire inspector looked

358
00:14:00.720 --> 00:14:02.160
and they were trying to figure this out

359
00:14:02.160 --> 00:14:04.000
and a psychologist finally came along

360
00:14:04.640 --> 00:14:06.640
and said they died because they were waiting

361
00:14:06.640 --> 00:14:07.520
to pay their bill.

362
00:14:08.640 --> 00:14:10.880
Because no one gave them permission

363
00:14:10.880 --> 00:14:13.280
to stand up and walk out.

364
00:14:13.280 --> 00:14:14.800
No one did it first.

365
00:14:14.880 --> 00:14:16.800
So they kind of just went along with the crowd.

366
00:14:17.840 --> 00:14:20.160
And in the context of a restaurant,

367
00:14:20.160 --> 00:14:22.640
you don't stand up and walk out

368
00:14:22.640 --> 00:14:24.000
until you've paid your bill.

369
00:14:24.880 --> 00:14:28.560
So the context can also lead us into something like that.

370
00:14:28.560 --> 00:14:30.480
So the perception of the situation,

371
00:14:30.480 --> 00:14:31.680
even though there's a fire,

372
00:14:31.680 --> 00:14:35.040
I'm locked in context of I'm sitting in a restaurant.

373
00:14:36.080 --> 00:14:39.520
And that's been tested time and time again

374
00:14:39.520 --> 00:14:42.000
where people will sit in a smoke-filled room

375
00:14:42.000 --> 00:14:42.960
long enough to die

376
00:14:43.600 --> 00:14:45.200
just because nobody else is moving.

377
00:14:46.000 --> 00:14:47.360
So context matters.

378
00:14:47.920 --> 00:14:51.040
So how does that pertain to being able to persuade people

379
00:14:52.560 --> 00:14:53.760
for like, I don't know,

380
00:14:53.760 --> 00:14:55.360
Debian, Ohio?

381
00:14:55.360 --> 00:14:55.840
Yeah.

382
00:14:55.840 --> 00:14:56.560
Who's listening?

383
00:14:56.560 --> 00:14:56.880
Yeah.

384
00:14:56.880 --> 00:14:59.200
How does she work and think about context

385
00:14:59.200 --> 00:15:00.240
when she's in a sales meeting

386
00:15:00.240 --> 00:15:01.200
speaking to a husband,

387
00:15:01.200 --> 00:15:03.120
her son, whoever it might be?

388
00:15:03.120 --> 00:15:03.360
Yeah.

389
00:15:03.360 --> 00:15:05.760
So one of the best things that you can learn

390
00:15:05.760 --> 00:15:08.720
when it comes to being able to shift context

391
00:15:08.720 --> 00:15:11.600
is setting the frame of what every interaction is

392
00:15:11.600 --> 00:15:14.000
and being the one to openly say what the frame is

393
00:15:14.000 --> 00:15:15.200
as the conversation starts.

394
00:15:16.400 --> 00:15:17.840
Let's say you're talking to a kid

395
00:15:17.840 --> 00:15:19.440
and it's a parent talking to a kid.

396
00:15:19.920 --> 00:15:21.360
The kid thinks they're in trouble.

397
00:15:21.360 --> 00:15:22.960
That's the context they have.

398
00:15:22.960 --> 00:15:25.360
And I need to shift their perception of our situation

399
00:15:25.360 --> 00:15:26.960
before I can change their context.

400
00:15:27.680 --> 00:15:29.760
So we sit down, we start the conversation

401
00:15:29.760 --> 00:15:32.000
and I'm like, I'm so glad that we can have this talk

402
00:15:32.000 --> 00:15:35.600
in a calm way that is focused on learning

403
00:15:35.600 --> 00:15:36.640
instead of punishment.

404
00:15:37.200 --> 00:15:42.000
A massively transformed perception and context.

405
00:15:42.000 --> 00:15:44.160
So I've changed what this means

406
00:15:44.160 --> 00:15:46.320
and the definition of what's allowed here.

407
00:15:47.520 --> 00:15:51.280
So context gives us the final P, which is permission.

408
00:15:52.000 --> 00:15:54.880
So if I change your perception of a conversation

409
00:15:54.880 --> 00:15:56.240
and you can do that right away

410
00:15:56.880 --> 00:16:00.080
and if I'm entering into a negotiation

411
00:16:00.080 --> 00:16:01.840
and we start the room with,

412
00:16:01.840 --> 00:16:03.600
I'm glad that we could all come here for this

413
00:16:03.600 --> 00:16:05.840
and I know both of us want to find common ground

414
00:16:05.840 --> 00:16:06.960
as fast as possible.

415
00:16:06.960 --> 00:16:09.040
And I suggest that maybe we even start there.

416
00:16:09.920 --> 00:16:13.120
So I'm setting a frame right from the very beginning.

417
00:16:13.680 --> 00:16:15.840
It's so surprising how few of us do that

418
00:16:15.840 --> 00:16:17.280
when we go into a conversation.

419
00:16:17.280 --> 00:16:19.440
I was just thinking back over the last sort of

420
00:16:19.440 --> 00:16:21.520
10 days of my life in business meetings.

421
00:16:21.520 --> 00:16:23.200
Very important business meetings in Los Angeles

422
00:16:23.200 --> 00:16:25.840
with new potential partners

423
00:16:26.560 --> 00:16:28.080
and walking into the boardroom

424
00:16:28.080 --> 00:16:30.080
and sitting down and doing the formalities

425
00:16:30.080 --> 00:16:32.080
of like, oh, hi, how's the weather?

426
00:16:32.080 --> 00:16:32.640
Where'd you live?

427
00:16:32.640 --> 00:16:33.920
Oh, what's going on?

428
00:16:33.920 --> 00:16:36.640
And then a little bit of quiet, we introduce ourselves

429
00:16:37.440 --> 00:16:39.200
and nobody really sets the frame

430
00:16:39.200 --> 00:16:42.000
or someone sets the frame, but it isn't you.

431
00:16:42.000 --> 00:16:42.480
Yeah.

432
00:16:42.480 --> 00:16:45.680
And actually that meeting would have been much more productive

433
00:16:45.680 --> 00:16:48.640
if I had volunteered up a frame very early.

434
00:16:48.640 --> 00:16:50.160
And it was a frame in line

435
00:16:50.160 --> 00:16:51.840
with whatever I'm trying to get out of that meeting.

436
00:16:51.840 --> 00:16:52.080
Yeah.

437
00:16:52.880 --> 00:16:54.880
And anytime you're setting a frame

438
00:16:54.880 --> 00:16:57.520
or just kind of setting the perception of what's going on,

439
00:16:57.520 --> 00:17:00.240
especially in business, start up by a negative first

440
00:17:00.240 --> 00:17:03.280
because people bitch about stuff in business all the time.

441
00:17:03.840 --> 00:17:05.280
And then go to the positive.

442
00:17:05.280 --> 00:17:07.200
So you're doing kind of a contrasting statement.

443
00:17:07.200 --> 00:17:09.440
So like, let's say in the last meeting you had

444
00:17:09.440 --> 00:17:12.320
if you said something like, I'm so glad we're meeting today, guys.

445
00:17:12.320 --> 00:17:13.440
There's so many people out there

446
00:17:13.440 --> 00:17:15.920
that just fall into these competitive mindsets.

447
00:17:17.040 --> 00:17:19.440
And it's really good to do business with people

448
00:17:19.440 --> 00:17:21.200
that are in a collaborative mindset

449
00:17:21.200 --> 00:17:22.640
instead of a competitive mindset.

450
00:17:23.840 --> 00:17:26.240
With what you said, the frame that I wish I'd said

451
00:17:26.240 --> 00:17:28.400
based on all of the context,

452
00:17:28.400 --> 00:17:30.320
was I'd walked into that room wanting to get a deal done

453
00:17:30.320 --> 00:17:32.320
because I'm sick of fucking talking about it on emails

454
00:17:32.640 --> 00:17:34.720
and meetings, meetings, meetings, meetings, meetings.

455
00:17:34.720 --> 00:17:36.160
So I wish I'd walked in and said something,

456
00:17:36.160 --> 00:17:37.680
words to the effective,

457
00:17:37.680 --> 00:17:39.920
I'm so glad we could meet in person

458
00:17:39.920 --> 00:17:41.680
to finally really make progress on this

459
00:17:41.680 --> 00:17:45.600
because there's been so much talk about theoretical deals.

460
00:17:45.600 --> 00:17:46.800
And I feel like getting us together

461
00:17:46.800 --> 00:17:48.720
can get us much closer, much quicker

462
00:17:48.720 --> 00:17:52.080
to figuring out a real deal that we can work on.

463
00:17:52.080 --> 00:17:53.280
A words to that effect.

464
00:17:53.280 --> 00:17:55.120
Because I think that would have started the conversation

465
00:17:55.120 --> 00:17:58.320
away from the theoretical if I'd just called it out.

466
00:17:58.320 --> 00:18:00.080
But unfortunately, I didn't say that

467
00:18:00.160 --> 00:18:01.920
and we spent a lot of time just talking about

468
00:18:01.920 --> 00:18:03.360
theoretical stuff again.

469
00:18:03.360 --> 00:18:05.440
Yeah, and you can do that with permission.

470
00:18:05.440 --> 00:18:07.200
At the beginning with a permission phrase

471
00:18:07.200 --> 00:18:08.960
and just say, hey, just so I understand

472
00:18:08.960 --> 00:18:10.480
and I may be wrong here.

473
00:18:11.120 --> 00:18:13.840
But what I understand is the purpose of this meeting

474
00:18:13.840 --> 00:18:16.400
is for us to kind of compile all these zooms

475
00:18:16.400 --> 00:18:18.160
that we've been on for months and months

476
00:18:18.160 --> 00:18:20.960
and finally get something done and put a bow on it

477
00:18:21.600 --> 00:18:23.440
that we have some kind of finished product

478
00:18:23.440 --> 00:18:26.080
even if it's not perfect yet, we have something tangible.

479
00:18:27.760 --> 00:18:29.200
And that's permission.

480
00:18:29.200 --> 00:18:30.880
So you're like, now, I might be wrong about this.

481
00:18:30.880 --> 00:18:32.720
But of course, they'll probably agree with that.

482
00:18:33.440 --> 00:18:34.880
I think the same applies actually

483
00:18:34.880 --> 00:18:36.400
for romantic relationships.

484
00:18:36.400 --> 00:18:38.640
Thinking about how we argument with your partner.

485
00:18:38.640 --> 00:18:41.440
You can go in just emotion versus emotion.

486
00:18:41.440 --> 00:18:44.240
If you don't take a minute, just define.

487
00:18:44.240 --> 00:18:46.480
Define what we're trying to accomplish from this.

488
00:18:47.200 --> 00:18:48.720
And then when people drift

489
00:18:48.720 --> 00:18:50.240
because they do an emotional situation,

490
00:18:50.240 --> 00:18:51.920
you've got a frame to bring them back into

491
00:18:51.920 --> 00:18:52.880
that you pre-agreed on.

492
00:18:54.160 --> 00:18:55.440
You know, because when you get in this,

493
00:18:55.440 --> 00:18:57.280
they'll bring up something your mother did six,

494
00:18:57.600 --> 00:18:58.880
four years ago or something,

495
00:18:58.880 --> 00:19:01.440
and it just drifts away from the frame.

496
00:19:01.440 --> 00:19:02.240
Yeah.

497
00:19:02.240 --> 00:19:03.440
And if you watch the media,

498
00:19:04.560 --> 00:19:06.480
especially the opinion side of the media,

499
00:19:06.480 --> 00:19:08.640
and they talk about a politician that they don't like,

500
00:19:08.640 --> 00:19:09.920
what do they start out with?

501
00:19:09.920 --> 00:19:11.760
This is going to scare you.

502
00:19:12.480 --> 00:19:14.560
In another piece of terrifying news,

503
00:19:14.560 --> 00:19:17.120
here's what this guy did today up on the stage.

504
00:19:17.120 --> 00:19:18.560
This politician did.

505
00:19:18.560 --> 00:19:20.800
So they set the frame for it to be terrifying.

506
00:19:21.520 --> 00:19:23.840
They're setting up your perception from the very beginning.

507
00:19:24.560 --> 00:19:27.200
And then if I change the context,

508
00:19:28.560 --> 00:19:31.760
in one context, yeah, maybe this politician's a bad guy.

509
00:19:31.760 --> 00:19:36.080
Another context is this person is a threat to democracy.

510
00:19:37.600 --> 00:19:39.040
I've heard that phrase a lot.

511
00:19:39.040 --> 00:19:39.680
A lot.

512
00:19:39.680 --> 00:19:42.880
And what do we do to threats to our entire democracy?

513
00:19:42.880 --> 00:19:43.520
We kill them.

514
00:19:44.240 --> 00:19:46.960
So we start radicalizing people instantly

515
00:19:46.960 --> 00:19:50.640
without them really even processing that they're internalizing that.

516
00:19:51.280 --> 00:19:54.080
We were radicalizing people just through that context.

517
00:19:55.200 --> 00:19:58.080
So if you can modify perception and context,

518
00:19:58.080 --> 00:19:59.840
you can give someone that permission,

519
00:19:59.840 --> 00:20:01.600
that final piece to do anything.

520
00:20:01.600 --> 00:20:04.080
Let's go back to the police officer in the hypnosis show.

521
00:20:04.720 --> 00:20:07.840
He had the permission to start firing his firearm

522
00:20:07.840 --> 00:20:11.200
because of the context of being attacked by someone with a weapon.

523
00:20:12.560 --> 00:20:14.800
So once the context shift,

524
00:20:14.800 --> 00:20:17.120
your social permission of what I'm allowed to do,

525
00:20:17.120 --> 00:20:19.200
like I don't strip down and get naked in my office,

526
00:20:19.200 --> 00:20:21.600
but I do when I'm standing in front of a hot shower.

527
00:20:23.040 --> 00:20:25.440
That is the permission to do things differently.

528
00:20:26.240 --> 00:20:30.080
So if you want someone to do something that they normally wouldn't do,

529
00:20:30.080 --> 00:20:32.240
the question you ask yourself is,

530
00:20:32.240 --> 00:20:37.760
in what context would the decision I need this person to make be an automatic thing?

531
00:20:38.640 --> 00:20:42.720
If we agreed on 10 different things out of 11,

532
00:20:42.720 --> 00:20:46.560
then the automatic thing would be for us to assign an agreement together.

533
00:20:47.360 --> 00:20:49.600
Or if I'm being shot at,

534
00:20:49.600 --> 00:20:53.440
the automatic thing for me is to draw my weapon and fire back.

535
00:20:53.440 --> 00:20:55.680
So it's an automatic behavior based

536
00:20:56.320 --> 00:21:00.400
that typically in another situation would violate social permissions.

537
00:21:00.400 --> 00:21:03.520
Like I don't have social permission to behave in that way.

538
00:21:05.280 --> 00:21:07.760
I was reading about the story that you referenced.

539
00:21:07.760 --> 00:21:11.040
I think I found the one in December 1923.

540
00:21:11.040 --> 00:21:14.320
The New York Times reported on it regarding a tragedy in Croatia

541
00:21:14.320 --> 00:21:18.320
where an Austrian hypnosis ended up firing into the crowd

542
00:21:19.120 --> 00:21:23.120
and killed three people and wounded several others

543
00:21:23.760 --> 00:21:25.600
before he was snapped out of his trance.

544
00:21:26.480 --> 00:21:28.000
Upon realizing that he had done it,

545
00:21:28.000 --> 00:21:31.120
the officer reportedly arrested the hypnotist on the spot,

546
00:21:32.320 --> 00:21:34.880
which is strange to...

547
00:21:34.880 --> 00:21:36.480
That's called cognitive dissonally.

548
00:21:37.920 --> 00:21:39.120
Well, okay.

549
00:21:39.120 --> 00:21:41.120
So PCP, I understand that.

550
00:21:41.120 --> 00:21:42.880
One of the things I was thinking about is,

551
00:21:42.880 --> 00:21:45.120
is there any way for my audience listening now,

552
00:21:45.120 --> 00:21:48.800
based on everything you know about siops and the way that we're manipulated with media?

553
00:21:49.360 --> 00:21:55.520
Is there any way that we might be able to help them be more objective in a world

554
00:21:55.520 --> 00:21:58.000
that is trying to force them into one frame or the other?

555
00:21:58.560 --> 00:22:01.440
Because I'd, you know, as a podcast, this may be a selfish thing.

556
00:22:01.440 --> 00:22:02.800
I speak just so many different people.

557
00:22:03.680 --> 00:22:06.640
And I'm going to speak to someone on the right,

558
00:22:06.640 --> 00:22:09.280
someone on the left, up, down, left, right.

559
00:22:09.280 --> 00:22:12.480
I don't really, as long as I think I'm going to be able to have a conversation with them,

560
00:22:12.480 --> 00:22:15.600
I'm going to meet them as I find them and I'm going to have a conversation with them.

561
00:22:15.600 --> 00:22:17.760
And there's really no external pressure that's going to change that.

562
00:22:17.760 --> 00:22:18.560
Yeah, unfortunately.

563
00:22:18.560 --> 00:22:21.520
Like, I've had all the external pressure in the world and I'm not going to change that

564
00:22:21.520 --> 00:22:24.240
because I have to do this myself for a long period of time.

565
00:22:24.720 --> 00:22:29.360
So the thing that's going to keep me in love with this job is to be able to follow my curiosity

566
00:22:29.360 --> 00:22:32.160
and not be trapped by anyone else's pressure.

567
00:22:32.960 --> 00:22:35.600
But that requires your audience as well to be open-minded,

568
00:22:36.240 --> 00:22:39.520
which means that if I sit here with Kamala Harris or with Donald Trump,

569
00:22:40.960 --> 00:22:46.560
I want my audience to come into the conversation with as unopened mind as they possibly are able to.

570
00:22:46.560 --> 00:22:49.280
Let's talk about how to manipulate your next podcast guest

571
00:22:49.280 --> 00:22:51.040
and to be more open-minded.

572
00:22:51.040 --> 00:22:51.280
Okay.

573
00:22:51.920 --> 00:22:55.760
And this technique is something we teach called negative dissociation.

574
00:22:56.880 --> 00:22:58.160
And the way that it works is,

575
00:22:58.880 --> 00:23:02.880
I'll make a small, it should sound like an observation about the world.

576
00:23:03.440 --> 00:23:06.720
So in our discussion, let's say we just sat down and I'd say,

577
00:23:06.720 --> 00:23:08.480
you know what, I'm glad I'm interviewing you.

578
00:23:08.480 --> 00:23:14.160
There's a lot of people out there that are just so closed off and locked in these little rigid beliefs.

579
00:23:14.960 --> 00:23:19.200
And I'm not sure whether it is they're just terrified of what people are going to think about them

580
00:23:19.200 --> 00:23:25.760
if they step outside the lines or if they're scared of being open-minded for these other beliefs.

581
00:23:25.760 --> 00:23:29.920
I'm not sure which one it is, but I mean, you meet these people so often.

582
00:23:30.720 --> 00:23:31.760
And you're going to nod.

583
00:23:31.760 --> 00:23:35.920
You nodded your head while we were saying it because what I'm saying sounds true.

584
00:23:36.800 --> 00:23:37.840
It probably is.

585
00:23:38.480 --> 00:23:43.600
But you're making that person very covertly agree that they are not that person.

586
00:23:45.040 --> 00:23:45.680
That makes sense.

587
00:23:45.680 --> 00:23:46.640
That makes perfect sense.

588
00:23:46.640 --> 00:23:50.000
So throughout the conversation, what you're really doing is you're not getting

589
00:23:50.000 --> 00:23:52.400
into making an agreement about how they're going to act.

590
00:23:52.400 --> 00:23:55.600
You're getting them into making an agreement about who they are as a human being.

591
00:23:55.680 --> 00:24:01.840
So the moment you can get them to covertly make an IAM statement in their head,

592
00:24:01.840 --> 00:24:04.320
you're hacking your way into that person's identity.

593
00:24:05.760 --> 00:24:07.760
So like, let's say you said that, they nodded.

594
00:24:08.560 --> 00:24:12.240
And then maybe a few minutes later, you're like, I got a confession to make.

595
00:24:12.240 --> 00:24:14.480
You know, I had social anxiety growing up.

596
00:24:14.480 --> 00:24:17.360
How did you get this open about everything?

597
00:24:17.360 --> 00:24:18.480
Have you always been this way?

598
00:24:18.480 --> 00:24:22.720
Was this through some kind of like leadership training or something like that that you went to?

599
00:24:23.680 --> 00:24:28.000
And the moment you answer that question, I've got you to commit.

600
00:24:28.000 --> 00:24:32.720
Now you're fully committed to being wide open for the rest of the conversation.

601
00:24:32.720 --> 00:24:35.040
What would you assume they would then say in such a scenario?

602
00:24:35.040 --> 00:24:36.400
You're like, I don't know.

603
00:24:36.400 --> 00:24:38.160
I think I've always been really open.

604
00:24:38.160 --> 00:24:41.440
I haven't been really scared about what people think about me.

605
00:24:41.440 --> 00:24:43.520
And I've always tried to wear my heart on my sleeve.

606
00:24:43.520 --> 00:24:45.920
So now you're getting to make all these commitments.

607
00:24:45.920 --> 00:24:47.680
But they're going to be like that going forward.

608
00:24:47.680 --> 00:24:48.800
Yeah, okay.

609
00:24:48.800 --> 00:24:51.440
I mean, you're not permanently changing a human being.

610
00:24:52.160 --> 00:24:54.320
But it's a temporary change that they will make

611
00:24:54.320 --> 00:24:57.600
for one little compartment of an interaction with you.

612
00:24:57.600 --> 00:25:02.080
And is this because you're really, you're speaking to that, you said that identity,

613
00:25:02.800 --> 00:25:04.560
the sense of who they want to be.

614
00:25:05.440 --> 00:25:09.440
And that's heavily driven by social perception.

615
00:25:09.440 --> 00:25:10.240
It is.

616
00:25:10.240 --> 00:25:11.600
What I think of them.

617
00:25:11.600 --> 00:25:13.840
Yeah, but it's not that they want to be.

618
00:25:14.800 --> 00:25:16.880
It's who they say they are.

619
00:25:17.760 --> 00:25:18.640
And those are different.

620
00:25:19.600 --> 00:25:19.920
So,

621
00:25:22.080 --> 00:25:25.040
man, Bob Chaldeini's got a great example of this.

622
00:25:25.040 --> 00:25:27.680
They got these people, the stick signs in the yard.

623
00:25:27.680 --> 00:25:30.800
These giant ugly signs that say drive safe on them.

624
00:25:31.360 --> 00:25:35.440
And the way that they got this like 85% of this neighborhood

625
00:25:35.440 --> 00:25:37.280
just stabbed them into their yard.

626
00:25:37.280 --> 00:25:40.880
Nasty, stupid looking sign was a week prior.

627
00:25:41.600 --> 00:25:43.920
A week before they knocked on their door and they said,

628
00:25:43.920 --> 00:25:45.280
hey, I have a one question survey.

629
00:25:45.280 --> 00:25:46.320
It'll take 15 seconds.

630
00:25:46.320 --> 00:25:47.680
Do you support safe driving?

631
00:25:47.680 --> 00:25:48.240
Yes or no?

632
00:25:49.200 --> 00:25:51.120
Of course, everyone's going to say yes.

633
00:25:52.080 --> 00:25:55.120
And then, so now they've made a commitment about who they are.

634
00:25:55.120 --> 00:25:56.160
Do you support?

635
00:25:56.160 --> 00:25:57.920
So it's who are you as a person?

636
00:25:58.640 --> 00:26:00.560
And they said, all right, thank you so much for that.

637
00:26:00.560 --> 00:26:05.120
And just to show your support, could you put this tiny small sticker

638
00:26:05.120 --> 00:26:07.360
in the window of your house facing the street?

639
00:26:08.560 --> 00:26:09.520
And they're like, yeah, yeah.

640
00:26:09.520 --> 00:26:10.720
And they go stick it on the window.

641
00:26:11.360 --> 00:26:13.600
But they're more likely to do it because they just said yes.

642
00:26:14.480 --> 00:26:17.120
But anyone who said yes, I support safe driving.

643
00:26:17.440 --> 00:26:21.920
A week later, would stick that giant stupid looking sign

644
00:26:21.920 --> 00:26:22.720
in their front yard.

645
00:26:23.760 --> 00:26:26.240
And they double blinded this.

646
00:26:26.240 --> 00:26:29.040
They did it in another neighborhood where they didn't go door to door first.

647
00:26:29.040 --> 00:26:30.400
They just went door to door and said, hey,

648
00:26:30.400 --> 00:26:33.120
can we stab this giant ugly sign in your yard?

649
00:26:33.120 --> 00:26:36.320
And like 1% of people said yes.

650
00:26:36.320 --> 00:26:38.960
As opposed to like 85% in the other neighborhood.

651
00:26:39.760 --> 00:26:42.240
But it's a tiny agreement about who you are as a person.

652
00:26:42.800 --> 00:26:45.120
So this is the power of pre-committing.

653
00:26:45.120 --> 00:26:48.800
Getting someone to pre-commit to something before you ask them to do it.

654
00:26:48.800 --> 00:26:49.280
Yeah.

655
00:26:49.280 --> 00:26:52.480
And you get them to pre-commit in terms of their identity

656
00:26:52.480 --> 00:26:54.560
and who they think they are and who they want to be.

657
00:26:54.560 --> 00:26:55.200
Yeah.

658
00:26:55.200 --> 00:26:58.160
But you're not getting them, I'm not using this technique

659
00:26:58.160 --> 00:26:59.920
to make you sign a contract.

660
00:26:59.920 --> 00:27:01.760
I'm using it to just make subtle shifts

661
00:27:01.760 --> 00:27:03.440
in how you're behaving in our conversation.

662
00:27:04.160 --> 00:27:06.640
So if I wanted you to focus on me more,

663
00:27:06.640 --> 00:27:09.280
how do the opposite of the negative dissociation thing?

664
00:27:09.280 --> 00:27:10.880
And remember, I'm not talking about you.

665
00:27:11.600 --> 00:27:12.880
Because if I'm sitting here saying,

666
00:27:12.880 --> 00:27:15.920
oh, Steven, you play attention so well in a conversation.

667
00:27:15.920 --> 00:27:19.920
That sounds super weird and manipulative.

668
00:27:19.920 --> 00:27:21.040
People say that to me all the time.

669
00:27:21.680 --> 00:27:22.160
Yeah.

670
00:27:22.160 --> 00:27:23.760
Maybe they want you to.

671
00:27:24.720 --> 00:27:26.880
In reality, if I do the opposite

672
00:27:26.880 --> 00:27:28.960
of what that negative dissociation statement did.

673
00:27:29.680 --> 00:27:32.560
And I make a positive group of people

674
00:27:32.560 --> 00:27:34.240
and assign an attribute to them.

675
00:27:34.240 --> 00:27:35.360
So that's how you would do this.

676
00:27:36.400 --> 00:27:38.080
So it's like, you know, Steven, it's amazing.

677
00:27:38.080 --> 00:27:41.120
Every time I meet these really high performing CEOs,

678
00:27:41.760 --> 00:27:44.160
all of these Fortune 100 companies that I work with,

679
00:27:44.160 --> 00:27:45.520
you sit down with one of these CEOs.

680
00:27:45.520 --> 00:27:48.240
It's like they all have the exact same quality.

681
00:27:48.240 --> 00:27:51.280
You sit down with these people and they stop what they're doing

682
00:27:51.280 --> 00:27:52.960
and they just completely tune in

683
00:27:53.680 --> 00:27:55.120
to other people when they talk to them.

684
00:27:58.000 --> 00:28:00.800
So I'm taking a quality that I know you admire,

685
00:28:00.800 --> 00:28:03.200
like CEOs, all this kind of stuff.

686
00:28:03.760 --> 00:28:05.600
And I'm assigning a trait to that.

687
00:28:06.160 --> 00:28:07.280
And you're going to nod.

688
00:28:07.280 --> 00:28:09.920
And you're going to, that sounds kind of true.

689
00:28:10.000 --> 00:28:12.400
But it also means that you're agreeing that you are

690
00:28:12.400 --> 00:28:13.760
to also that type of person.

691
00:28:14.640 --> 00:28:16.320
But I'm never saying it about you.

692
00:28:17.040 --> 00:28:19.520
So this is, if I'm talking directly about you,

693
00:28:19.520 --> 00:28:22.400
which is what so many influence people teach out there.

694
00:28:22.400 --> 00:28:24.240
They're like, oh, I can tell that you this.

695
00:28:24.240 --> 00:28:26.320
Or I can tell that you're the kind of person

696
00:28:26.320 --> 00:28:27.840
that blank and blank and blank.

697
00:28:28.480 --> 00:28:30.240
This is called aiming language.

698
00:28:30.240 --> 00:28:32.720
My, my language is aimed at you.

699
00:28:32.720 --> 00:28:34.240
And you can feel it.

700
00:28:34.240 --> 00:28:37.120
And people can feel that there's something going on.

701
00:28:37.600 --> 00:28:39.920
Somebody's sitting there making guesses

702
00:28:39.920 --> 00:28:41.280
and weird assumptions about them.

703
00:28:41.920 --> 00:28:44.000
So anytime you're using any of these techniques,

704
00:28:44.000 --> 00:28:48.400
it should feel and sound like you're making an observation

705
00:28:48.400 --> 00:28:49.200
about the world.

706
00:28:50.080 --> 00:28:53.440
It's interesting how this sort of power of pre-commitment

707
00:28:53.440 --> 00:28:56.320
can also be used on yourself to get you to do things.

708
00:28:57.120 --> 00:28:57.600
Yeah.

709
00:28:57.600 --> 00:28:59.680
As you're saying, I was looking down at some research here.

710
00:28:59.680 --> 00:29:01.360
Then there's multiple studies that I find fascinating.

711
00:29:01.360 --> 00:29:04.800
One of them is a study conducted at MIT with students.

712
00:29:05.760 --> 00:29:09.600
They gave these MIT students three major papers for their semester.

713
00:29:09.600 --> 00:29:11.200
One class was given ultimate freedom.

714
00:29:11.200 --> 00:29:13.280
They could turn in all three papers

715
00:29:13.280 --> 00:29:15.520
at the very end of the semester with no penalty.

716
00:29:15.520 --> 00:29:17.520
The other class was forced to pre-commit,

717
00:29:17.520 --> 00:29:20.720
to strict evenly spaced deadlines throughout the semester.

718
00:29:20.720 --> 00:29:23.360
And the students who had total freedom performed the worst

719
00:29:23.360 --> 00:29:24.880
and experienced the most stress.

720
00:29:25.600 --> 00:29:28.640
The students who pre-committed to certain deadlines

721
00:29:28.640 --> 00:29:30.320
produced the highest quality work

722
00:29:30.320 --> 00:29:32.960
and gave the best work and got the best grades.

723
00:29:33.120 --> 00:29:34.720
It proved that essentially restricting

724
00:29:34.720 --> 00:29:37.120
our own future choices through pre-commitments

725
00:29:37.120 --> 00:29:39.120
is often the best way to beat procrastination.

726
00:29:39.120 --> 00:29:41.440
Now, I remember the study they did with people on a beach

727
00:29:41.440 --> 00:29:44.320
where they had a fake thief run past

728
00:29:44.320 --> 00:29:47.600
someone next to you on the beach and grab a radio

729
00:29:47.600 --> 00:29:50.400
and 20% of people would chase the person.

730
00:29:50.400 --> 00:29:53.520
But if someone had said to you in a different study

731
00:29:53.520 --> 00:29:55.360
where someone runs up grabs the radio

732
00:29:55.360 --> 00:29:56.880
but someone has said to you seconds earlier,

733
00:29:56.880 --> 00:29:58.560
hey, I'm just going to get an ice cream.

734
00:29:58.560 --> 00:29:59.520
Can you take a look?

735
00:29:59.520 --> 00:30:01.120
Can you just watch my stuff?

736
00:30:01.120 --> 00:30:04.240
95% of people would then chase the person

737
00:30:04.240 --> 00:30:06.480
stealing the radio because we've made a pre-commitment

738
00:30:06.480 --> 00:30:07.600
to another person.

739
00:30:07.600 --> 00:30:09.120
So pre-commitments can work with yourself

740
00:30:09.120 --> 00:30:13.120
or, you know, with others, which is fascinating

741
00:30:13.120 --> 00:30:16.400
because especially to yourself, I find that interesting

742
00:30:16.400 --> 00:30:18.320
that I can change my own behavior

743
00:30:18.320 --> 00:30:20.880
by making a pre-commitment attached to my own identity.

744
00:30:24.080 --> 00:30:25.280
I guess there's one more I'll share

745
00:30:25.280 --> 00:30:26.960
which is this study around savings.

746
00:30:26.960 --> 00:30:29.600
They found that people who committed to saving

747
00:30:29.680 --> 00:30:31.920
even if they wrote it on a piece of paper

748
00:30:31.920 --> 00:30:34.640
were up to five times in terms of percentage times.

749
00:30:34.640 --> 00:30:38.960
They went from saving 3% to saving 15%, roughly 15%,

750
00:30:38.960 --> 00:30:40.800
just because they had done a pre-commitment

751
00:30:40.800 --> 00:30:42.800
even years earlier that they would save.

752
00:30:44.080 --> 00:30:44.800
That's beautiful.

753
00:30:45.840 --> 00:30:47.040
I love that.

754
00:30:47.040 --> 00:30:50.160
And you're kind of just pre-doing your own identity.

755
00:30:51.200 --> 00:30:53.840
And if somebody wants to master that,

756
00:30:53.840 --> 00:30:56.880
you make it about your social commitment

757
00:30:56.880 --> 00:30:58.160
to yourself, to other people,

758
00:30:58.160 --> 00:31:02.160
but publicly say, like, I am this kind of person to yourself.

759
00:31:02.160 --> 00:31:04.960
So it's not like I'm going to go to the gym tomorrow.

760
00:31:04.960 --> 00:31:07.920
It's, I am the kind of person that goes to the gym

761
00:31:07.920 --> 00:31:12.880
is a much more powerful identity-based action.

762
00:31:13.760 --> 00:31:16.800
And identity is the number one thing in the world.

763
00:31:17.360 --> 00:31:19.280
When it comes to persuasion and influence,

764
00:31:19.920 --> 00:31:23.680
there's basically the way that I teach this to intelligence people

765
00:31:23.680 --> 00:31:25.920
is when you're good at influence,

766
00:31:25.920 --> 00:31:27.440
you're building two walls.

767
00:31:27.440 --> 00:31:29.040
One wall is anxiety,

768
00:31:29.040 --> 00:31:30.720
and the other one is cognitive dissonance.

769
00:31:31.840 --> 00:31:33.760
And the hallway that you're creating

770
00:31:33.760 --> 00:31:36.480
is the relief from those things.

771
00:31:36.480 --> 00:31:37.360
What are those two things?

772
00:31:37.360 --> 00:31:40.320
So I know anxiety is, but what's cognitive dissonance?

773
00:31:40.320 --> 00:31:43.280
Well, the anxiety is, like, if I don't do what I say,

774
00:31:43.280 --> 00:31:46.000
I'm going to have some, I'm going to face social rejection.

775
00:31:46.720 --> 00:31:51.440
Or if I go here and I break this rule or I don't do this,

776
00:31:51.440 --> 00:31:53.680
I'm going to break a social contract with somebody.

777
00:31:54.240 --> 00:31:57.840
The cognitive dissonance is, I am the kind of person that does this.

778
00:31:57.840 --> 00:32:02.320
And if I don't do this, I'm not keeping with who I said I am

779
00:32:02.320 --> 00:32:04.240
and who I agreed to be.

780
00:32:04.240 --> 00:32:05.840
And I'm facing cognitive dissonance.

781
00:32:06.560 --> 00:32:11.840
So that's like when some politician wins the presidential election

782
00:32:11.840 --> 00:32:13.040
that someone doesn't like.

783
00:32:13.840 --> 00:32:15.760
Like, you have that cognitive dissonance.

784
00:32:15.760 --> 00:32:19.680
Either A, I have to decide that, wow, a lot of people like this person

785
00:32:19.680 --> 00:32:21.440
or B, everyone's stupid.

786
00:32:22.240 --> 00:32:24.880
And it's a lot easier for me to just say everybody's stupid.

787
00:32:24.880 --> 00:32:26.160
And we always take that path.

788
00:32:26.800 --> 00:32:30.960
So cognitive dissonance means that it's bouncing them back into the hallway

789
00:32:30.960 --> 00:32:34.080
every time they bump up against something that they've previously agreed to.

790
00:32:35.040 --> 00:32:39.440
And identity is the way that you can hack your own behavior so fast.

791
00:32:39.440 --> 00:32:41.040
And the way that I explain this to people,

792
00:32:41.040 --> 00:32:42.880
it takes 30 seconds to understand it.

793
00:32:43.840 --> 00:32:50.160
If you were an Olympic athlete and you had a bad-ass body,

794
00:32:50.240 --> 00:32:54.400
like you had a healthy diet, everything was in perfect shape.

795
00:32:54.400 --> 00:32:57.280
You woke up every morning, you had great energy and all that stuff.

796
00:32:57.280 --> 00:33:01.200
And one day you woke up for some reason and you're 295 pounds.

797
00:33:03.200 --> 00:33:07.280
And you wake up, you look in the mirror, and this is something weird happened overnight.

798
00:33:09.040 --> 00:33:11.040
How fast would you get back to that body?

799
00:33:11.840 --> 00:33:16.320
It would be lightning, you may set world records for weight loss

800
00:33:17.200 --> 00:33:19.920
because your identity is with that body.

801
00:33:20.800 --> 00:33:24.560
It's not that, oh, I need to, I want to lose this weight so I can be healthy.

802
00:33:24.560 --> 00:33:26.480
It's this is not me.

803
00:33:27.520 --> 00:33:33.200
And anytime you're feeling this is not me or this is against my who I am as a person,

804
00:33:33.200 --> 00:33:38.000
it's the most powerful motivator when it comes to influencing other people and influencing

805
00:33:38.000 --> 00:33:38.480
ourselves.

806
00:33:38.560 --> 00:33:48.000
And like a goal, like a weight loss thing that I have a lot of my clients do is

807
00:33:48.000 --> 00:33:50.720
to download the face app.

808
00:33:51.360 --> 00:33:56.800
There's like an app that'll make you look super fat and real, real beast and print it off

809
00:33:56.800 --> 00:33:58.400
and put it on your refrigerator.

810
00:33:59.280 --> 00:34:03.040
And then people are like, well, aren't I programming my subconscious to be fat?

811
00:34:03.040 --> 00:34:08.160
Like, no, you're programmed to go away from bad things first.

812
00:34:08.720 --> 00:34:10.480
Never toward positive things first.

813
00:34:10.480 --> 00:34:11.280
It's always away.

814
00:34:11.920 --> 00:34:18.400
Your ancestors lived because they mistook a rock for a bear, not the other way around.

815
00:34:18.400 --> 00:34:19.680
Yeah, never the other way around.

816
00:34:20.240 --> 00:34:20.720
Yeah.

817
00:34:20.720 --> 00:34:24.640
So you're not going to accidentally program your brain and I'm the brain guy.

818
00:34:25.280 --> 00:34:30.560
But put that on the fridge and you start, you start hacking into your own identity.

819
00:34:30.560 --> 00:34:34.640
But you're doing it in a way that your mammalian brain, the thing that runs the show,

820
00:34:35.600 --> 00:34:38.000
can see it and understands it instantly.

821
00:34:38.000 --> 00:34:38.800
There's no words.

822
00:34:38.800 --> 00:34:41.040
There's no motivational phrases or anything like that.

823
00:34:41.600 --> 00:34:45.360
It picks up on it instantly and starts setting a course for because it's cognitive

824
00:34:45.360 --> 00:34:46.880
distance that you're creating for yourself.

825
00:34:46.880 --> 00:34:50.880
I remember near I.L., how I interviewed who wrote the book on procrastination,

826
00:34:50.880 --> 00:34:54.320
called indistractable said to me, a phrase that's always stayed with me.

827
00:34:54.320 --> 00:34:57.440
It's probably, you know, we spoke for six, seven hours, I think, me and near.

828
00:34:57.440 --> 00:34:58.880
It's just one phrase I always think about.

829
00:34:58.880 --> 00:35:01.680
He said that humans are discomfort avoiding creatures.

830
00:35:02.480 --> 00:35:05.760
And like we think that we're pleasure seeking creatures.

831
00:35:06.320 --> 00:35:09.200
But when he said discomfort avoiding, I really like interrogated him.

832
00:35:09.200 --> 00:35:10.720
I was like, yeah, but what about like horniness?

833
00:35:11.360 --> 00:35:12.880
That makes me have sex.

834
00:35:12.880 --> 00:35:16.080
And he was like, well, actually, that horniness is a form of discomfort.

835
00:35:16.080 --> 00:35:18.640
Your body is sending you this sort of almost irritation,

836
00:35:18.640 --> 00:35:19.920
which is making you take an action.

837
00:35:19.920 --> 00:35:21.920
And I stress tested it across many areas of my life.

838
00:35:21.920 --> 00:35:23.120
I was like, actually, he's right.

839
00:35:24.240 --> 00:35:25.920
I'm trying to avoid discomfort.

840
00:35:25.920 --> 00:35:27.920
And in your example of seeing myself on the fridge,

841
00:35:28.880 --> 00:35:31.360
yeah, I would, I would want to avoid that.

842
00:35:31.360 --> 00:35:33.200
It would cause such dissonance to my identity

843
00:35:33.200 --> 00:35:35.200
that I would do everything to avoid that feeling.

844
00:35:35.200 --> 00:35:37.680
I'm being fed, Stephen, on the arm of the fridge.

845
00:35:37.680 --> 00:35:40.480
Yeah, I mean, that's actually, every couple of years,

846
00:35:40.480 --> 00:35:43.440
what gets me back in shape is like catching myself in the mirror.

847
00:35:44.080 --> 00:35:45.440
Or because I'm always on camera.

848
00:35:46.960 --> 00:35:49.520
Sometimes I don't see myself kind of getting out of shape.

849
00:35:49.520 --> 00:35:52.160
And then I watch the podcast back and I'm like, oh, fuck.

850
00:35:52.160 --> 00:35:54.000
Yeah, like Jack didn't tell me.

851
00:35:54.560 --> 00:35:55.440
No one's told me.

852
00:35:56.400 --> 00:35:58.400
And then I'm like, right, Jim, every day again.

853
00:35:58.400 --> 00:36:00.320
And yeah, interesting.

854
00:36:00.320 --> 00:36:02.080
And it's social because you're, I mean,

855
00:36:02.080 --> 00:36:04.000
you're making this commitment in front of a million people.

856
00:36:04.480 --> 00:36:04.800
Yeah.

857
00:36:05.520 --> 00:36:06.880
What else do you think is important to know?

858
00:36:06.880 --> 00:36:08.320
As we head into this AI world,

859
00:36:08.320 --> 00:36:10.160
do I human skills and people skills

860
00:36:10.160 --> 00:36:11.120
going to be more important than other?

861
00:36:11.120 --> 00:36:12.640
What other frameworks have you got for me

862
00:36:12.640 --> 00:36:14.960
that I should bear in mind or ideas?

863
00:36:16.320 --> 00:36:18.800
As we go into AI, your leadership style,

864
00:36:18.800 --> 00:36:21.520
everyone's leadership style needs to be front and center.

865
00:36:21.520 --> 00:36:24.320
And I know there's a lot of books out there

866
00:36:24.480 --> 00:36:26.720
that are technically about leadership

867
00:36:26.720 --> 00:36:29.040
or, but I think they're about management

868
00:36:29.040 --> 00:36:31.120
and they call themselves a leadership book.

869
00:36:31.120 --> 00:36:33.360
When I teach what's most important,

870
00:36:33.360 --> 00:36:34.800
when it comes to understanding ourselves

871
00:36:34.800 --> 00:36:36.400
is developing authority.

872
00:36:36.400 --> 00:36:39.040
But that authority has those five traits of authority.

873
00:36:39.040 --> 00:36:40.880
This is confidence, discipline,

874
00:36:40.880 --> 00:36:42.480
leadership, gratitude and enjoyment.

875
00:36:43.360 --> 00:36:45.440
Do you do show notes where people can download stuff

876
00:36:45.440 --> 00:36:46.240
in the description?

877
00:36:46.240 --> 00:36:48.800
Yeah, sometimes I'll send, I'll send this inventory to you

878
00:36:48.800 --> 00:36:50.560
where people can take this quiz.

879
00:36:50.560 --> 00:36:53.200
And it's, it's the most revealing thing

880
00:36:53.200 --> 00:36:54.400
about your leadership power.

881
00:36:55.760 --> 00:36:57.680
But what people tend to do is seek out

882
00:36:57.680 --> 00:36:59.200
the wrong type of authority.

883
00:37:00.240 --> 00:37:03.040
Learn this with 20 years of working with people

884
00:37:04.160 --> 00:37:07.760
that we will tend to seek one of these little avenues

885
00:37:07.760 --> 00:37:09.760
that looks a certain way

886
00:37:09.760 --> 00:37:11.280
because we think that's what leadership

887
00:37:11.280 --> 00:37:12.240
is supposed to look like.

888
00:37:12.240 --> 00:37:14.080
That's what authority is supposed to look like.

889
00:37:14.800 --> 00:37:16.000
But there are three types

890
00:37:16.720 --> 00:37:19.600
and the three types that I've broken them down into

891
00:37:19.600 --> 00:37:21.840
and how authority channels to other people

892
00:37:21.840 --> 00:37:24.240
because authority looks different in different people.

893
00:37:24.240 --> 00:37:25.200
So it's the president,

894
00:37:26.560 --> 00:37:29.040
the professor and the artist.

895
00:37:30.880 --> 00:37:32.400
And we can have that authority.

896
00:37:32.400 --> 00:37:35.200
So like the artist, you can think like somebody like Johnny Depp,

897
00:37:35.760 --> 00:37:39.040
the president, you can think somebody like Obama,

898
00:37:39.680 --> 00:37:42.080
the professor, you can think of like the classic movie,

899
00:37:43.040 --> 00:37:45.040
professor, it's still broadcast authority,

900
00:37:45.040 --> 00:37:47.600
but it's not loud, it's not extremely directive.

901
00:37:48.320 --> 00:37:50.720
And the artist can hold a ton of attention

902
00:37:51.600 --> 00:37:53.840
and in some rooms doesn't hold any attention at all.

903
00:37:54.800 --> 00:37:57.600
The authority is still there, the attention isn't.

904
00:37:58.240 --> 00:37:59.760
For somebody that's super calm,

905
00:38:00.640 --> 00:38:02.640
even if they're the CEO of a company,

906
00:38:02.640 --> 00:38:04.000
they might be the professor

907
00:38:04.640 --> 00:38:08.080
and the whole time, their idea of what leadership looks like

908
00:38:08.080 --> 00:38:09.360
is this president.

909
00:38:10.400 --> 00:38:12.400
So they're faking their way into this thing

910
00:38:12.400 --> 00:38:13.600
and it never feels real.

911
00:38:13.600 --> 00:38:16.480
They still, like even though their authority is really high,

912
00:38:16.480 --> 00:38:18.640
they have this weird feeling of inauthenticity

913
00:38:18.720 --> 00:38:21.520
because they're pushing towards the wrong authority channel.

914
00:38:22.240 --> 00:38:23.360
What's the cost of that?

915
00:38:24.400 --> 00:38:27.120
I think that it detracts from your level of authority,

916
00:38:27.120 --> 00:38:29.680
which automatically means that you're getting less outcomes

917
00:38:29.680 --> 00:38:30.720
that you want in life.

918
00:38:30.720 --> 00:38:33.280
Because you're inauthenticity to both others and yourself,

919
00:38:35.520 --> 00:38:36.720
like pays a toll on you.

920
00:38:36.720 --> 00:38:38.640
So if I'm inauthentic to you,

921
00:38:38.640 --> 00:38:39.920
then that's going to help my authority.

922
00:38:39.920 --> 00:38:41.360
But then if I'm inauthentic to myself,

923
00:38:41.360 --> 00:38:43.760
it's going to help my happiness, I guess.

924
00:38:44.400 --> 00:38:44.880
Yeah.

925
00:38:44.880 --> 00:38:46.400
I'm going to feel like I'm, again,

926
00:38:46.400 --> 00:38:47.600
going back to your point about identity.

927
00:38:47.760 --> 00:38:48.800
Unfulfilled life.

928
00:38:48.800 --> 00:38:49.920
Yeah.

929
00:38:49.920 --> 00:38:52.560
And I think when people say authenticity,

930
00:38:52.560 --> 00:38:57.200
we should note that what most people call authenticity

931
00:38:57.200 --> 00:39:00.480
is a costume of childhood beliefs.

932
00:39:01.200 --> 00:39:03.680
Like my authentic self and how I act is

933
00:39:03.680 --> 00:39:05.760
typically what I was in childhood,

934
00:39:05.760 --> 00:39:08.960
how I deal with conflict, how I make friends, how I stay safe.

935
00:39:08.960 --> 00:39:11.200
All these little patterns that I learned when I was eight or nine,

936
00:39:11.200 --> 00:39:12.640
I'm still repeating a lot of that stuff.

937
00:39:13.200 --> 00:39:14.640
So when we say authenticity,

938
00:39:14.640 --> 00:39:17.120
it's always important to think that

939
00:39:18.000 --> 00:39:21.600
it's authenticity plus a removal of ego

940
00:39:22.480 --> 00:39:25.840
and a willingness to receive social injury.

941
00:39:25.840 --> 00:39:30.000
And that's the best way that I've ever been able to describe that to somebody.

942
00:39:30.000 --> 00:39:32.800
Like if I'm being authentic in a conversation,

943
00:39:32.800 --> 00:39:36.480
then I'm willing to receive a social injury for it.

944
00:39:37.280 --> 00:39:39.360
Kerry Sanchez said something to me, which has stayed with me.

945
00:39:39.360 --> 00:39:41.040
She said, again, I'm going to put trip.

946
00:39:41.040 --> 00:39:42.480
But what's the effect of

947
00:39:43.440 --> 00:39:46.400
I won't be friends with anyone in private

948
00:39:46.400 --> 00:39:50.240
that won't say something in public that will cost them something.

949
00:39:52.240 --> 00:39:54.320
And going to the point of our social injury,

950
00:39:54.320 --> 00:39:56.560
I think what Kerry's actually saying is like,

951
00:39:56.560 --> 00:39:58.880
that's how I know that they're authentic.

952
00:39:58.880 --> 00:40:03.120
Is there willing to risk something for something they believe?

953
00:40:03.120 --> 00:40:03.920
Yeah.

954
00:40:03.920 --> 00:40:06.080
I also think this is how you know a brand's authentic.

955
00:40:06.720 --> 00:40:10.880
Like are they willing to call social injury in the near term

956
00:40:10.960 --> 00:40:12.800
for something they believe in the long term?

957
00:40:12.800 --> 00:40:13.440
Yeah.

958
00:40:13.440 --> 00:40:14.400
You know?

959
00:40:14.400 --> 00:40:15.520
Yeah.

960
00:40:15.520 --> 00:40:17.280
And a lot of what,

961
00:40:17.280 --> 00:40:20.720
a lot of the recent brand debacles that we've had

962
00:40:21.680 --> 00:40:25.440
is they thought they were doing something to avoid social injury

963
00:40:25.440 --> 00:40:27.600
that caused a massive social injury.

964
00:40:27.600 --> 00:40:30.720
Because people said you're not being authentic to your audience.

965
00:40:30.720 --> 00:40:31.520
Yeah.

966
00:40:31.520 --> 00:40:34.800
Yeah. When they tried to do like get into identity politics and stuff like that.

967
00:40:34.800 --> 00:40:35.760
Yeah.

968
00:40:35.760 --> 00:40:38.960
Okay, like extreme virtue signaling and stuff like that.

969
00:40:38.960 --> 00:40:39.600
Yeah.

970
00:40:40.560 --> 00:40:43.200
Can we go into this childhood development thing really quick?

971
00:40:43.200 --> 00:40:44.880
I think it's super important for people to know.

972
00:40:44.880 --> 00:40:45.360
Sure.

973
00:40:45.360 --> 00:40:47.200
And I'm a behavior profiler.

974
00:40:47.200 --> 00:40:49.920
And if anybody listening didn't know that.

975
00:40:50.720 --> 00:40:52.800
And one of the things that I teach everybody

976
00:40:52.800 --> 00:40:55.440
is this thing called the childhood development triangle.

977
00:40:55.440 --> 00:40:57.280
So it's just three sides of this triangle.

978
00:40:58.080 --> 00:40:59.360
So when you're growing up,

979
00:41:00.160 --> 00:41:04.960
what did that child have to do most of the time to earn and keep friends?

980
00:41:04.960 --> 00:41:06.080
So friends is one.

981
00:41:06.640 --> 00:41:08.960
And then to feel safe.

982
00:41:08.960 --> 00:41:11.200
What did the kid have to do to feel safe?

983
00:41:11.200 --> 00:41:13.200
For some kids, safety was like,

984
00:41:14.640 --> 00:41:16.800
I don't know, somebody gives me a hug at the end of the day.

985
00:41:16.800 --> 00:41:17.840
For some kids, it was like,

986
00:41:17.840 --> 00:41:19.600
am I going to eat today?

987
00:41:20.400 --> 00:41:22.640
For some kids, it's like cracking jokes.

988
00:41:22.640 --> 00:41:23.120
Yeah.

989
00:41:23.120 --> 00:41:25.600
And I'm going to crack jokes and keep friends.

990
00:41:25.600 --> 00:41:28.240
I'm going to feel safe by becoming really loud

991
00:41:29.280 --> 00:41:30.640
and dominating the room.

992
00:41:30.640 --> 00:41:33.280
I'm going to become safe by getting really small and shrinking.

993
00:41:33.280 --> 00:41:34.560
So nobody notices me.

994
00:41:35.520 --> 00:41:38.000
Or I'm going to become safe by being hyper-vigilant

995
00:41:38.000 --> 00:41:41.040
because I don't know if dad drank before he got home

996
00:41:41.040 --> 00:41:42.880
or if he's going to start drinking when he got home.

997
00:41:43.600 --> 00:41:49.200
So it's like, what are the scripts that that child needed to run on autopilot

998
00:41:49.200 --> 00:41:52.400
to feel safe, to make friends, and then to get rewards?

999
00:41:53.040 --> 00:41:54.320
And that would be the third side.

1000
00:41:54.880 --> 00:41:57.920
And the rewards for some kids might just be like appreciation.

1001
00:41:57.920 --> 00:42:00.960
And it's typically just appreciation, affection, love.

1002
00:42:01.920 --> 00:42:06.000
And that tends to get written in childhood.

1003
00:42:06.000 --> 00:42:10.160
And the kid who writes all these permanent scripts,

1004
00:42:10.160 --> 00:42:13.120
they put them in a backpack and carry them all the way into adulthood.

1005
00:42:14.160 --> 00:42:18.240
And 90% of us are walking around with this exact triangle

1006
00:42:18.960 --> 00:42:19.920
governing our life.

1007
00:42:19.920 --> 00:42:22.240
And if you look around at people at work,

1008
00:42:22.240 --> 00:42:25.440
you see this woman who every time there's a meeting,

1009
00:42:26.240 --> 00:42:28.880
she wants to speak up a lot, but then she shuts her mouth

1010
00:42:28.960 --> 00:42:31.120
and her body shuts down and all that kind of stuff.

1011
00:42:31.120 --> 00:42:35.120
You're seeing an eight-year-old who got yelled at a family dinner table.

1012
00:42:36.080 --> 00:42:38.560
That's all, but you're just seeing it in a grown-up body.

1013
00:42:39.040 --> 00:42:41.520
I have two examples that a super friend of mine

1014
00:42:41.520 --> 00:42:44.320
that completely align with what you've just said.

1015
00:42:44.320 --> 00:42:45.760
I have two colleagues that I work with.

1016
00:42:46.240 --> 00:42:48.640
And I got six months into working with one of them.

1017
00:42:48.640 --> 00:42:51.040
And I can always tell that there was something not quite right

1018
00:42:51.040 --> 00:42:55.440
because whenever I was in the room, they would stare at me a lot.

1019
00:42:56.080 --> 00:43:02.240
And they would be a little bit more on the pessimistic side than I'm used to.

1020
00:43:02.800 --> 00:43:05.280
And one day at dinner, I was talking to them about their childhood,

1021
00:43:05.280 --> 00:43:10.160
and they offered up that their dad was his mood could change rapidly.

1022
00:43:10.720 --> 00:43:14.160
And he was always pointing out why something would never work.

1023
00:43:14.160 --> 00:43:16.000
And he was an extreme pessimist.

1024
00:43:16.000 --> 00:43:19.840
And suddenly this person, who is in my life, suddenly made sense.

1025
00:43:19.840 --> 00:43:23.200
I completely understand it because you grew up in that environment where to be safe,

1026
00:43:23.680 --> 00:43:28.560
you agree with it, had to pay attention to the authority figure.

1027
00:43:29.200 --> 00:43:37.120
And then, yeah, you had to also, you learnt maybe that pessimism was a way to safety.

1028
00:43:37.120 --> 00:43:39.680
And then there's another colleague who's actually in the room over there.

1029
00:43:39.680 --> 00:43:42.400
And I'll ask her before we publish this if I can say this publicly.

1030
00:43:42.400 --> 00:43:47.680
But some other thing, she expressed to me that she had a dad that his mood would change rapidly.

1031
00:43:47.680 --> 00:43:50.640
And I said to her one day, I said, I call her Sarah.

1032
00:43:50.640 --> 00:43:51.920
I said, Sarah, you're always staring at me.

1033
00:43:51.920 --> 00:43:54.480
It's like, whenever I look at you, you're only looking at me.

1034
00:43:55.360 --> 00:43:58.080
And it's like you're like overanalyzing and overthinking.

1035
00:43:58.080 --> 00:43:59.280
And she explained to me the same thing.

1036
00:43:59.280 --> 00:44:02.560
She said, when I grew up, my dad's mood would just change like this.

1037
00:44:02.560 --> 00:44:06.480
So every time I'm preempting, I'm like a radical preemptor.

1038
00:44:06.480 --> 00:44:09.120
I'm thinking 20 steps ahead of what might go wrong,

1039
00:44:09.120 --> 00:44:11.840
or, you know, which makes her exceptional at her job.

1040
00:44:12.320 --> 00:44:15.840
But I would, you know, one way to assume that that comes at some kind of cost.

1041
00:44:15.840 --> 00:44:16.640
Yeah.

1042
00:44:16.640 --> 00:44:17.520
So safety.

1043
00:44:17.920 --> 00:44:18.800
Very true.

1044
00:44:18.800 --> 00:44:19.520
Very true.

1045
00:44:19.520 --> 00:44:22.960
And the way that I explained this, if somebody wants to like,

1046
00:44:23.680 --> 00:44:26.880
it's not where you can kind of go back and like sit there for five minutes,

1047
00:44:26.880 --> 00:44:29.520
put it on a post and note and then figure your whole life out.

1048
00:44:29.520 --> 00:44:31.920
I wish I had a trick to do that.

1049
00:44:32.560 --> 00:44:36.080
But the way that like, I want people to think about this is,

1050
00:44:36.960 --> 00:44:39.360
going back to your childhood, a lot of those things,

1051
00:44:39.360 --> 00:44:42.320
this is just contracts that were written in a child's voice.

1052
00:44:43.360 --> 00:44:46.880
And when you start hearing these patterns repeating in your head,

1053
00:44:46.880 --> 00:44:51.440
force yourself to hear the voice of a kid, that's all it is.

1054
00:44:51.440 --> 00:44:54.000
It's just a kid who made these choices.

1055
00:44:54.000 --> 00:44:54.960
It's not an adult.

1056
00:44:56.000 --> 00:44:58.720
So we're typically three different people, all of us.

1057
00:44:59.440 --> 00:45:02.800
We have a work self, like a professional kind of self.

1058
00:45:02.800 --> 00:45:05.920
We have a home self, and we have a self with friends.

1059
00:45:07.520 --> 00:45:11.920
And what is that as a kid that's classroom playground home?

1060
00:45:13.040 --> 00:45:16.400
So I'll typically take people through this process of,

1061
00:45:16.400 --> 00:45:19.840
where were you around authority figures, which is like classroom or home?

1062
00:45:20.400 --> 00:45:22.800
What were you around when you're all your friends were around?

1063
00:45:22.800 --> 00:45:25.520
You got made fun of or you had to become really small.

1064
00:45:25.520 --> 00:45:28.800
And that goes on the friends side of the triangle.

1065
00:45:28.800 --> 00:45:32.560
And that talks about how the social patterns that are going to show up for me.

1066
00:45:33.360 --> 00:45:36.720
And somebody says, well, I keep attracting these negative people into my life.

1067
00:45:37.520 --> 00:45:38.480
Why do I do that?

1068
00:45:38.480 --> 00:45:40.400
And that goes to these patterns.

1069
00:45:40.400 --> 00:45:42.720
Because if I do this, I know this is going to happen.

1070
00:45:42.720 --> 00:45:43.760
I know that's going to happen.

1071
00:45:43.760 --> 00:45:45.600
It's just completing a story archetype.

1072
00:45:46.800 --> 00:45:49.600
So that's the childhood development triangle.

1073
00:45:49.600 --> 00:45:53.520
And it is really powerful to start understanding our own patterns.

1074
00:45:53.520 --> 00:45:56.480
And I'm not saying that you can go out there and there's like,

1075
00:45:56.480 --> 00:45:59.840
here's six steps that are going to change your whole freaking life.

1076
00:45:59.840 --> 00:46:04.400
If you do these six things, the awareness is what you want.

1077
00:46:04.400 --> 00:46:08.240
You want massive, like self-knowledge and self-awareness.

1078
00:46:09.120 --> 00:46:14.160
With the side agreement of, I am not special.

1079
00:46:14.720 --> 00:46:17.200
And I'm completely okay if I'm never understood.

1080
00:46:18.080 --> 00:46:22.160
Because most of what happens when we get into arguments with our spouse,

1081
00:46:22.160 --> 00:46:25.360
we get into these bitchy arguments with people at work,

1082
00:46:26.480 --> 00:46:32.160
it's our argument to be understood more than it is for us to come to a solution.

1083
00:46:32.160 --> 00:46:33.760
I need you to understand me.

1084
00:46:34.720 --> 00:46:38.960
So getting okay with the idea that you might never ever be understood

1085
00:46:38.960 --> 00:46:42.400
is like step number one, number two, I am not special.

1086
00:46:43.600 --> 00:46:46.960
And that helps us to open the door to start coming into a lot of these things.

1087
00:46:47.600 --> 00:46:52.160
But if you're a leader at work, you can start seeing these patterns in your employees.

1088
00:46:52.160 --> 00:46:55.120
And you can be like, I see an eight year old there.

1089
00:46:55.120 --> 00:46:59.760
And if you get to a point where you're seeing some of these behaviors that might have pissed you off

1090
00:46:59.760 --> 00:47:01.840
and somebody that works for you and you're like, wait a second.

1091
00:47:02.640 --> 00:47:08.000
Now I can see exactly what's going on because this, this, and this probably happened.

1092
00:47:08.000 --> 00:47:12.080
You don't need to make some prediction or fortune telling thing about their childhood,

1093
00:47:12.080 --> 00:47:14.160
but you're starting to see these patterns.

1094
00:47:14.160 --> 00:47:17.520
And you know now how your team is going to respond in conflict.

1095
00:47:18.080 --> 00:47:22.560
And if it's a conflict and it's social, you're seeing all their friends patterns.

1096
00:47:22.560 --> 00:47:24.960
If it's a conflict and somebody might be losing their job,

1097
00:47:24.960 --> 00:47:28.000
you're going to see their safety patterns come out and you'll see your own.

1098
00:47:28.000 --> 00:47:30.160
So do you think I should go to the key people in my life?

1099
00:47:30.160 --> 00:47:34.800
Maybe my team and also these questions about around how did you make friends?

1100
00:47:35.520 --> 00:47:36.320
Is that the question?

1101
00:47:37.120 --> 00:47:38.640
What did you do to make and keep friends?

1102
00:47:38.640 --> 00:47:40.480
What did you do to make and keep friends?

1103
00:47:40.480 --> 00:47:42.080
And what was the safety question again?

1104
00:47:42.080 --> 00:47:45.840
Like what, what did you need to do or avoid to feel safe?

1105
00:47:46.720 --> 00:47:48.080
And the rewards one?

1106
00:47:48.720 --> 00:47:52.080
What did you feel, and this one's always you want to put the word feel in there?

1107
00:47:52.080 --> 00:47:54.240
What did you feel like you had to do to earn rewards?

1108
00:47:54.240 --> 00:47:55.680
And what were rewards to you?

1109
00:47:55.680 --> 00:47:56.160
Okay.

1110
00:47:56.160 --> 00:48:00.480
It was appreciation or somebody that's like hyper significance driven.

1111
00:48:00.480 --> 00:48:01.920
Like I've got to have the Rolex.

1112
00:48:01.920 --> 00:48:04.000
I've got to have the Ferraris and all this kind of stuff.

1113
00:48:04.720 --> 00:48:08.720
They never got rewards because their parents ignored them

1114
00:48:08.720 --> 00:48:10.880
unless they brought home a certificate.

1115
00:48:10.880 --> 00:48:12.880
Their teacher called and said they did a good job.

1116
00:48:12.880 --> 00:48:15.360
They played the piano recital and did a great job.

1117
00:48:15.360 --> 00:48:18.240
And lots of people were acknowledging them and clapping for them.

1118
00:48:18.240 --> 00:48:21.600
They only got acknowledged when they were socially significant.

1119
00:48:21.600 --> 00:48:23.840
And I'm alright in thinking here that these are fundamentally

1120
00:48:23.840 --> 00:48:27.920
interlinked in many ways because when you're talking about safety,

1121
00:48:27.920 --> 00:48:31.440
I was running through my head the things that made me feel safe

1122
00:48:31.440 --> 00:48:34.960
and they were rewards that I could tell my friends about.

1123
00:48:34.960 --> 00:48:35.680
Yeah.

1124
00:48:35.680 --> 00:48:38.000
So I like, I touched all three of them.

1125
00:48:38.000 --> 00:48:40.800
And in part, because we, you know, I was thinking I was very different

1126
00:48:40.800 --> 00:48:42.400
to my social group when I was younger.

1127
00:48:42.400 --> 00:48:43.680
We were the Black family.

1128
00:48:43.680 --> 00:48:45.600
There wasn't another Black family that I knew of.

1129
00:48:46.880 --> 00:48:48.800
Other than maybe one other kid I think in the area,

1130
00:48:48.800 --> 00:48:50.800
in Plymouth in 1990, four or five.

1131
00:48:51.760 --> 00:48:54.720
So some of the material things I wanted,

1132
00:48:54.720 --> 00:48:57.840
like the shoes that everyone had, made me feel safe

1133
00:48:57.840 --> 00:48:59.280
because they made me fit in.

1134
00:48:59.280 --> 00:48:59.760
Yeah.

1135
00:48:59.760 --> 00:49:02.240
And that got me friends.

1136
00:49:02.240 --> 00:49:03.280
Yeah, race I thought it did.

1137
00:49:04.000 --> 00:49:06.640
So for me, it really was like an interconnected triangle.

1138
00:49:06.640 --> 00:49:06.960
Yeah.

1139
00:49:06.960 --> 00:49:08.960
That's just one of many examples that I could think of.

1140
00:49:08.960 --> 00:49:10.160
It does tend to do that.

1141
00:49:10.160 --> 00:49:13.600
And I will typically wait for somebody to figure that out.

1142
00:49:13.600 --> 00:49:15.840
And as they're filling it out, they're kind of like,

1143
00:49:15.840 --> 00:49:17.600
oh, I did this because of this to get to this.

1144
00:49:18.320 --> 00:49:20.640
And you'll see a little cycle start happening.

1145
00:49:21.600 --> 00:49:22.880
But it's great for self-knowledge.

1146
00:49:22.880 --> 00:49:26.160
But if you're a behavior profiler, that's what's going to run people.

1147
00:49:26.160 --> 00:49:28.160
You're going to know how they're going to respond to conflict.

1148
00:49:28.880 --> 00:49:30.800
You're going to know what they're going to avoid.

1149
00:49:30.800 --> 00:49:33.120
You're going to like, if you're putting teams together,

1150
00:49:33.120 --> 00:49:35.760
I know what people I want to have working with each other.

1151
00:49:35.760 --> 00:49:39.440
And it doesn't have to be some complex nine hour thing.

1152
00:49:39.440 --> 00:49:42.080
Like you can see this stuff in everyday life.

1153
00:49:42.080 --> 00:49:45.280
And you're not saying that I need to radically change.

1154
00:49:45.280 --> 00:49:45.520
No.

1155
00:49:46.480 --> 00:49:50.880
But what if one part of this triangle or one behavior I've learned

1156
00:49:50.880 --> 00:49:54.560
for safety or for rewards or for friends is making my life worse?

1157
00:49:55.920 --> 00:49:56.240
Yeah.

1158
00:49:56.240 --> 00:49:57.920
You know, it could be ruining my life.

1159
00:49:57.920 --> 00:50:01.360
Like it could be the thing standing in the way of me having a romantic relationship

1160
00:50:01.360 --> 00:50:03.920
or getting promotion or building a business.

1161
00:50:03.920 --> 00:50:05.280
It's like getting in the way now.

1162
00:50:05.280 --> 00:50:05.760
Yeah.

1163
00:50:05.760 --> 00:50:06.400
What do I do, Chase?

1164
00:50:07.040 --> 00:50:09.200
So you've identified the pattern.

1165
00:50:09.200 --> 00:50:10.960
Let's assume that you've got it.

1166
00:50:10.960 --> 00:50:13.840
You're like, oh, I've got this shit that's happening on repeat.

1167
00:50:14.800 --> 00:50:19.440
The part two of this is I need to focus on that being a kid.

1168
00:50:20.560 --> 00:50:22.240
That belongs to a child.

1169
00:50:22.880 --> 00:50:24.560
And I need to write down like this.

1170
00:50:24.560 --> 00:50:26.720
Here's how that child wrote the contract.

1171
00:50:26.720 --> 00:50:29.280
Made the promise to themselves to develop the contract.

1172
00:50:30.080 --> 00:50:32.000
And then even if you make it up, like when,

1173
00:50:32.720 --> 00:50:34.480
I'm going to write down a little thing.

1174
00:50:34.480 --> 00:50:36.560
When did this kid bring it into adulthood?

1175
00:50:37.600 --> 00:50:40.640
I need to stay small in order to say safe.

1176
00:50:40.640 --> 00:50:42.560
Let's say it's one of those things.

1177
00:50:42.640 --> 00:50:46.000
And then you just start telling yourself that is a child's voice.

1178
00:50:46.720 --> 00:50:47.920
That's a child's voice.

1179
00:50:48.480 --> 00:50:50.720
So the voice is not going to go away.

1180
00:50:50.720 --> 00:50:52.160
That's the sad part.

1181
00:50:52.160 --> 00:50:52.800
That's like me.

1182
00:50:52.800 --> 00:50:55.760
You're trying to not complete the sentence.

1183
00:50:55.760 --> 00:50:58.080
Mary had a little in your head.

1184
00:50:58.080 --> 00:50:59.280
You can't get rid of it.

1185
00:50:59.280 --> 00:51:01.120
No matter how hard you try to delete that,

1186
00:51:01.120 --> 00:51:03.840
it's repeated over years and years,

1187
00:51:03.840 --> 00:51:05.200
just like one of these things.

1188
00:51:06.160 --> 00:51:10.160
What truly changes for you is hearing a child,

1189
00:51:10.160 --> 00:51:14.720
hearing a misguided child who developed a coping mechanism for the world.

1190
00:51:16.000 --> 00:51:19.680
Not knowing that they were like, they just assumed I'm going to have this forever.

1191
00:51:19.680 --> 00:51:21.120
I'm going to need this as an adult.

1192
00:51:21.120 --> 00:51:23.120
I'm going to bring this into my adult life.

1193
00:51:23.120 --> 00:51:29.280
Part two of this is you make a wallpaper or something for your desktop.

1194
00:51:29.280 --> 00:51:32.400
And we're talking about being negatively motivated.

1195
00:51:32.400 --> 00:51:33.920
We're away from negative things.

1196
00:51:35.360 --> 00:51:39.600
You make a like a motivational wallpaper that has your big limiting belief on it.

1197
00:51:39.600 --> 00:51:41.200
And then take it to an extreme.

1198
00:51:41.200 --> 00:51:44.320
Add a client that had this, if I say small, I'm going to be safe.

1199
00:51:45.520 --> 00:51:48.400
And he was in a business, like he owned a business,

1200
00:51:48.400 --> 00:51:52.000
but he wouldn't go get these big clients and he wouldn't go do this.

1201
00:51:52.000 --> 00:51:53.120
The guys got three kids.

1202
00:51:54.000 --> 00:51:56.320
And I said, I want you to make a desktop wallpaper that says,

1203
00:51:56.320 --> 00:51:58.720
my kids don't deserve for me to be successful.

1204
00:51:59.760 --> 00:52:02.400
And I want you to look at it every single day when you turn your computer on.

1205
00:52:02.400 --> 00:52:04.400
Because that's exactly what your belief is saying.

1206
00:52:05.920 --> 00:52:08.720
Because if your kids truly deserved it, it would override the belief.

1207
00:52:09.840 --> 00:52:12.240
So you just need to write the belief in plain English.

1208
00:52:12.240 --> 00:52:16.800
And what it's truly, truly costing you in your life is my kids don't deserve

1209
00:52:17.680 --> 00:52:18.880
me to be successful.

1210
00:52:18.880 --> 00:52:20.160
My kids don't deserve money.

1211
00:52:21.440 --> 00:52:22.720
And that's what it comes down to.

1212
00:52:22.720 --> 00:52:25.760
And every day you look at it, you have a feeling of disgust.

1213
00:52:26.640 --> 00:52:30.080
And there's a hyper awareness of that thing running in your head.

1214
00:52:30.080 --> 00:52:32.880
You're going to be more prone to hear it when it does come up.

1215
00:52:33.760 --> 00:52:36.880
And you're also training yourself to hear it as a child's voice,

1216
00:52:36.880 --> 00:52:38.560
which means you're going to start hearing fiction.

1217
00:52:39.200 --> 00:52:42.320
You're still hearing the same sentence, but you're hearing a fictional story.

1218
00:52:42.880 --> 00:52:43.840
There's two parts to this.

1219
00:52:43.840 --> 00:52:44.480
I love this.

1220
00:52:44.480 --> 00:52:46.800
And there's two parts to it that I think I wanted to talk about.

1221
00:52:46.800 --> 00:52:51.200
The first is, in doing so, in waking up in the morning and seeing my wallpaper,

1222
00:52:51.200 --> 00:52:53.760
that says like, my kids don't deserve a great life or whatever.

1223
00:52:54.720 --> 00:52:57.120
Of course, it's going to motivate me to take action,

1224
00:52:57.120 --> 00:53:00.400
which is then going to start to build new evidence once I take action,

1225
00:53:00.400 --> 00:53:02.080
once I win that big client.

1226
00:53:02.080 --> 00:53:05.040
And I realize that everything's fine, which is going to change my life.

1227
00:53:05.040 --> 00:53:07.360
And then the second point I wanted to point out is like,

1228
00:53:07.360 --> 00:53:10.400
people listen to podcasts like this, and they write this stuff down.

1229
00:53:10.960 --> 00:53:13.760
And then they have relapses.

1230
00:53:14.320 --> 00:53:16.160
And things don't change fast enough.

1231
00:53:16.160 --> 00:53:19.120
And I think that can sometimes make them feel hopeless or inadequate,

1232
00:53:19.120 --> 00:53:21.600
because they heard it on the die of ASEA or whatever.

1233
00:53:21.600 --> 00:53:24.080
And then they did it for a bit, and they struggled,

1234
00:53:24.080 --> 00:53:25.440
and it didn't quite work out.

1235
00:53:25.440 --> 00:53:27.280
And then they went back to their old behavior.

1236
00:53:27.280 --> 00:53:30.880
And I think in part, this happens because we live under the presumption

1237
00:53:30.880 --> 00:53:32.720
that this stuff is easy and it's fast.

1238
00:53:32.720 --> 00:53:35.520
And that at some point in the future, I can fix my trauma.

1239
00:53:36.000 --> 00:53:38.960
Like, I think one of the best realizations I ever had

1240
00:53:38.960 --> 00:53:41.680
was realizing that the bullshit that I've carried with me in that backpack

1241
00:53:41.680 --> 00:53:44.960
since I was a kid, that the stuff about what will make me safe

1242
00:53:44.960 --> 00:53:47.840
or what will reward me, or how I'll make friends, or who I am,

1243
00:53:47.840 --> 00:53:51.600
or whatever, my survival mechanisms, they will be with me forever.

1244
00:53:52.720 --> 00:53:55.120
And actually, instead of trying to delete them,

1245
00:53:55.120 --> 00:53:58.880
like throw them out the backpack, what I was able to do is like,

1246
00:53:58.880 --> 00:54:01.760
turn down their ability to make the decision.

1247
00:54:01.920 --> 00:54:03.520
That's it.

1248
00:54:03.520 --> 00:54:04.880
That's it.

1249
00:54:04.880 --> 00:54:06.000
You've totally got it.

1250
00:54:07.040 --> 00:54:09.440
And I would say this for anybody out there

1251
00:54:09.440 --> 00:54:11.120
that you're trying to go through this,

1252
00:54:11.120 --> 00:54:14.000
and you have in a hard time, I get it.

1253
00:54:14.000 --> 00:54:15.680
It's totally tough.

1254
00:54:15.680 --> 00:54:18.280
The number one way that we influence another human being.

1255
00:54:18.280 --> 00:54:21.320
Let me just kind of metaphor this for one second.

1256
00:54:21.320 --> 00:54:24.880
When you watch a hypnotist, and hypnosis is fun,

1257
00:54:24.880 --> 00:54:28.000
anybody can learn to do it, it's a pretty easy thing.

1258
00:54:28.000 --> 00:54:30.000
So it looked very dramatic,

1259
00:54:30.000 --> 00:54:32.320
but one of the things you'll see me do at the beginning of that

1260
00:54:32.320 --> 00:54:34.240
is like, go ahead and give me your hand,

1261
00:54:34.240 --> 00:54:35.600
and I'll hold their hand for a second,

1262
00:54:35.600 --> 00:54:37.440
like put both hands out like this,

1263
00:54:37.440 --> 00:54:38.560
and then flip them over.

1264
00:54:38.560 --> 00:54:39.520
That's great.

1265
00:54:39.520 --> 00:54:41.280
Now just to test your eyes really quickly,

1266
00:54:41.280 --> 00:54:43.280
look all the way up, and look all the way down,

1267
00:54:43.280 --> 00:54:45.360
look all the way left, look all the way right.

1268
00:54:45.360 --> 00:54:47.040
Alright, then spread your feet a little further apart,

1269
00:54:47.040 --> 00:54:50.000
a little closer together, actually, no, face this way.

1270
00:54:50.000 --> 00:54:52.480
And I will make them do like 50 things.

1271
00:54:52.480 --> 00:54:55.920
None of the things that I just did with them are meaningful.

1272
00:54:55.920 --> 00:54:57.440
None of them.

1273
00:54:58.440 --> 00:55:01.680
Everything was micro-compliance.

1274
00:55:01.680 --> 00:55:04.480
So this is how social media starts roping you in.

1275
00:55:04.480 --> 00:55:06.880
This is how politics starts roping you in.

1276
00:55:06.880 --> 00:55:10.840
This is how cult leaders will recruit you into a cult.

1277
00:55:10.840 --> 00:55:14.320
Micro-compliance, and you don't realize

1278
00:55:14.320 --> 00:55:17.520
that you're going through these massive amount of compliance.

1279
00:55:17.520 --> 00:55:19.320
So like you go through a doctor's physical,

1280
00:55:19.320 --> 00:55:22.280
and they go through like this 90-point checklist,

1281
00:55:22.280 --> 00:55:23.960
they've made you do 50 things,

1282
00:55:23.960 --> 00:55:26.120
and then they recommend a weird drug,

1283
00:55:26.120 --> 00:55:27.760
or they recommend you get on some other drug,

1284
00:55:27.760 --> 00:55:30.280
take some time to think about it,

1285
00:55:30.280 --> 00:55:34.240
because our brain is hardwired for these micro-compliances.

1286
00:55:34.240 --> 00:55:38.200
So I say this to say that if you're going through any of these things,

1287
00:55:38.200 --> 00:55:40.200
and you're trying to change your beliefs,

1288
00:55:40.200 --> 00:55:42.160
or you're trying to change something in your body,

1289
00:55:42.160 --> 00:55:44.440
use what works for brainwashing,

1290
00:55:44.440 --> 00:55:47.360
and figure out a way that you can get micro-compliance

1291
00:55:47.360 --> 00:55:50.600
with your own goals on a very regular basis.

1292
00:55:50.600 --> 00:55:53.280
Small little winds, so your brain has that,

1293
00:55:53.280 --> 00:55:56.120
just like hypnosis, just like cult recruiting,

1294
00:55:56.120 --> 00:55:57.520
just like brainwashing.

1295
00:55:57.520 --> 00:55:59.240
Small little things at the very beginning.

1296
00:55:59.240 --> 00:56:02.760
So everything in influence should be looked at as a wedge.

1297
00:56:04.760 --> 00:56:05.600
Everything.

1298
00:56:06.800 --> 00:56:09.440
It reminds me of that our famous study they did

1299
00:56:09.440 --> 00:56:12.440
where they got people to give electric shocks

1300
00:56:12.440 --> 00:56:15.160
to other people, the Milgrim obedience experiment.

1301
00:56:15.160 --> 00:56:17.280
And they managed to get a member of the public

1302
00:56:17.280 --> 00:56:22.600
to give another member of the public lethal electric shocks,

1303
00:56:22.600 --> 00:56:24.240
just three, sort of micro-compliance,

1304
00:56:24.240 --> 00:56:25.440
but also through authority,

1305
00:56:25.440 --> 00:56:28.040
because the experiment is wearing white jackets,

1306
00:56:28.040 --> 00:56:29.600
white overalls, et cetera.

1307
00:56:29.600 --> 00:56:31.600
And here's the second thing in that experiment

1308
00:56:31.600 --> 00:56:34.040
that's going to perfectly tie back to this.

1309
00:56:34.960 --> 00:56:36.320
So this experiment that you're talking about

1310
00:56:36.320 --> 00:56:38.920
happened at Yale University, it was 1962.

1311
00:56:40.760 --> 00:56:43.520
And I mean, there's tons of data on it,

1312
00:56:43.520 --> 00:56:46.840
but essentially strangers would shock another person seemingly,

1313
00:56:46.840 --> 00:56:48.240
or what they thought was to death,

1314
00:56:48.240 --> 00:56:50.680
just because some dude in the lab coat told them to.

1315
00:56:51.680 --> 00:56:53.480
But what they didn't account for,

1316
00:56:53.480 --> 00:56:55.400
and even Dr. Milgrim's book was called

1317
00:56:55.400 --> 00:56:56.560
Obedience to Authority.

1318
00:56:56.560 --> 00:56:58.080
They thought it was all about the authority,

1319
00:56:58.080 --> 00:57:00.560
the lab coat, the guys' tall.

1320
00:57:00.560 --> 00:57:02.720
It's a professional setting.

1321
00:57:02.720 --> 00:57:06.760
But really think about, if you go back to our ancestors,

1322
00:57:06.760 --> 00:57:10.320
like the most important resource to your ancestors

1323
00:57:10.320 --> 00:57:12.200
was focus.

1324
00:57:12.200 --> 00:57:14.880
There's nothing more important than focus.

1325
00:57:14.880 --> 00:57:17.440
And the number one way to generate focus,

1326
00:57:17.440 --> 00:57:19.960
and if I don't have your focus,

1327
00:57:19.960 --> 00:57:22.520
I can't command authority, right?

1328
00:57:22.520 --> 00:57:24.320
So focus is always first.

1329
00:57:24.320 --> 00:57:26.160
When I focus authority, tribe, and emotion,

1330
00:57:26.160 --> 00:57:28.120
those are the four things that govern a mammal.

1331
00:57:28.120 --> 00:57:30.480
All mammals, dolphins, doesn't matter.

1332
00:57:31.520 --> 00:57:34.240
So I have to have focus before authority,

1333
00:57:34.240 --> 00:57:36.000
and they didn't talk about that.

1334
00:57:36.000 --> 00:57:38.920
And the way to get focus is through novelty.

1335
00:57:38.920 --> 00:57:42.160
Novelty, meaning something unexpected is occurring.

1336
00:57:42.160 --> 00:57:47.120
So like if you walk past the same bush every day 10,000 years ago,

1337
00:57:47.120 --> 00:57:50.000
and your job is to carry fish from the river,

1338
00:57:50.000 --> 00:57:51.680
and suddenly you walk past that bush,

1339
00:57:51.680 --> 00:57:54.520
and you hear a big ass stick snap.

1340
00:57:55.520 --> 00:57:59.840
All of your focus, all of it is on that stick.

1341
00:57:59.840 --> 00:58:02.240
It's not on your kids, it's not on your health,

1342
00:58:02.240 --> 00:58:03.880
it's not on anything that's going on,

1343
00:58:03.880 --> 00:58:07.560
it's to this new unexpected piece of information.

1344
00:58:07.560 --> 00:58:09.560
That hijacks our brain.

1345
00:58:09.560 --> 00:58:12.200
Anything novel, hijacks our brain.

1346
00:58:12.200 --> 00:58:15.680
So if you see, and it follows that pathway, focus,

1347
00:58:15.680 --> 00:58:17.720
then authority, and then tribe,

1348
00:58:17.720 --> 00:58:20.600
what's everybody else doing, and then emotion.

1349
00:58:20.600 --> 00:58:22.280
Then how do I feel about it?

1350
00:58:22.280 --> 00:58:26.600
So what happens is we are hardwired

1351
00:58:26.600 --> 00:58:27.680
to respond to these things.

1352
00:58:27.680 --> 00:58:31.400
You cannot decide not to respond to novelty.

1353
00:58:31.400 --> 00:58:34.840
Your head turns to loud sounds, all this stuff happens.

1354
00:58:36.080 --> 00:58:38.760
So the way that if you're trying to do this,

1355
00:58:38.760 --> 00:58:41.240
like brainwash yourself,

1356
00:58:41.240 --> 00:58:43.400
is change your house up,

1357
00:58:43.400 --> 00:58:46.120
change something up in your life, change your wardrobe,

1358
00:58:46.120 --> 00:58:48.240
repaint the walls in your office,

1359
00:58:48.240 --> 00:58:52.360
move your furniture around, buy a new car if you can.

1360
00:58:52.360 --> 00:58:54.640
I want you to, like just imagine is,

1361
00:58:54.640 --> 00:58:57.640
how would I influence my dog in this situation?

1362
00:58:59.560 --> 00:59:03.200
I would need imagery, I would need something to shift.

1363
00:59:03.200 --> 00:59:05.400
If I move the kitchen table to the side

1364
00:59:05.400 --> 00:59:06.960
and move all the furniture,

1365
00:59:06.960 --> 00:59:08.560
when my dog comes out of the bedroom,

1366
00:59:08.560 --> 00:59:10.840
he's gonna know something's different.

1367
00:59:11.400 --> 00:59:15.200
I think this is one of the great secrets of good marketing,

1368
00:59:15.200 --> 00:59:18.880
is that it beats your brain's wallpaper filter.

1369
00:59:18.880 --> 00:59:21.200
And I wrote a little bit about this in my last book

1370
00:59:21.200 --> 00:59:23.720
about this idea of beating the wallpaper filter.

1371
00:59:23.720 --> 00:59:25.200
I think we talked a little bit about it last time,

1372
00:59:25.200 --> 00:59:27.360
but I talked about a study where they got a rat

1373
00:59:27.360 --> 00:59:28.720
and put it in a maze with chocolate

1374
00:59:28.720 --> 00:59:29.960
at the other end of the maze,

1375
00:59:29.960 --> 00:59:30.960
and they looked at the rat's brain

1376
00:59:30.960 --> 00:59:32.960
as it went through the maze the first time,

1377
00:59:32.960 --> 00:59:35.000
and they saw that the rat's brain was like,

1378
00:59:35.000 --> 00:59:37.840
exploded with activity, it's smelling the walls,

1379
00:59:37.840 --> 00:59:39.520
it's trying to figure it out.

1380
00:59:39.520 --> 00:59:42.160
And then they put the rat in the maze the second time,

1381
00:59:42.160 --> 00:59:44.760
and there's like almost no brain activity

1382
00:59:44.760 --> 00:59:46.120
because it's on autopilot.

1383
00:59:46.120 --> 00:59:48.040
It knows the maze, so it doesn't need to use any,

1384
00:59:48.040 --> 00:59:49.240
it's cognitive resources.

1385
00:59:49.240 --> 00:59:51.000
It's cognitive resources can be allocated

1386
00:59:51.000 --> 00:59:52.960
to new surprising things.

1387
00:59:52.960 --> 00:59:54.640
The maze is no longer surprising,

1388
00:59:54.640 --> 00:59:56.440
wizards through the maze to the chocolate.

1389
00:59:56.440 --> 00:59:58.480
And even like as you think about how you got out of your bed

1390
00:59:58.480 --> 01:00:00.320
this morning and got down to the kitchen,

1391
01:00:00.320 --> 01:00:01.760
you didn't have to think.

1392
01:00:01.760 --> 01:00:03.320
So you paid no attention.

1393
01:00:03.320 --> 01:00:04.320
Yeah.

1394
01:00:04.320 --> 01:00:05.920
But you would have paid attention if you walked down there

1395
01:00:05.920 --> 01:00:07.960
and you like so far, wasn't there.

1396
01:00:08.120 --> 01:00:09.720
And how does that then apply to marketing?

1397
01:00:09.720 --> 01:00:11.840
So like how do you surprise people?

1398
01:00:11.840 --> 01:00:13.680
Is like a central question of anyone

1399
01:00:13.680 --> 01:00:14.760
who's trying to build a personal brand,

1400
01:00:14.760 --> 01:00:17.480
start a podcast or do marketing?

1401
01:00:18.760 --> 01:00:21.240
But I guess also to persuade people.

1402
01:00:21.240 --> 01:00:22.240
So one of the things I think about a lot

1403
01:00:22.240 --> 01:00:26.280
when I talk on stage is I know I'm competing

1404
01:00:26.280 --> 01:00:31.080
with your mobile phone, your Twitter feed or your TikTok.

1405
01:00:31.080 --> 01:00:34.640
So I have to do something almost like every 10 seconds

1406
01:00:34.640 --> 01:00:36.080
to like catch you off guard.

1407
01:00:36.080 --> 01:00:38.000
And Mr. Beast I guess is the great master of this

1408
01:00:38.000 --> 01:00:41.280
and it's probably why he's got half a billion YouTube followers

1409
01:00:41.280 --> 01:00:43.800
because the minute that video starts.

1410
01:00:43.800 --> 01:00:46.000
Oh, yeah, we hooked him.

1411
01:00:46.000 --> 01:00:47.320
You hooked.

1412
01:00:47.320 --> 01:00:49.920
But this, I mean, that's the power of novelty.

1413
01:00:49.920 --> 01:00:52.800
I would challenge anybody to take this challenge.

1414
01:00:52.800 --> 01:00:55.480
If you're scrolling through short form content,

1415
01:00:55.480 --> 01:00:59.240
watch for something that like jerks your attention

1416
01:00:59.240 --> 01:01:02.200
like some kind of weird novelty thing that happens.

1417
01:01:02.200 --> 01:01:04.840
And that video is probably short, 20,

1418
01:01:04.840 --> 01:01:09.840
maybe 42nd video that captures your focus through novelty.

1419
01:01:10.320 --> 01:01:13.680
The next video, watch for an authority figure,

1420
01:01:13.680 --> 01:01:17.720
a famous YouTuber, a celebrity, a politician,

1421
01:01:17.720 --> 01:01:21.160
pop singer who thinks that they know politics,

1422
01:01:21.160 --> 01:01:22.360
all that kind of stuff.

1423
01:01:22.360 --> 01:01:24.120
Watch for an authority figure.

1424
01:01:24.120 --> 01:01:26.760
Next, watch for a tribe signal.

1425
01:01:27.680 --> 01:01:29.400
So a tribe signal is gonna be,

1426
01:01:29.400 --> 01:01:31.160
here's how many people agree with this.

1427
01:01:31.160 --> 01:01:33.800
Here's lots of people doing one thing.

1428
01:01:33.840 --> 01:01:35.680
These tickets are selling out.

1429
01:01:35.680 --> 01:01:37.280
Here's the Taylor Swift concert.

1430
01:01:37.280 --> 01:01:39.200
Here's everyone cheering at the concert.

1431
01:01:39.200 --> 01:01:40.800
Here's how you're supposed to behave.

1432
01:01:40.800 --> 01:01:43.320
It's basically what that means in the tribe section.

1433
01:01:43.320 --> 01:01:45.720
You're supposed to do what these people are doing.

1434
01:01:45.720 --> 01:01:47.640
And then watch for the emotion.

1435
01:01:47.640 --> 01:01:49.840
So watch for this pattern.

1436
01:01:49.840 --> 01:01:52.280
It'll be a focused generating novelty.

1437
01:01:52.280 --> 01:01:53.360
Then it'll be authority.

1438
01:01:53.360 --> 01:01:54.320
Then you'll see tribe.

1439
01:01:54.320 --> 01:01:55.960
Then you'll see an emotional video.

1440
01:01:55.960 --> 01:01:58.400
And guess what happens after the emotional video?

1441
01:01:58.400 --> 01:01:59.240
Well, add.

1442
01:02:01.120 --> 01:02:02.680
Much of the reason most people

1443
01:02:02.720 --> 01:02:04.720
haven't posted content or got their personal brand

1444
01:02:04.720 --> 01:02:07.400
is because it's hard and it's time consuming

1445
01:02:07.400 --> 01:02:08.880
and we're all very, very busy.

1446
01:02:08.880 --> 01:02:11.760
And if you've never posted something before,

1447
01:02:11.760 --> 01:02:14.280
there's so many factors in your psychology

1448
01:02:14.280 --> 01:02:16.000
that stop you wanting to post.

1449
01:02:16.000 --> 01:02:17.320
What people will think of you.

1450
01:02:17.320 --> 01:02:18.320
Am I doing this right?

1451
01:02:18.320 --> 01:02:20.680
Is the thing I'm saying absolutely stupid?

1452
01:02:20.680 --> 01:02:22.760
All of these result in paralysis,

1453
01:02:22.760 --> 01:02:24.440
which means you don't post.

1454
01:02:24.440 --> 01:02:26.400
And your feed goes bare.

1455
01:02:26.400 --> 01:02:28.680
I'm an investor in a company called Stan Store,

1456
01:02:28.680 --> 01:02:30.000
which you've probably had me talk about.

1457
01:02:30.000 --> 01:02:31.000
And what they've been building

1458
01:02:31.040 --> 01:02:32.360
is this new tool called Stan Lee

1459
01:02:32.360 --> 01:02:35.560
that uses AI, looks at your feed, looks at your tone of voice,

1460
01:02:35.560 --> 01:02:37.880
looks at your history, looks at your best performing posts

1461
01:02:37.880 --> 01:02:39.720
and tells you what you should post.

1462
01:02:39.720 --> 01:02:41.360
Makes those posts for you.

1463
01:02:41.360 --> 01:02:43.800
You can also just use it for inspiration.

1464
01:02:43.800 --> 01:02:45.040
And sometimes what we need

1465
01:02:45.040 --> 01:02:46.160
when we're thinking about doing a post

1466
01:02:46.160 --> 01:02:48.840
for our social media channels is inspiration.

1467
01:02:48.840 --> 01:02:51.280
Building an audience has fundamentally changed my life.

1468
01:02:51.280 --> 01:02:52.960
And I think it could change yours too.

1469
01:02:52.960 --> 01:02:55.960
So I'm inviting you to give this new tool a shot

1470
01:02:55.960 --> 01:02:57.360
and let me know what you think.

1471
01:02:57.360 --> 01:03:00.320
All you have to do is search coach.stand.store now

1472
01:03:00.360 --> 01:03:02.080
to get started.

1473
01:03:02.080 --> 01:03:03.640
I've had so many founders speak to me

1474
01:03:03.640 --> 01:03:05.680
and say, why didn't this particular ad

1475
01:03:05.680 --> 01:03:08.120
that I ran on this platform work for me?

1476
01:03:08.120 --> 01:03:10.400
Maybe the copy wasn't good, the creative wasn't strong,

1477
01:03:10.400 --> 01:03:11.760
but usually the problem is they're not having

1478
01:03:11.760 --> 01:03:12.800
the right conversation.

1479
01:03:12.800 --> 01:03:15.120
Because that ad never reached the right person.

1480
01:03:15.120 --> 01:03:18.240
And if you're in B2B marketing, that is much of the game.

1481
01:03:18.240 --> 01:03:19.800
And this is where LinkedIn ads

1482
01:03:19.800 --> 01:03:21.680
solves that problem for you.

1483
01:03:21.680 --> 01:03:23.880
Their targeting is ridiculously specific.

1484
01:03:23.880 --> 01:03:27.240
You can target by job title, seniority, company size,

1485
01:03:27.240 --> 01:03:29.960
industry and even someone's skill set.

1486
01:03:29.960 --> 01:03:32.960
And then network includes over a billion professionals,

1487
01:03:32.960 --> 01:03:36.240
about 130 million of them are decision makers.

1488
01:03:36.240 --> 01:03:37.440
So when you use LinkedIn ads,

1489
01:03:37.440 --> 01:03:40.280
you're putting your brand in front of the right people.

1490
01:03:40.280 --> 01:03:42.600
And LinkedIn ads also drive the highest B2B return

1491
01:03:42.600 --> 01:03:45.640
on ad spend across all ad networks and my experience.

1492
01:03:45.640 --> 01:03:47.200
If you want to give them a try,

1493
01:03:47.200 --> 01:03:50.760
head over to LinkedIn.com slash diary.

1494
01:03:50.760 --> 01:03:54.360
And when you spend $250 on your first LinkedIn ads campaign,

1495
01:03:54.360 --> 01:03:59.000
you'll get an extra $250 credit from me for the next one.

1496
01:03:59.000 --> 01:04:01.600
That's LinkedIn.com slash diary.

1497
01:04:01.600 --> 01:04:03.720
Terms and conditions apply.

1498
01:04:03.720 --> 01:04:05.560
I had you say something as well that,

1499
01:04:05.560 --> 01:04:06.800
if you want to persuade other people,

1500
01:04:06.800 --> 01:04:08.800
you should make them feel clever.

1501
01:04:08.800 --> 01:04:09.880
Yeah.

1502
01:04:09.880 --> 01:04:10.920
Explain this to me.

1503
01:04:10.920 --> 01:04:15.920
I refer to this as maybe the most dangerous persuasion

1504
01:04:15.920 --> 01:04:18.480
skill there is.

1505
01:04:18.480 --> 01:04:23.280
And the 10 second brief is, I basically,

1506
01:04:23.280 --> 01:04:26.920
I'm going to put a Lego right here on the table in front of you.

1507
01:04:26.920 --> 01:04:28.680
And I'm going to put another Lego right here

1508
01:04:28.680 --> 01:04:30.520
on the table in front of you.

1509
01:04:30.520 --> 01:04:33.360
And I'm just going to keep having the conversation.

1510
01:04:33.360 --> 01:04:35.760
To where eventually, your brain is going to be like,

1511
01:04:35.760 --> 01:04:38.640
oh, I bet those things go together.

1512
01:04:38.640 --> 01:04:41.040
So the idea came from you.

1513
01:04:41.040 --> 01:04:43.040
So I'm going to give you one piece of information

1514
01:04:43.040 --> 01:04:44.400
and another piece of information.

1515
01:04:44.400 --> 01:04:46.760
But I will never put them together for you.

1516
01:04:46.760 --> 01:04:49.960
And the reason is that any idea that you think

1517
01:04:49.960 --> 01:04:55.080
came from your own mind, you have no ability to resist it.

1518
01:04:55.080 --> 01:04:58.920
So all I have to do is make you have an idea.

1519
01:04:58.920 --> 01:05:01.760
So a regular example of this is, let's say

1520
01:05:01.760 --> 01:05:05.000
you're watching the news and they say,

1521
01:05:05.000 --> 01:05:08.840
local Austin woman has been reported missing.

1522
01:05:08.840 --> 01:05:12.240
Neighbors said that earlier this day,

1523
01:05:12.240 --> 01:05:14.960
people saw her arguing with her boyfriend.

1524
01:05:14.960 --> 01:05:15.800
Oh, yeah.

1525
01:05:15.800 --> 01:05:17.760
Details after the break.

1526
01:05:17.760 --> 01:05:19.000
So yeah.

1527
01:05:19.000 --> 01:05:21.440
And your brain is like, oh, I know what happened.

1528
01:05:21.440 --> 01:05:23.760
Oh, I know exactly what happened.

1529
01:05:23.800 --> 01:05:26.880
But they make you feel clever.

1530
01:05:26.880 --> 01:05:29.400
They give you a piece of data and a piece of data,

1531
01:05:29.400 --> 01:05:31.880
but they don't tell you to put it together.

1532
01:05:31.880 --> 01:05:33.240
The immediate idea is all the time.

1533
01:05:33.240 --> 01:05:34.640
Yes.

1534
01:05:34.640 --> 01:05:36.480
And if you can do this in a courtroom,

1535
01:05:38.120 --> 01:05:40.360
it will be the biggest unfair advantage

1536
01:05:40.360 --> 01:05:42.920
you'll ever have in a legal standing.

1537
01:05:42.920 --> 01:05:45.360
Because it'll win lots of trials.

1538
01:05:46.320 --> 01:05:50.320
The way that, like if there's a formula on how to use this,

1539
01:05:50.320 --> 01:05:53.400
is here's a piece of information here.

1540
01:05:53.400 --> 01:05:55.120
And it's a piece of information

1541
01:05:55.120 --> 01:05:57.600
that you will absolutely agree with

1542
01:05:57.600 --> 01:05:58.920
that makes sense to you.

1543
01:05:58.920 --> 01:06:02.120
And another piece of information that makes sense to you.

1544
01:06:02.120 --> 01:06:06.880
It has to be two things that make sense to your brain.

1545
01:06:06.880 --> 01:06:08.400
Because it's like you're not going to experiment

1546
01:06:08.400 --> 01:06:10.200
with something that you're not familiar with.

1547
01:06:10.200 --> 01:06:13.720
So two pieces of familiar information close enough together

1548
01:06:13.720 --> 01:06:16.360
where the brain is going to say, oh, you know what I can do?

1549
01:06:16.360 --> 01:06:17.720
I'm going to put those two things together.

1550
01:06:17.720 --> 01:06:20.040
Isn't this how conspiracy theories take hold as well?

1551
01:06:20.040 --> 01:06:20.880
Oh, yeah.

1552
01:06:20.880 --> 01:06:23.560
Because as, you know, yeah.

1553
01:06:23.560 --> 01:06:25.400
You know, there's a big,

1554
01:06:25.400 --> 01:06:27.480
there's a big enduring conspiracy theory

1555
01:06:27.480 --> 01:06:30.400
that someone like Bill Gates has done things

1556
01:06:30.400 --> 01:06:32.760
that are nefarious as it relates to health.

1557
01:06:32.760 --> 01:06:34.880
And they're like, I guess the two pieces people are connecting

1558
01:06:34.880 --> 01:06:37.080
is they're saying, well, he's worked a lot.

1559
01:06:37.080 --> 01:06:38.880
He's very rich and powerful.

1560
01:06:38.880 --> 01:06:42.680
And he's very, very interested in health biotech

1561
01:06:42.680 --> 01:06:44.600
and vaccines and all these other things.

1562
01:06:44.600 --> 01:06:48.600
And, you know, someone very, very, very powerful.

1563
01:06:48.600 --> 01:06:50.480
We often think of, you know, very powerful,

1564
01:06:50.480 --> 01:06:53.680
successful, influential people as being somewhat like evil

1565
01:06:53.680 --> 01:06:55.000
or not having our interests at heart.

1566
01:06:55.000 --> 01:06:56.920
And then someone who's spending a lot of money

1567
01:06:56.920 --> 01:06:59.840
on like health and medical side, side of things

1568
01:07:02.520 --> 01:07:04.160
is quite an unusual thing.

1569
01:07:04.160 --> 01:07:05.360
So we put two and two together.

1570
01:07:05.360 --> 01:07:07.120
We have, you know, we think they have bad intentions

1571
01:07:07.120 --> 01:07:08.200
because they are a billionaire.

1572
01:07:08.200 --> 01:07:11.880
And that word is, you know, comes with certain preconceptions.

1573
01:07:11.880 --> 01:07:14.640
And then health and then a pandemic happens.

1574
01:07:14.640 --> 01:07:16.160
And I think people, you know,

1575
01:07:17.160 --> 01:07:19.560
this is how I think a lot of conspiracies

1576
01:07:19.560 --> 01:07:20.440
Nice.

1577
01:07:20.440 --> 01:07:22.120
Name a movie from when you were a kid

1578
01:07:22.120 --> 01:07:24.920
where the bad guy or where the super rich person

1579
01:07:24.920 --> 01:07:26.960
in the movie wasn't the evil.

1580
01:07:28.120 --> 01:07:29.120
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1581
01:07:29.120 --> 01:07:31.440
I mean, it's programmed into the media.

1582
01:07:31.440 --> 01:07:34.320
And it's a definite programming

1583
01:07:34.320 --> 01:07:37.240
that was very deliberate in our country.

1584
01:07:37.240 --> 01:07:39.840
It's like always the rich people are evil.

1585
01:07:39.840 --> 01:07:42.120
But then people will say, oh, Tony Stark was rich.

1586
01:07:42.120 --> 01:07:44.360
They made him a sociopath.

1587
01:07:44.400 --> 01:07:46.440
It's interesting because I think, you know,

1588
01:07:46.440 --> 01:07:49.640
I can make the case that at some point it's intentional.

1589
01:07:49.640 --> 01:07:54.120
But at some point also, it becomes such a clear stereotype

1590
01:07:54.120 --> 01:07:56.040
that you have to follow that stereotype

1591
01:07:56.040 --> 01:07:57.280
when you're like writing movies or else

1592
01:07:57.280 --> 01:07:58.760
it doesn't make sense to people.

1593
01:07:58.760 --> 01:08:00.680
Yeah. And I'm not saying it was intentional

1594
01:08:00.680 --> 01:08:03.400
within the last like 200, 300 years.

1595
01:08:03.400 --> 01:08:06.440
I'm not, we're talking about like the brother's grim

1596
01:08:06.440 --> 01:08:08.360
ancient fairy tales.

1597
01:08:08.360 --> 01:08:10.680
And it would, I think it was intentional then,

1598
01:08:10.680 --> 01:08:12.600
like having wealth is bad.

1599
01:08:12.600 --> 01:08:14.240
There's virtue in poverty.

1600
01:08:14.240 --> 01:08:16.160
That's the big thing they wanted to communicate

1601
01:08:16.160 --> 01:08:17.160
to their kids.

1602
01:08:17.160 --> 01:08:19.440
And poverty is virtuous.

1603
01:08:19.440 --> 01:08:21.520
And of course, like we're still doing a lot

1604
01:08:21.520 --> 01:08:23.080
of that stuff today.

1605
01:08:23.080 --> 01:08:26.640
But the reason is exactly what you're saying is correct.

1606
01:08:26.640 --> 01:08:30.440
I think it's burned into like some collective archetype

1607
01:08:30.440 --> 01:08:33.040
of what stories have become.

1608
01:08:33.040 --> 01:08:34.080
And we wouldn't recognize it.

1609
01:08:34.080 --> 01:08:35.440
So like if I watched a movie

1610
01:08:35.440 --> 01:08:39.720
and there was a very successful billionaire business man,

1611
01:08:39.720 --> 01:08:42.160
all I have to say is that, few to fill in the gaps.

1612
01:08:42.160 --> 01:08:43.240
You're thinking private jet.

1613
01:08:43.240 --> 01:08:44.680
You're thinking how they treat people.

1614
01:08:44.680 --> 01:08:46.800
You're thinking, you know, they're on their phone

1615
01:08:46.800 --> 01:08:47.640
with a briefcase.

1616
01:08:47.640 --> 01:08:49.520
You're thinking, you know, that they have what they're wearing.

1617
01:08:49.520 --> 01:08:50.880
You know what they're wearing.

1618
01:08:50.880 --> 01:08:52.360
And I didn't say any of that stuff.

1619
01:08:52.360 --> 01:08:53.200
Yeah.

1620
01:08:53.200 --> 01:08:54.720
And you made me feel clever

1621
01:08:54.720 --> 01:08:56.440
because I put all that stuff together.

1622
01:08:56.440 --> 01:08:58.880
It came from my own mind.

1623
01:08:58.880 --> 01:09:00.000
And speaking of archetypes,

1624
01:09:00.000 --> 01:09:02.600
that's the second way that you can win any court case

1625
01:09:02.600 --> 01:09:03.480
in the world.

1626
01:09:03.480 --> 01:09:05.520
Have you got experience with court cases

1627
01:09:05.520 --> 01:09:07.120
and stuff like that a lot?

1628
01:09:07.120 --> 01:09:08.320
What is your experience?

1629
01:09:08.320 --> 01:09:10.720
As far as I know, I'm the only trial consultant

1630
01:09:10.720 --> 01:09:14.960
that offers a 200% money back guarantee when I work.

1631
01:09:14.960 --> 01:09:16.720
So what does that mean as a trial consultant?

1632
01:09:16.720 --> 01:09:18.480
What's your objective in simple times?

1633
01:09:18.480 --> 01:09:20.080
It's always a little different.

1634
01:09:20.080 --> 01:09:22.720
And it depends on whether I'm working for prosecution

1635
01:09:22.720 --> 01:09:24.360
or defense.

1636
01:09:24.360 --> 01:09:26.760
I know nothing about the law.

1637
01:09:26.760 --> 01:09:29.400
Like just about nothing.

1638
01:09:29.400 --> 01:09:30.800
But I know people.

1639
01:09:30.800 --> 01:09:35.000
So I will typically go in and we'll pick a jury

1640
01:09:35.000 --> 01:09:36.880
and we'll select a jury.

1641
01:09:36.880 --> 01:09:39.440
And we want to select a jury based on this factor

1642
01:09:40.240 --> 01:09:42.200
and based on this zip code,

1643
01:09:42.200 --> 01:09:43.880
here's the question that we want to ask

1644
01:09:43.880 --> 01:09:45.920
to find out which is going to be a good jury

1645
01:09:45.920 --> 01:09:46.800
and which is a bad jury.

1646
01:09:46.800 --> 01:09:49.280
But then I have to figure out questions that are covert.

1647
01:09:49.280 --> 01:09:51.560
How can I covertly ask a question

1648
01:09:51.560 --> 01:09:54.000
where the opposing counsel, the other attorney,

1649
01:09:54.000 --> 01:09:57.120
won't know what I desire and what I don't desire

1650
01:09:57.120 --> 01:09:58.600
based on the answer.

1651
01:09:58.600 --> 01:10:02.600
So one case I worked for was with a,

1652
01:10:02.600 --> 01:10:06.480
was for a large grocery store company

1653
01:10:06.480 --> 01:10:08.920
who was being sued because a lady slipped

1654
01:10:08.920 --> 01:10:14.000
on a green bean, real shit.

1655
01:10:14.000 --> 01:10:18.880
And they hired me because it was a big lawsuit.

1656
01:10:18.880 --> 01:10:24.760
And I want a jury that has an internal locus of control,

1657
01:10:24.760 --> 01:10:26.600
that they are in charge of their own life.

1658
01:10:26.600 --> 01:10:29.120
They're responsible for their destiny.

1659
01:10:29.120 --> 01:10:32.600
And we want to weed out the people that have the opposite.

1660
01:10:32.600 --> 01:10:34.440
We want to weed out the people that kind of have a victim,

1661
01:10:34.440 --> 01:10:38.840
mentality, like the world happens to me, that kind of thing.

1662
01:10:38.880 --> 01:10:41.680
So we have to figure out,

1663
01:10:41.680 --> 01:10:44.080
how do I ask the question that A reveals that

1664
01:10:44.080 --> 01:10:47.880
is B, covert, and C is not going to expose

1665
01:10:47.880 --> 01:10:50.800
what we're looking for to opposing counsel.

1666
01:10:50.800 --> 01:10:52.600
So we'll come out with a question like,

1667
01:10:52.600 --> 01:10:54.480
how does a person catch a cold?

1668
01:10:55.680 --> 01:10:57.920
And then you get one person that answers,

1669
01:10:57.920 --> 01:11:00.640
well, these stupid kids picking their boogers,

1670
01:11:00.640 --> 01:11:02.240
they're wiping one of the escalator,

1671
01:11:02.240 --> 01:11:04.200
they're coughing, sneezing all over the place,

1672
01:11:04.200 --> 01:11:06.120
people aren't wearing masks.

1673
01:11:06.120 --> 01:11:09.160
And we ask the next guy, how does a person catch a cold?

1674
01:11:09.160 --> 01:11:11.920
And he says, well, if I ever caught a cold,

1675
01:11:11.920 --> 01:11:14.440
I was in place I shouldn't have been.

1676
01:11:14.440 --> 01:11:16.360
I didn't wash my hands thoroughly enough,

1677
01:11:16.360 --> 01:11:18.760
I didn't take care of my body, I didn't take vitamins,

1678
01:11:18.760 --> 01:11:22.160
I didn't take care of myself, very, very different.

1679
01:11:22.160 --> 01:11:27.160
So we know what is satisfactory for us to select a jury.

1680
01:11:27.640 --> 01:11:30.200
And that's just one tiny example.

1681
01:11:30.200 --> 01:11:31.080
But I'm going to pose you that

1682
01:11:31.080 --> 01:11:32.000
because I wanted to share something

1683
01:11:32.000 --> 01:11:34.000
before we carry on with this story, it's fascinating.

1684
01:11:34.000 --> 01:11:36.040
So actually the last question I asked on our coach test

1685
01:11:36.040 --> 01:11:38.200
when we employ people for my company,

1686
01:11:38.200 --> 01:11:41.840
we asked them 35 questions before they offered the chance

1687
01:11:41.840 --> 01:11:43.400
to interview, and the last question is,

1688
01:11:43.400 --> 01:11:46.280
when I don't do great work, who's to blame?

1689
01:11:47.240 --> 01:11:49.800
And it asks them, it says, the people I worked with,

1690
01:11:49.800 --> 01:11:51.320
I wasn't giving clear enough instructions

1691
01:11:51.320 --> 01:11:54.560
from a client or a boss or myself.

1692
01:11:54.560 --> 01:11:58.160
And it's remarkable that 45% of the population

1693
01:11:58.160 --> 01:11:59.880
will click, it was me.

1694
01:11:59.880 --> 01:12:02.320
When I don't do great work, it's not my team to blame,

1695
01:12:02.320 --> 01:12:03.960
it's not the person above or below me

1696
01:12:03.960 --> 01:12:06.280
or some other factor, it is me.

1697
01:12:06.280 --> 01:12:07.880
And that scores them, I shouldn't say this

1698
01:12:07.880 --> 01:12:08.960
because it's going to ruin my test,

1699
01:12:08.960 --> 01:12:10.120
but I'm going to just say it.

1700
01:12:10.120 --> 01:12:13.560
That scores the highest marks on that particular question.

1701
01:12:13.560 --> 01:12:14.920
Because again, we're trying to reveal,

1702
01:12:14.920 --> 01:12:18.120
like if you have that sense of personal responsibility

1703
01:12:18.120 --> 01:12:20.160
and internal locus of control,

1704
01:12:20.160 --> 01:12:22.480
internal center of control in your life,

1705
01:12:22.480 --> 01:12:24.880
which correlates to better work, more ambition,

1706
01:12:24.880 --> 01:12:27.360
harder work, better long term success,

1707
01:12:27.360 --> 01:12:30.360
and better happiness, more happiness.

1708
01:12:30.360 --> 01:12:31.840
Sorry, he's the continue.

1709
01:12:31.840 --> 01:12:33.760
And you can tell they're driven too.

1710
01:12:33.760 --> 01:12:35.000
They're going to own their mistakes,

1711
01:12:35.000 --> 01:12:37.640
they're going to help other people be more accountable.

1712
01:12:37.640 --> 01:12:38.800
Probably going to learn faster

1713
01:12:38.800 --> 01:12:40.440
because they're going to take responsibility.

1714
01:12:40.440 --> 01:12:41.280
Absolutely.

1715
01:12:42.360 --> 01:12:44.680
So with an archetype in the jury room,

1716
01:12:44.680 --> 01:12:47.600
so we've selected, let's say we've picked a jury,

1717
01:12:47.600 --> 01:12:52.600
then the goal is, what is the overall archetype

1718
01:12:52.600 --> 01:12:55.600
of the case that's playing out in front of us right here?

1719
01:12:55.600 --> 01:12:58.360
It's a small person suing a big company.

1720
01:12:58.360 --> 01:13:00.200
Let's say if I'm on the opposite now,

1721
01:13:00.200 --> 01:13:02.400
let's say I'm on that lady side,

1722
01:13:02.400 --> 01:13:04.200
then I'm going to come out with,

1723
01:13:04.200 --> 01:13:06.560
without ever saying the name,

1724
01:13:06.560 --> 01:13:08.840
I'm going to come out and I'm going to make you think

1725
01:13:08.840 --> 01:13:12.680
David and Goliath all day long without knowing

1726
01:13:12.680 --> 01:13:15.400
that I made you think David and Goliath's.

1727
01:13:15.400 --> 01:13:18.720
I might say giant, I might say someone small,

1728
01:13:18.720 --> 01:13:22.040
I might say slingshot, I might say all these little key words

1729
01:13:22.040 --> 01:13:23.160
that are probably in your head

1730
01:13:23.160 --> 01:13:24.880
about the David and Goliath story,

1731
01:13:24.880 --> 01:13:27.880
just to plant that narrative in your head.

1732
01:13:27.880 --> 01:13:31.480
And that might be the first three hours of the day.

1733
01:13:31.480 --> 01:13:33.040
And I've jammed that into your head

1734
01:13:33.040 --> 01:13:35.360
and you think it's your own idea.

1735
01:13:35.360 --> 01:13:36.480
This makes sense so far.

1736
01:13:36.480 --> 01:13:37.480
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1737
01:13:37.480 --> 01:13:41.320
So then the next time I'm going to talk about,

1738
01:13:41.320 --> 01:13:43.360
maybe it's a deposition or something like that,

1739
01:13:43.360 --> 01:13:45.960
we'll talk about waiting in line at the DMV.

1740
01:13:45.960 --> 01:13:47.280
We're going to talk about,

1741
01:13:47.280 --> 01:13:48.880
for people that don't know the context of that

1742
01:13:48.880 --> 01:13:50.200
because they're not in the US.

1743
01:13:50.200 --> 01:13:55.080
So waiting in line at this government identification card office.

1744
01:13:55.080 --> 01:13:57.480
Everyone around the world will have some form of fat

1745
01:13:57.480 --> 01:13:59.120
when you're going to get a passport, whatever.

1746
01:13:59.120 --> 01:14:01.120
Yeah, waiting at passport control.

1747
01:14:02.920 --> 01:14:06.320
Your doctor's office keeping you waiting for 45 minutes

1748
01:14:06.320 --> 01:14:08.000
and not caring about your time.

1749
01:14:08.000 --> 01:14:10.160
We're going to talk about all these situations

1750
01:14:10.160 --> 01:14:14.280
where a big, big company is screwing over another person

1751
01:14:14.280 --> 01:14:16.640
or a big, big government doesn't know

1752
01:14:16.640 --> 01:14:18.720
what the hell they're doing, they're incompetent.

1753
01:14:18.720 --> 01:14:21.320
So the attorney doesn't say any of this.

1754
01:14:21.320 --> 01:14:23.520
He's just mentioning the scenario.

1755
01:14:24.360 --> 01:14:26.080
So if I mention a scenario,

1756
01:14:26.960 --> 01:14:29.520
there's like a little file clerk in your head.

1757
01:14:29.520 --> 01:14:31.120
And if I mention any scenario,

1758
01:14:31.120 --> 01:14:34.040
I can get that little guy to run down to the file cabinet

1759
01:14:34.040 --> 01:14:38.000
and pull out a folder that has that stuff in there.

1760
01:14:38.000 --> 01:14:40.680
So when I say hot air balloon,

1761
01:14:40.680 --> 01:14:43.320
your file clerk runs down there and like,

1762
01:14:43.320 --> 01:14:45.680
okay, I was at a hot air balloon festival

1763
01:14:45.680 --> 01:14:48.960
in New Mexico or something and pulls that file out.

1764
01:14:48.960 --> 01:14:50.880
So if I can get your file clerk

1765
01:14:50.880 --> 01:14:53.520
to keep pulling files out throughout the day,

1766
01:14:53.520 --> 01:14:55.280
what the one thing the file clerk does

1767
01:14:55.280 --> 01:15:00.000
and this is a gross generalization is,

1768
01:15:00.000 --> 01:15:01.760
anything that's pulled out throughout that day

1769
01:15:01.760 --> 01:15:03.520
and if it's in one context,

1770
01:15:03.520 --> 01:15:06.520
the file clerk leaves them all out on the desk.

1771
01:15:08.120 --> 01:15:09.840
And if I can get enough files,

1772
01:15:09.840 --> 01:15:12.720
all the files that I want out on that desk,

1773
01:15:12.720 --> 01:15:14.720
that's going to influence every decision

1774
01:15:14.720 --> 01:15:16.680
that you make when you go home tonight.

1775
01:15:18.560 --> 01:15:20.680
So that's kind of the pre-swashing

1776
01:15:20.680 --> 01:15:23.960
except I'm putting it in there in the form of an archetype.

1777
01:15:24.040 --> 01:15:26.920
And if I get you to think David and Goliath,

1778
01:15:26.920 --> 01:15:30.560
I want you to think that this is the midpoint of that story,

1779
01:15:30.560 --> 01:15:31.600
not the end.

1780
01:15:32.600 --> 01:15:36.640
So if I just get you to think this is probably David and Goliath,

1781
01:15:36.640 --> 01:15:38.320
this is the middle part of the story.

1782
01:15:38.320 --> 01:15:41.440
This is when the little kid, the shepherd kid,

1783
01:15:41.440 --> 01:15:45.880
is walking down the hill to challenge the giant.

1784
01:15:45.880 --> 01:15:49.440
Your brain comes up with the ending to the story automatically.

1785
01:15:50.680 --> 01:15:53.000
So these archetypes are so woven into us

1786
01:15:53.000 --> 01:15:56.680
that we think if I could just complete an archetype story,

1787
01:15:56.680 --> 01:15:58.240
it's justice.

1788
01:15:58.240 --> 01:16:00.960
And what does archetype mean?

1789
01:16:00.960 --> 01:16:05.920
So an archetype is just like a brand of story.

1790
01:16:05.920 --> 01:16:08.200
So like a hero's journey,

1791
01:16:08.200 --> 01:16:10.080
like a beginning of a tragedy,

1792
01:16:10.080 --> 01:16:13.920
a loss and return, a rags to riches story,

1793
01:16:13.920 --> 01:16:18.640
a wounded healer story, all these classic story types.

1794
01:16:18.640 --> 01:16:20.240
So there's like 12 story types.

1795
01:16:20.240 --> 01:16:22.640
Joseph Campbell's talked a lot about this.

1796
01:16:23.520 --> 01:16:26.360
But if our brains has about 12 of these little archetypes,

1797
01:16:26.360 --> 01:16:29.040
and if it's like a wounded healer story,

1798
01:16:29.040 --> 01:16:31.280
and there's a redemption thing at the end,

1799
01:16:31.280 --> 01:16:33.520
which is called a redemption arc,

1800
01:16:33.520 --> 01:16:35.040
I'm gonna get the audience to see

1801
01:16:35.040 --> 01:16:38.600
that we're at the 75% mark right where it's about to happen.

1802
01:16:38.600 --> 01:16:40.960
And if I just get you to see a situation

1803
01:16:40.960 --> 01:16:43.400
through the lens of an archetype,

1804
01:16:43.400 --> 01:16:46.480
your brain automatically not just predicts,

1805
01:16:46.480 --> 01:16:48.720
but you know how it's gonna end.

1806
01:16:48.960 --> 01:16:51.760
And you want to make it in that way,

1807
01:16:51.760 --> 01:16:53.120
because it looks like justice,

1808
01:16:53.120 --> 01:16:54.600
it looks like the right thing to do,

1809
01:16:54.600 --> 01:16:57.280
and you don't even know why your brain is trying to do that,

1810
01:16:57.280 --> 01:17:00.160
even though I'm the one that's jammed the archetype

1811
01:17:00.160 --> 01:17:02.520
into your head for a couple of days.

1812
01:17:06.160 --> 01:17:08.520
So bringing this back to Debbie in Ohio.

1813
01:17:08.520 --> 01:17:12.600
Yeah. How might she use such a strategy in her own life

1814
01:17:12.600 --> 01:17:16.080
to get the best out of the people she works with

1815
01:17:16.080 --> 01:17:17.560
or those around her?

1816
01:17:17.640 --> 01:17:21.200
Yeah, so you can also use this as a profiling tool.

1817
01:17:21.200 --> 01:17:25.000
If I have, and if you take notes on the stuff

1818
01:17:25.000 --> 01:17:28.280
about people in your office, I would keep them private.

1819
01:17:28.280 --> 01:17:32.280
But figure out like this guy's on a,

1820
01:17:32.280 --> 01:17:33.960
you don't even have to know and memorize

1821
01:17:33.960 --> 01:17:35.280
all these 12 archetypes.

1822
01:17:35.280 --> 01:17:36.640
What movie are they in?

1823
01:17:36.640 --> 01:17:39.440
When they talk about their life, what movie are they in?

1824
01:17:39.440 --> 01:17:40.640
You have the one guy in the office

1825
01:17:40.640 --> 01:17:42.360
that wants to go on crazy adventures

1826
01:17:42.360 --> 01:17:43.920
and do stuff that nobody else has done.

1827
01:17:43.920 --> 01:17:46.480
This is that's a back to the future archetype.

1828
01:17:46.480 --> 01:17:48.280
You can make up your own archetypes.

1829
01:17:48.280 --> 01:17:50.760
But if they're doing all of this

1830
01:17:50.760 --> 01:17:52.400
and everything's going good,

1831
01:17:52.400 --> 01:17:54.720
what's the next thing they're going to predict?

1832
01:17:54.720 --> 01:17:57.000
They're going to have a problem coming up in their life.

1833
01:17:57.000 --> 01:17:59.480
So I know how they're going to predict their future

1834
01:17:59.480 --> 01:18:02.200
if I just know what story they're in.

1835
01:18:02.200 --> 01:18:04.160
Angiobas de Monte, who's that CIA spy

1836
01:18:04.160 --> 01:18:05.720
who I've had on the show a few times,

1837
01:18:05.720 --> 01:18:08.680
told me about his rice framework in espionage.

1838
01:18:08.680 --> 01:18:10.600
Reward ideology question in ego.

1839
01:18:11.720 --> 01:18:15.200
Reward being the things you want, like money, ideology being,

1840
01:18:15.200 --> 01:18:16.520
you know, doing this is good for your family,

1841
01:18:16.520 --> 01:18:18.360
doing this is good for your country,

1842
01:18:18.360 --> 01:18:20.720
the sea being coercion, which is pressurizing people

1843
01:18:20.720 --> 01:18:21.800
and the e being ego.

1844
01:18:21.800 --> 01:18:24.400
He said of all four of these ideology,

1845
01:18:24.400 --> 01:18:25.840
like understanding someone's ideology

1846
01:18:25.840 --> 01:18:29.480
is the most persuasive for when he was a spy.

1847
01:18:29.480 --> 01:18:31.880
And the way that I've kind of conceptualized that

1848
01:18:31.880 --> 01:18:33.560
and maybe built upon it a little bit,

1849
01:18:33.560 --> 01:18:35.200
and I'm saying that because I don't want to be butchering

1850
01:18:35.200 --> 01:18:39.760
his idea is I think everybody has a hero's journey

1851
01:18:39.760 --> 01:18:41.080
that they're on right now.

1852
01:18:41.080 --> 01:18:43.320
And when you're meeting them to get them to, you know,

1853
01:18:43.320 --> 01:18:44.960
maybe come and work at your company

1854
01:18:44.960 --> 01:18:46.520
or persuading them to do a deal,

1855
01:18:46.520 --> 01:18:50.040
like the first great challenge is listening to them long enough

1856
01:18:50.040 --> 01:18:53.320
for them to hand over their ideology to you,

1857
01:18:53.320 --> 01:18:54.400
so that you can speak to them,

1858
01:18:54.400 --> 01:18:57.080
not through your own ideology and what you want,

1859
01:18:57.080 --> 01:18:59.400
but you can talk through their ideology.

1860
01:18:59.400 --> 01:19:01.160
And like even with me, obviously,

1861
01:19:01.160 --> 01:19:02.800
there's like a hero's journey in my mind,

1862
01:19:02.800 --> 01:19:06.360
there's like a story of us that like is behind me,

1863
01:19:06.360 --> 01:19:08.400
but also I want to be ahead of me.

1864
01:19:08.400 --> 01:19:09.880
And if you know, if you can listen long enough

1865
01:19:09.880 --> 01:19:12.160
to figure out what that is, you can tell me a case,

1866
01:19:12.280 --> 01:19:14.160
I'm going to say this Range Rover,

1867
01:19:14.160 --> 01:19:17.920
and tell me the features of it or the benefits of it

1868
01:19:17.920 --> 01:19:21.320
through the heroes journey that I want to live out.

1869
01:19:21.320 --> 01:19:22.880
Everyone listening right now has that.

1870
01:19:22.880 --> 01:19:25.360
Like you have a hero's journey that you're on,

1871
01:19:25.360 --> 01:19:27.040
and the most persuasive thing I think anyone could do

1872
01:19:27.040 --> 01:19:28.880
is not just give you money or whatever,

1873
01:19:28.880 --> 01:19:32.640
is to let them know that the thing you're offering

1874
01:19:32.640 --> 01:19:35.560
is going to realize that story,

1875
01:19:35.560 --> 01:19:37.960
or at least the next chapter.

1876
01:19:37.960 --> 01:19:41.840
Okay, so we don't always want to sell a completion.

1877
01:19:41.880 --> 01:19:44.200
We just want to say this is the logical next step

1878
01:19:44.200 --> 01:19:45.360
of this story.

1879
01:19:45.360 --> 01:19:48.320
Like this guy did a bad thing.

1880
01:19:48.320 --> 01:19:49.960
He needs to be punished,

1881
01:19:49.960 --> 01:19:51.360
and what happens after the punishment?

1882
01:19:51.360 --> 01:19:52.720
This is the learning the lesson

1883
01:19:52.720 --> 01:19:54.800
and being redeemed arc.

1884
01:19:54.800 --> 01:19:56.960
So we're not going to tell a jury

1885
01:19:56.960 --> 01:19:59.280
or suggest to a jury that he's going to go learn a lesson

1886
01:19:59.280 --> 01:20:01.200
and then come back, we're just going to suggest

1887
01:20:01.200 --> 01:20:03.280
like what's this next thing that happens?

1888
01:20:03.280 --> 01:20:04.600
So if somebody has this arc,

1889
01:20:04.600 --> 01:20:06.640
if we figure out what is my journey,

1890
01:20:06.640 --> 01:20:08.760
what is what art type in my living right now,

1891
01:20:08.760 --> 01:20:09.840
what type of story?

1892
01:20:10.840 --> 01:20:15.040
Then I can figure out how my brain is predicting the future

1893
01:20:15.040 --> 01:20:20.520
because art types are so woven into our brains without language.

1894
01:20:20.520 --> 01:20:24.800
So the language is not necessary for the archetype to exist.

1895
01:20:24.800 --> 01:20:27.680
So if you know someone else's archetype,

1896
01:20:27.680 --> 01:20:30.640
you can understand how they're going to predict their future

1897
01:20:30.640 --> 01:20:32.000
and how they're going to make choices

1898
01:20:32.000 --> 01:20:33.960
and how do you get their archetype out of them.

1899
01:20:33.960 --> 01:20:34.960
You're going to hear it.

1900
01:20:34.960 --> 01:20:38.840
It's so funny, you don't even need special questions.

1901
01:20:38.920 --> 01:20:41.560
You asked me about their life, asking where they're from,

1902
01:20:41.560 --> 01:20:43.720
asking me to give me this summary of like,

1903
01:20:43.720 --> 01:20:45.400
what happened when you worked there at that company?

1904
01:20:45.400 --> 01:20:48.320
Well, I did this and this and this and nobody thanked me.

1905
01:20:48.320 --> 01:20:49.880
It was a thankless job.

1906
01:20:49.880 --> 01:20:52.480
The manager was a total asshole.

1907
01:20:52.480 --> 01:20:54.840
So now you're starting to see an archetype,

1908
01:20:54.840 --> 01:20:56.560
like the guy was in a tragedy there.

1909
01:20:56.560 --> 01:20:57.720
The guy was a victim.

1910
01:20:57.720 --> 01:20:59.080
And they want to be appreciated.

1911
01:20:59.080 --> 01:21:02.600
Yeah, so now he's here at this brand new company for redemption.

1912
01:21:02.600 --> 01:21:04.920
So now we're in a redemption story art.

1913
01:21:05.760 --> 01:21:06.600
That makes sense.

1914
01:21:06.600 --> 01:21:07.320
Yeah, it makes perfect sense.

1915
01:21:07.360 --> 01:21:11.000
So it just comes out naturally in everybody's speech.

1916
01:21:11.000 --> 01:21:13.800
But the funny thing is I've never seen it applied

1917
01:21:13.800 --> 01:21:18.800
to courtrooms in the way that we do it.

1918
01:21:20.000 --> 01:21:22.080
And it's just such a powerful tool.

1919
01:21:23.960 --> 01:21:26.280
The number one thing that I specialize in

1920
01:21:26.280 --> 01:21:29.000
is this thing called the time distance problem.

1921
01:21:29.000 --> 01:21:32.720
This is what I wanted to solve throughout my entire career.

1922
01:21:32.720 --> 01:21:37.200
So we have two axes, our vertical axes

1923
01:21:37.200 --> 01:21:38.320
and horizontal axes.

1924
01:21:38.320 --> 01:21:42.440
So this horizontal axes is the distance line.

1925
01:21:45.240 --> 01:21:48.920
And the vertical axes going up and down is the time line.

1926
01:21:51.640 --> 01:21:55.040
Okay, so we have time and we have distance.

1927
01:21:55.040 --> 01:22:00.120
So distance is how far away from a behavioral norm,

1928
01:22:00.120 --> 01:22:02.840
can I get a person to go?

1929
01:22:02.840 --> 01:22:07.240
So can I get Steven to confess to a crime?

1930
01:22:07.240 --> 01:22:09.880
Like doing something that's going to send you to jail

1931
01:22:09.880 --> 01:22:14.040
for 30 years is way outside of your behavioral norm.

1932
01:22:14.040 --> 01:22:17.080
And for me to be able to do that in an interrogation room,

1933
01:22:17.080 --> 01:22:20.880
I have to do some techniques, I have to do some crazy stuff.

1934
01:22:20.880 --> 01:22:23.800
If I do it in sales, then I'm getting you to make a decision

1935
01:22:23.800 --> 01:22:25.440
that you maybe otherwise wouldn't have.

1936
01:22:25.440 --> 01:22:28.560
Maybe if I'm in timeshare sales or something like that.

1937
01:22:29.560 --> 01:22:35.560
And at the end of the day, some people can get people

1938
01:22:35.560 --> 01:22:39.680
far on the distance line, but it's going to take forever

1939
01:22:39.680 --> 01:22:40.520
to do it.

1940
01:22:40.520 --> 01:22:43.880
It's going to take maybe a year to make something happen

1941
01:22:43.880 --> 01:22:46.760
of persuading them and trying to sell to them, etc.

1942
01:22:46.760 --> 01:22:47.920
Yeah.

1943
01:22:47.920 --> 01:22:52.120
And the last interrogations I did that were for a corporation

1944
01:22:52.120 --> 01:22:57.600
in California, I had to do 45 interrogations

1945
01:22:57.640 --> 01:22:59.240
in like two days.

1946
01:22:59.240 --> 01:23:02.320
And I had maybe 25 minutes per interrogation.

1947
01:23:02.320 --> 01:23:06.160
The least amount of time I've ever been given.

1948
01:23:06.160 --> 01:23:08.480
And that was the time distance problem.

1949
01:23:08.480 --> 01:23:11.800
So how do I layer on the techniques, the identity,

1950
01:23:11.800 --> 01:23:13.800
the perception, context, and permission?

1951
01:23:13.800 --> 01:23:15.760
How do I get that layered into a conversation

1952
01:23:15.760 --> 01:23:19.200
as fast as possible so I can shift someone's behavior

1953
01:23:19.200 --> 01:23:21.040
as fast as possible?

1954
01:23:21.040 --> 01:23:23.040
So everything that you're looking at is typically

1955
01:23:23.040 --> 01:23:24.760
a time distance problem.

1956
01:23:24.760 --> 01:23:26.320
And there is one more universal thing.

1957
01:23:26.440 --> 01:23:28.480
And this may not even fit anywhere in the episode

1958
01:23:28.480 --> 01:23:29.760
because it's random.

1959
01:23:29.760 --> 01:23:31.720
But you were talking early about like carrying this trauma

1960
01:23:31.720 --> 01:23:32.640
in your backpack.

1961
01:23:32.640 --> 01:23:35.640
So many people are trying to get rid of this trauma.

1962
01:23:35.640 --> 01:23:40.640
The reason that psychedelics can rewire PTSD so effing fast

1963
01:23:41.560 --> 01:23:44.160
is that it doesn't delete your trauma at all.

1964
01:23:44.160 --> 01:23:45.160
The memory is still there.

1965
01:23:45.160 --> 01:23:47.760
The whole, all that stuff is still there.

1966
01:23:47.760 --> 01:23:51.240
It changes the perspective so massively

1967
01:23:51.240 --> 01:23:52.640
that you can still see the event,

1968
01:23:52.640 --> 01:23:55.160
but it forces you to see all of that stuff

1969
01:23:55.160 --> 01:23:57.120
through a different lens.

1970
01:23:57.120 --> 01:24:00.080
So if you look at somebody that has some depression stuff

1971
01:24:00.080 --> 01:24:02.760
going on, some weird mental stuff going on in their life,

1972
01:24:02.760 --> 01:24:07.000
so much of what ails us, even someone who's lacking confidence

1973
01:24:07.000 --> 01:24:08.880
and they say, I can't be a leader,

1974
01:24:08.880 --> 01:24:11.200
I can't go into this media, I can't do this negotiation,

1975
01:24:11.200 --> 01:24:13.160
it's a perspective problem.

1976
01:24:13.160 --> 01:24:16.160
It's like 90% of the problems that people have

1977
01:24:16.160 --> 01:24:20.160
that I work with is just a perspective issue and nothing else.

1978
01:24:20.160 --> 01:24:23.560
And occasionally, if somebody's been going through a lot

1979
01:24:23.560 --> 01:24:27.040
for a long time, I would get your neurotransmitters tested

1980
01:24:27.040 --> 01:24:28.960
and get your brain tested.

1981
01:24:28.960 --> 01:24:30.960
And see if you've got some chemical imbalance

1982
01:24:30.960 --> 01:24:32.280
that's causing a lot of stuff,

1983
01:24:32.280 --> 01:24:35.640
just sometimes a vitamin deficiency can cause a lot of that.

1984
01:24:35.640 --> 01:24:37.920
Do any of you remember a conversation I had on this podcast

1985
01:24:37.920 --> 01:24:40.240
with anthropologist Dr. Daniel Lieberman?

1986
01:24:40.240 --> 01:24:42.520
It was one of the most viewed conversations

1987
01:24:42.520 --> 01:24:44.200
of all time on the direverseo.

1988
01:24:44.200 --> 01:24:47.040
And interestingly, the most replayed moment

1989
01:24:47.040 --> 01:24:49.320
of that entire conversation was when I talked about

1990
01:24:49.320 --> 01:24:51.800
a specific pair of shoes that I wear.

1991
01:24:51.800 --> 01:24:53.280
They're called Barefoot Shoes

1992
01:24:53.280 --> 01:24:55.920
and they're made by a brand called Vivo Barefoot

1993
01:24:55.920 --> 01:24:58.040
who have become one of the sponsors of this show now.

1994
01:24:58.040 --> 01:25:01.000
All of their shoes have significantly reduced support,

1995
01:25:01.000 --> 01:25:02.840
which gives my feet the opportunity

1996
01:25:02.840 --> 01:25:05.000
to strengthen just by wearing them

1997
01:25:05.000 --> 01:25:07.160
and research from Liverpool University backs this up.

1998
01:25:07.160 --> 01:25:09.640
They've shown that wearing Vivo Barefoot Shoes

1999
01:25:09.640 --> 01:25:14.160
for six months can increase foot strength by up to 60%.

2000
01:25:14.160 --> 01:25:16.200
So if you want to start strengthening your feet,

2001
01:25:16.200 --> 01:25:18.120
which are the foundation for the rest of your body,

2002
01:25:18.120 --> 01:25:20.800
head to VivoBarefoot.com slash DOAC.

2003
01:25:20.800 --> 01:25:23.600
And if you do that, I'll give you 15% off

2004
01:25:23.600 --> 01:25:27.840
when you use my code, Stephen B15.

2005
01:25:27.840 --> 01:25:29.120
Use that code at checkout

2006
01:25:29.120 --> 01:25:32.840
and I'll also give you a 100 day money back guarantee.

2007
01:25:32.840 --> 01:25:35.800
Stephen B15, enjoy.

2008
01:25:36.920 --> 01:25:39.240
We have finally caved in.

2009
01:25:39.240 --> 01:25:42.000
So many of you have asked us if we could bundle

2010
01:25:42.000 --> 01:25:44.120
the conversation cards with the 1% diary.

2011
01:25:44.120 --> 01:25:45.600
For those of you that don't know,

2012
01:25:45.600 --> 01:25:47.800
every single time a guest sits here with me in the chair,

2013
01:25:47.800 --> 01:25:49.800
they leave a question in the direverseo.

2014
01:25:49.800 --> 01:25:52.080
And then I ask that question to the next guest.

2015
01:25:52.080 --> 01:25:54.600
We don't release those questions in any environment

2016
01:25:54.600 --> 01:25:57.360
other than on these incredible conversation cards.

2017
01:25:57.360 --> 01:26:00.400
These have become a fantastic tool for people in relationships,

2018
01:26:00.400 --> 01:26:03.040
people in teams, in big corporations,

2019
01:26:03.040 --> 01:26:04.960
and also family members to connect with each other.

2020
01:26:04.960 --> 01:26:07.120
With that, we also have the 1% diary,

2021
01:26:07.120 --> 01:26:10.360
which is this incredible tool to change habits in your life.

2022
01:26:10.360 --> 01:26:12.040
So many of you have asked if it was possible

2023
01:26:12.040 --> 01:26:13.680
to buy both at the same time,

2024
01:26:13.680 --> 01:26:16.080
especially people in big companies.

2025
01:26:16.080 --> 01:26:18.920
So what we've done is we've bundled them together

2026
01:26:18.960 --> 01:26:20.720
and you can buy both at the same time.

2027
01:26:20.720 --> 01:26:22.080
And if you want to drive connection

2028
01:26:22.080 --> 01:26:24.480
and then still habit change in your company,

2029
01:26:24.480 --> 01:26:26.320
head to the diary.com to inquire

2030
01:26:26.320 --> 01:26:28.200
and our team will be in touch.

2031
01:26:28.200 --> 01:26:29.200
Outside of psychedelics,

2032
01:26:29.200 --> 01:26:32.520
is there any useful ways you found to change one's perception?

2033
01:26:34.040 --> 01:26:37.120
There's, they have all kinds of like sleep deprivation,

2034
01:26:37.120 --> 01:26:40.000
not sleep deprivation, sensory deprivation tanks,

2035
01:26:40.000 --> 01:26:42.120
a darkness retreats.

2036
01:26:42.120 --> 01:26:44.560
All those things that people talk about with breath work

2037
01:26:44.560 --> 01:26:46.120
and they go on these big ass retreats.

2038
01:26:46.120 --> 01:26:48.360
I don't know anything about those things.

2039
01:26:48.360 --> 01:26:50.920
I do study psychedelics a lot.

2040
01:26:50.920 --> 01:26:54.400
And I think Johns Hopkins this year,

2041
01:26:54.400 --> 01:26:56.640
I think said that it was the most effective drug

2042
01:26:56.640 --> 01:26:58.360
ever tested in human history.

2043
01:26:58.360 --> 01:27:00.960
For depression, treatment resistant depression or?

2044
01:27:00.960 --> 01:27:03.000
For psychological problems.

2045
01:27:03.000 --> 01:27:06.600
The treatment resistant depression, PTSD, addiction.

2046
01:27:06.600 --> 01:27:09.000
And now we have this new drug called IBAGain.

2047
01:27:09.000 --> 01:27:11.360
It's not new, it's been around for thousands of years,

2048
01:27:11.360 --> 01:27:14.520
but it's helping people with addiction.

2049
01:27:14.520 --> 01:27:19.520
And there's now people able to do intravenous DMT

2050
01:27:21.240 --> 01:27:23.560
for like five hours at a time instead of five minutes

2051
01:27:23.560 --> 01:27:24.400
at a time.

2052
01:27:25.240 --> 01:27:27.120
And I was the 41st person in the world

2053
01:27:27.120 --> 01:27:29.760
to do the intravenous DMT.

2054
01:27:29.760 --> 01:27:30.760
What did you do?

2055
01:27:31.360 --> 01:27:32.200
Denver.

2056
01:27:34.360 --> 01:27:39.360
I did it because DMT has a massive boost of BDNF,

2057
01:27:39.360 --> 01:27:41.880
which is brain-derived neutrophic factor.

2058
01:27:41.880 --> 01:27:44.320
And it also produces a lot of plasticity,

2059
01:27:44.320 --> 01:27:45.520
a lot of brain plasticity.

2060
01:27:45.520 --> 01:27:46.960
So I was trying to fix my brain.

2061
01:27:46.960 --> 01:27:48.120
I've got a brain disease.

2062
01:27:49.200 --> 01:27:51.400
So I went down there on this five hour thing

2063
01:27:51.400 --> 01:27:54.760
and I've been completely different ever since that day.

2064
01:27:54.760 --> 01:27:57.240
So it is a massive benefit.

2065
01:27:57.240 --> 01:27:59.840
And it's heavy though.

2066
01:27:59.840 --> 01:28:03.160
DMT is a heavy thing to go through.

2067
01:28:03.160 --> 01:28:05.360
I don't see, I can't see any reason

2068
01:28:05.360 --> 01:28:07.800
why any human being would use it recreationally.

2069
01:28:09.200 --> 01:28:11.120
For anyone that hasn't experienced DMT,

2070
01:28:11.120 --> 01:28:12.960
how would you describe the experience?

2071
01:28:12.960 --> 01:28:14.000
I know that's going to be hard to do

2072
01:28:14.000 --> 01:28:15.800
because some of my friends have done it.

2073
01:28:15.800 --> 01:28:18.000
And when you ask them to describe it,

2074
01:28:18.000 --> 01:28:20.080
it seems to be quite abstract.

2075
01:28:20.080 --> 01:28:25.800
Yeah, it's like if we had some two-dimensional creatures

2076
01:28:25.800 --> 01:28:27.400
that were living on this piece of paper right here

2077
01:28:27.400 --> 01:28:31.120
on the table, and one of those creatures figured out

2078
01:28:31.120 --> 01:28:33.320
that he can smoke some DMT.

2079
01:28:33.320 --> 01:28:35.440
And that somehow enabled us to peel

2080
01:28:35.440 --> 01:28:37.040
this two-dimensional creature

2081
01:28:37.040 --> 01:28:38.960
to where it could see in three dimensions

2082
01:28:38.960 --> 01:28:41.000
and see everything in this room.

2083
01:28:41.840 --> 01:28:42.840
That's a DMT.

2084
01:28:43.920 --> 01:28:45.720
You're getting peeled out of reality

2085
01:28:45.720 --> 01:28:47.920
into some other realm.

2086
01:28:47.920 --> 01:28:50.440
And the weird thing is every scientist

2087
01:28:50.440 --> 01:28:52.760
that I know is studying DMT,

2088
01:28:52.760 --> 01:28:55.440
not one of them thinks it's a hallucination.

2089
01:28:55.440 --> 01:28:56.800
What do they think it is?

2090
01:28:56.800 --> 01:29:00.360
I think the more familiar someone is with DMT,

2091
01:29:00.360 --> 01:29:03.440
the less certain they are about what the hell's going on.

2092
01:29:04.640 --> 01:29:08.160
But everyone, everyone, literally everyone who uses DMT

2093
01:29:08.160 --> 01:29:11.040
pretty much goes to the same exact places.

2094
01:29:11.040 --> 01:29:12.680
And they all meet the same entities,

2095
01:29:12.680 --> 01:29:15.080
the same seven or eight different types of entities.

2096
01:29:15.080 --> 01:29:17.160
And it's been the same for 4,500 years

2097
01:29:17.160 --> 01:29:19.120
of recorded history with DMT.

2098
01:29:20.120 --> 01:29:22.520
And DMT is something we make in our own body.

2099
01:29:22.520 --> 01:29:24.760
It's an endogenous chemical.

2100
01:29:24.760 --> 01:29:27.200
Has it changed your perception of what reality really is?

2101
01:29:27.200 --> 01:29:28.520
100%.

2102
01:29:28.520 --> 01:29:29.360
Yeah.

2103
01:29:29.360 --> 01:29:33.080
It's so much more real than this reality.

2104
01:29:33.080 --> 01:29:38.080
It's like, it's so ineffable.

2105
01:29:38.280 --> 01:29:40.360
There are no words that can describe it.

2106
01:29:40.360 --> 01:29:44.680
But it's a thousand, maybe a million times more real

2107
01:29:44.680 --> 01:29:49.560
than this in such a way that just coming back to this

2108
01:29:49.560 --> 01:29:51.960
feels like everything is kind of claymation

2109
01:29:51.960 --> 01:29:52.960
for a little while.

2110
01:29:52.960 --> 01:29:53.960
Claimation.

2111
01:29:53.960 --> 01:29:56.960
Or just fake, like a cartoon of some kind.

2112
01:29:56.960 --> 01:29:59.480
It's just really low resolution.

2113
01:29:59.480 --> 01:30:03.720
And I come back with no certainty about anything.

2114
01:30:03.720 --> 01:30:07.080
And I think everybody comes back with that lack of certainty.

2115
01:30:07.120 --> 01:30:09.320
You're not coming back and be like, I saw this exact thing

2116
01:30:09.320 --> 01:30:10.160
and here's what it means.

2117
01:30:10.160 --> 01:30:13.920
And here's how the universe is created and all of that.

2118
01:30:13.920 --> 01:30:15.400
But you go up there and you come back

2119
01:30:15.400 --> 01:30:18.560
and you're like something about this plane

2120
01:30:18.560 --> 01:30:19.960
doesn't feel real anymore.

2121
01:30:19.960 --> 01:30:21.640
And that is a permanent shift that's hard

2122
01:30:21.640 --> 01:30:23.120
for some people to make.

2123
01:30:23.120 --> 01:30:27.440
And you can't unsee that you were able to poke your head

2124
01:30:27.440 --> 01:30:30.800
out of the side door of the Truman Show

2125
01:30:30.800 --> 01:30:33.520
and look out backstage for a little while.

2126
01:30:34.520 --> 01:30:38.000
So has it made you believe that this isn't real?

2127
01:30:38.000 --> 01:30:41.240
This reality that we're living in now is not real?

2128
01:30:41.240 --> 01:30:42.880
We'd have to define real.

2129
01:30:42.880 --> 01:30:44.640
But the only...

2130
01:30:47.040 --> 01:30:48.280
How would you define real?

2131
01:30:48.280 --> 01:30:49.200
Yeah, that's a good question.

2132
01:30:49.200 --> 01:30:50.200
So I just see it.

2133
01:30:50.200 --> 01:30:52.080
You can touch it, you can measure it,

2134
01:30:52.080 --> 01:30:55.000
you could taste it, smell it, would that be real?

2135
01:30:55.000 --> 01:30:57.840
Do you think we're living in a simulation?

2136
01:30:57.840 --> 01:30:59.360
That we have to define simulation.

2137
01:30:59.360 --> 01:31:03.120
Because I think every society has this hubris

2138
01:31:03.120 --> 01:31:06.360
of the universe is whatever's cool to us right now.

2139
01:31:06.360 --> 01:31:08.800
Electricity came out and the universe was energy.

2140
01:31:08.800 --> 01:31:10.440
Industrial revolution came out

2141
01:31:10.440 --> 01:31:12.800
and the whole universe was a giant machine.

2142
01:31:12.800 --> 01:31:13.840
And right now everybody says,

2143
01:31:13.840 --> 01:31:16.960
oh, we just discovered computers,

2144
01:31:16.960 --> 01:31:18.800
the universe must be a computer.

2145
01:31:18.800 --> 01:31:22.320
It's like the hubris of every generation.

2146
01:31:22.320 --> 01:31:26.080
What I mean by simulation, I think like is it rendered

2147
01:31:26.080 --> 01:31:28.400
in some way by something?

2148
01:31:30.800 --> 01:31:35.000
I study this stuff all day, every day of my life.

2149
01:31:35.000 --> 01:31:36.800
And I think that the more we...

2150
01:31:36.800 --> 01:31:39.800
The more discoveries we have in particle physics

2151
01:31:39.800 --> 01:31:41.360
and quantum mechanics,

2152
01:31:41.360 --> 01:31:44.640
the more they're proving their hermetic principles right.

2153
01:31:44.640 --> 01:31:45.640
What's that?

2154
01:31:45.640 --> 01:31:47.920
These are the seven ancient principles

2155
01:31:47.920 --> 01:31:50.360
of this guy named Hermes Trismogistus.

2156
01:31:50.360 --> 01:31:53.880
Also known as Thoth, like an Egyptian guy.

2157
01:31:53.880 --> 01:31:56.400
They're confused about his name.

2158
01:31:56.400 --> 01:32:00.640
But he's like these first two principles

2159
01:32:00.640 --> 01:32:01.480
are the most important.

2160
01:32:01.480 --> 01:32:03.480
The first one is all is mind.

2161
01:32:03.480 --> 01:32:04.480
All is mind.

2162
01:32:04.480 --> 01:32:05.320
All is mind.

2163
01:32:05.320 --> 01:32:06.400
The all is mind.

2164
01:32:06.400 --> 01:32:08.640
The universe is mental.

2165
01:32:08.640 --> 01:32:11.080
And then the second one is as above so below.

2166
01:32:12.120 --> 01:32:15.440
And here's how I explain this to my son a couple of days ago.

2167
01:32:15.440 --> 01:32:17.600
I said, have you ever had a dream

2168
01:32:17.600 --> 01:32:19.720
where there's like a building in the dream?

2169
01:32:19.720 --> 01:32:22.280
Maybe there's a house in front of you.

2170
01:32:22.280 --> 01:32:24.080
And what are you looking at the house with?

2171
01:32:24.080 --> 01:32:28.120
And he said, well, my eyes said, why?

2172
01:32:28.120 --> 01:32:29.840
Which eyes are they?

2173
01:32:29.840 --> 01:32:32.080
Are they your eyes that you're seeing the house with?

2174
01:32:32.080 --> 01:32:32.920
And he said, no.

2175
01:32:32.920 --> 01:32:34.760
Because you're imagining your own set of eyes

2176
01:32:34.760 --> 01:32:36.880
to see the house with in your dream.

2177
01:32:36.880 --> 01:32:38.920
Your eyes aren't there.

2178
01:32:38.920 --> 01:32:39.960
Your body isn't there.

2179
01:32:39.960 --> 01:32:42.800
So you're imagining the whole body and the world.

2180
01:32:42.800 --> 01:32:44.320
And I said, what's the distance between you

2181
01:32:44.320 --> 01:32:46.360
and that house in your dream?

2182
01:32:46.360 --> 01:32:48.160
And he said 30 feet.

2183
01:32:48.160 --> 01:32:52.000
I said, what is the air made out of between you and the house?

2184
01:32:52.040 --> 01:32:52.840
And he said, air.

2185
01:32:52.840 --> 01:32:54.280
And I said, you have air in your dreams?

2186
01:32:54.280 --> 01:32:55.520
Is it real air?

2187
01:32:55.520 --> 01:32:58.280
And he said, no, it's just, it's my brain.

2188
01:32:58.280 --> 01:33:00.720
And I said, so is there a distance between you and the house?

2189
01:33:00.720 --> 01:33:01.920
He said, no.

2190
01:33:01.920 --> 01:33:03.800
What's the house made out of me?

2191
01:33:03.800 --> 01:33:06.240
What's the air made out of me?

2192
01:33:06.240 --> 01:33:07.480
The entire thing is me.

2193
01:33:07.480 --> 01:33:09.120
The ground I'm standing on the house,

2194
01:33:09.120 --> 01:33:11.840
the clouds in the sky.

2195
01:33:11.840 --> 01:33:15.480
So in a dream, you can verifiably prove

2196
01:33:15.480 --> 01:33:17.040
that something is real.

2197
01:33:17.040 --> 01:33:17.880
You can test it.

2198
01:33:17.880 --> 01:33:19.880
You can touch it and all that.

2199
01:33:19.880 --> 01:33:23.840
And the perception of it is very much real.

2200
01:33:23.840 --> 01:33:27.680
So the theory now, and I don't have any certainty about this.

2201
01:33:27.680 --> 01:33:29.680
But one interesting theory that I've heard

2202
01:33:29.680 --> 01:33:33.000
from many different neuroscientists,

2203
01:33:33.000 --> 01:33:35.640
is that if we look at, as above so below,

2204
01:33:35.640 --> 01:33:39.000
like a universe spins like a DNA double helix,

2205
01:33:39.000 --> 01:33:40.720
you can zoom in on a human eyeball

2206
01:33:40.720 --> 01:33:43.120
and it looks the same as a nebula.

2207
01:33:43.120 --> 01:33:46.440
What if dreams are this level, level one,

2208
01:33:46.440 --> 01:33:49.520
and this is like level two of that?

2209
01:33:49.520 --> 01:33:52.040
Where we're hallucinating distance.

2210
01:33:52.040 --> 01:33:53.320
We're hallucinating.

2211
01:33:53.320 --> 01:33:57.320
And I think whatever their case is, I have no idea.

2212
01:33:57.320 --> 01:33:59.880
I have no theories about it myself.

2213
01:33:59.880 --> 01:34:01.880
But whatever the case is, I do think

2214
01:34:01.880 --> 01:34:07.120
that separation is the greatest lie ever told to the entire world.

2215
01:34:07.120 --> 01:34:09.600
Of like you are separate from that person.

2216
01:34:09.600 --> 01:34:11.920
You are separate from this.

2217
01:34:11.920 --> 01:34:14.640
And how people say, I need to go spend time in nature.

2218
01:34:14.640 --> 01:34:16.520
Like you are nature.

2219
01:34:16.520 --> 01:34:18.000
That's part of who you are.

2220
01:34:18.000 --> 01:34:19.400
You're made out of that stuff.

2221
01:34:19.400 --> 01:34:22.440
You're made out of that dirt.

2222
01:34:22.440 --> 01:34:24.800
So I think the illusion of separation

2223
01:34:24.800 --> 01:34:27.960
is the one thing that I think will help a lot of people.

2224
01:34:27.960 --> 01:34:31.760
And that's why psychedelics can really just rewire

2225
01:34:31.760 --> 01:34:34.840
somebody's brain so, so fast.

2226
01:34:34.840 --> 01:34:37.920
It just deletes that separation.

2227
01:34:37.920 --> 01:34:41.200
I feel like I just had some DMT.

2228
01:34:41.200 --> 01:34:42.880
Because you said, you know, level one is dreams,

2229
01:34:42.880 --> 01:34:44.240
level two is maybe this reality.

2230
01:34:44.240 --> 01:34:48.240
So the question in my mind was, what's level three?

2231
01:34:48.240 --> 01:34:52.280
Yeah, then that would maybe be what you see on DMT.

2232
01:34:52.280 --> 01:34:55.680
You said that world was more real than this one.

2233
01:34:55.680 --> 01:34:59.680
Oh, yeah, exponentially, immeasurably.

2234
01:34:59.680 --> 01:35:01.840
Why, how do you quantify realness?

2235
01:35:01.840 --> 01:35:04.400
Like what's the measuring stick there?

2236
01:35:04.400 --> 01:35:05.400
It...

2237
01:35:08.120 --> 01:35:10.920
There are no words for it.

2238
01:35:10.920 --> 01:35:13.360
Has this changed your view on religion?

2239
01:35:13.360 --> 01:35:14.320
Yeah.

2240
01:35:14.320 --> 01:35:15.600
How has it changed your view?

2241
01:35:15.600 --> 01:35:17.120
I wasn't really a religious person.

2242
01:35:17.120 --> 01:35:20.920
I think it made me a much more spiritual person.

2243
01:35:20.920 --> 01:35:24.440
And I think before any psychedelic therapy

2244
01:35:24.440 --> 01:35:28.240
that I went through, I was performing spirituality.

2245
01:35:28.240 --> 01:35:31.920
So spirituality was kind of something I did to show people.

2246
01:35:31.920 --> 01:35:34.840
Yeah, about you, about you, to single, about yourself.

2247
01:35:34.840 --> 01:35:39.920
And now spirituality, you kind of see it like it's not a big deal.

2248
01:35:39.920 --> 01:35:42.160
It doesn't, you don't have to go by

2249
01:35:42.160 --> 01:35:44.600
linen yoga pants and wooden beads

2250
01:35:44.600 --> 01:35:47.480
and bathe in essential oils to be spiritual.

2251
01:35:47.480 --> 01:35:51.280
Like you can just maybe have a hand up there

2252
01:35:51.280 --> 01:35:52.920
and be less certain.

2253
01:35:52.920 --> 01:35:55.520
I think the certainty is the enemy.

2254
01:35:55.520 --> 01:35:56.960
Like we haven't been here very long.

2255
01:35:56.960 --> 01:36:00.120
We're very, very newborn creatures on this planet.

2256
01:36:00.120 --> 01:36:02.080
Has it made you more empathetic?

2257
01:36:02.080 --> 01:36:03.760
Unbelievably so.

2258
01:36:03.760 --> 01:36:04.600
Yeah.

2259
01:36:05.960 --> 01:36:10.400
As the end of the day, everybody wants to...

2260
01:36:10.400 --> 01:36:12.400
Like after your first or second time

2261
01:36:12.400 --> 01:36:13.560
going to psychedelic therapy,

2262
01:36:13.560 --> 01:36:14.800
you're like, oh, I need to understand

2263
01:36:14.800 --> 01:36:16.400
the secrets of the universe now.

2264
01:36:17.480 --> 01:36:20.000
Which you go in there with this like very egoic,

2265
01:36:20.920 --> 01:36:24.040
ego-centric desires.

2266
01:36:24.040 --> 01:36:25.680
And then they're like, okay, you want to understand

2267
01:36:25.680 --> 01:36:27.040
the universe, they'll show it all to you.

2268
01:36:27.040 --> 01:36:29.240
And your brain's not capable of understanding it,

2269
01:36:29.240 --> 01:36:31.640
remembering it, or translating it

2270
01:36:31.640 --> 01:36:34.280
once you come back anyway.

2271
01:36:34.280 --> 01:36:39.040
And I think over time, you learn that the more ego I have,

2272
01:36:39.040 --> 01:36:40.840
it's like I'm performing.

2273
01:36:40.840 --> 01:36:42.600
And then every time I go back in there

2274
01:36:42.600 --> 01:36:45.480
every time like I kind of reflect on that experience,

2275
01:36:45.480 --> 01:36:50.480
it helps me to unzip my little ego costume a little bit more.

2276
01:36:52.320 --> 01:36:55.520
Did you know that you can get banned from DMT?

2277
01:36:55.520 --> 01:36:56.360
Really?

2278
01:36:56.360 --> 01:36:58.400
Dude, you gotta look this up.

2279
01:36:58.400 --> 01:37:00.600
There are thousands of people out there

2280
01:37:00.600 --> 01:37:03.360
who are using DMT recreationally

2281
01:37:03.360 --> 01:37:05.560
and the beings up there.

2282
01:37:05.560 --> 01:37:08.240
Basically told them, you are done

2283
01:37:08.240 --> 01:37:10.240
and you're banned from DMT.

2284
01:37:10.240 --> 01:37:13.160
And the journey stops right there in that moment.

2285
01:37:13.160 --> 01:37:14.880
And the guy can take hit after hit,

2286
01:37:14.880 --> 01:37:17.320
after hit after hit of DMT and nothing happens.

2287
01:37:19.200 --> 01:37:22.920
You can be banned from that realm or whatever it is.

2288
01:37:22.920 --> 01:37:24.640
I think they call it hyperspace now.

2289
01:37:25.920 --> 01:37:27.960
In the culture surrounding DMT,

2290
01:37:27.960 --> 01:37:29.960
there is a widely reported anecdote

2291
01:37:29.960 --> 01:37:33.560
phenomenon called being locked out of hyperspace.

2292
01:37:33.560 --> 01:37:35.960
Many frequent users report reaching a point

2293
01:37:35.960 --> 01:37:37.560
where the drug simply stops working

2294
01:37:37.560 --> 01:37:39.520
as expected regardless of the dose.

2295
01:37:40.760 --> 01:37:43.040
The common descriptions include the waiting room war,

2296
01:37:43.040 --> 01:37:44.840
getting stuck in the initial onset phase

2297
01:37:44.840 --> 01:37:46.280
and being unable to break through.

2298
01:37:46.280 --> 01:37:49.480
The grey room, seeing only flat colorless

2299
01:37:49.480 --> 01:37:52.360
or dull visuals instead of the visual vibrant geometry.

2300
01:37:52.360 --> 01:37:54.320
The hypersnap, a terrifying

2301
01:37:54.320 --> 01:37:56.160
or deeply uncomfortable experience

2302
01:37:56.160 --> 01:37:58.920
where entities appear to tell you

2303
01:37:58.920 --> 01:38:02.400
that you aren't welcome or shouldn't be here anymore.

2304
01:38:02.400 --> 01:38:04.200
The sudden blackout.

2305
01:38:04.200 --> 01:38:07.600
Smoking the substance and simply falling asleep

2306
01:38:07.600 --> 01:38:10.680
or remembering nothing, effectively being denied entry.

2307
01:38:13.080 --> 01:38:15.560
There are thousands of people.

2308
01:38:15.560 --> 01:38:17.920
One of the very, very random

2309
01:38:17.920 --> 01:38:20.760
but persuasive thought experiments,

2310
01:38:20.760 --> 01:38:25.200
I sometimes use to explain why I've started to believe

2311
01:38:25.200 --> 01:38:27.280
that there's probably something more

2312
01:38:27.280 --> 01:38:31.600
is weirdly, how much I've learned about the gut microbiome.

2313
01:38:31.600 --> 01:38:32.960
That sounds like a strange thing.

2314
01:38:33.240 --> 01:38:35.200
Not a connection one would expect to make.

2315
01:38:35.200 --> 01:38:36.560
But when I sat here with these experts

2316
01:38:36.560 --> 01:38:37.480
and they're like, oh, by the way,

2317
01:38:37.480 --> 01:38:40.520
there's 38 trillion living organisms

2318
01:38:40.520 --> 01:38:42.880
in your gut right now.

2319
01:38:42.880 --> 01:38:46.040
I, you know, you're saying like,

2320
01:38:46.040 --> 01:38:49.000
what is below is above whatever that phrase was.

2321
01:38:49.000 --> 01:38:51.160
I was like, okay, so those 38 million creatures,

2322
01:38:51.160 --> 01:38:53.240
I know that you could argue that maybe they're not conscious

2323
01:38:53.240 --> 01:38:54.640
of whatever you want to say.

2324
01:38:54.640 --> 01:38:57.240
But they have no idea.

2325
01:38:57.240 --> 01:38:59.040
Like if they work, they have no idea

2326
01:38:59.040 --> 01:39:01.640
that they're living inside another organism

2327
01:39:01.680 --> 01:39:03.360
down that if they could debate,

2328
01:39:03.360 --> 01:39:04.720
they would be debating religion.

2329
01:39:04.720 --> 01:39:06.800
They'd be saying, do you think we have a creator?

2330
01:39:06.800 --> 01:39:09.080
And they'd look around and they wouldn't see him.

2331
01:39:09.080 --> 01:39:12.680
But because they don't realize that they're inside,

2332
01:39:12.680 --> 01:39:16.080
I guess they're God like their creator.

2333
01:39:16.080 --> 01:39:17.680
The thing that's feeding them every day

2334
01:39:17.680 --> 01:39:19.800
and keeping them alive and that kind of,

2335
01:39:19.800 --> 01:39:21.480
you could argue created them

2336
01:39:21.480 --> 01:39:24.240
because I created the environment for them to reproduce.

2337
01:39:24.240 --> 01:39:26.200
And when I thought about that, I thought about the oceans.

2338
01:39:26.200 --> 01:39:28.280
I was like, you know, the animals at the very bottom

2339
01:39:28.280 --> 01:39:30.040
of the deepest ocean have no idea

2340
01:39:30.040 --> 01:39:31.040
that there's anything above.

2341
01:39:31.080 --> 01:39:32.320
They have no idea.

2342
01:39:32.320 --> 01:39:33.720
And then you've got to ask yourself,

2343
01:39:33.720 --> 01:39:35.480
am I like arrogant enough to believe

2344
01:39:35.480 --> 01:39:38.560
or not even enough to believe that like this is it?

2345
01:39:38.560 --> 01:39:40.080
That I am at the top of the mountain.

2346
01:39:40.080 --> 01:39:41.160
And there's nothing.

2347
01:39:41.160 --> 01:39:43.440
It's so egotistical to think there isn't,

2348
01:39:43.440 --> 01:39:45.120
there could be nothing above me.

2349
01:39:45.120 --> 01:39:46.640
And then the other thing that's been really persuasive

2350
01:39:46.640 --> 01:39:49.200
for me in my journey of like spirituality

2351
01:39:49.200 --> 01:39:50.800
or religion or whatever you're gonna call it

2352
01:39:50.800 --> 01:39:53.040
is I did a bunch of star tours

2353
01:39:53.040 --> 01:39:54.720
and generally getting interested in the stars

2354
01:39:54.720 --> 01:39:57.400
and sitting there with a star expert

2355
01:39:57.400 --> 01:39:59.800
and him saying to me at night time in Joshua Tree,

2356
01:40:00.560 --> 01:40:02.080
and he'd like get this big binocular out,

2357
01:40:02.080 --> 01:40:03.400
this one meter binocular.

2358
01:40:03.400 --> 01:40:05.000
And he'd say, what you're seeing there

2359
01:40:05.000 --> 01:40:09.120
is he'd say something crazy like 28 million light years away.

2360
01:40:09.120 --> 01:40:11.200
And I'm looking at a whole other galaxy

2361
01:40:11.200 --> 01:40:16.000
and it's just this spec and it's 28 million light years away.

2362
01:40:16.000 --> 01:40:18.000
I'm scratching my hand and I'm like, what the?

2363
01:40:18.000 --> 01:40:20.760
That is inconceivably far away.

2364
01:40:20.760 --> 01:40:21.600
And it's just this dot.

2365
01:40:21.600 --> 01:40:24.840
And he goes, yeah, there's like trillions of those.

2366
01:40:24.840 --> 01:40:27.000
And I'm thinking, oh, like the book got microbiome.

2367
01:40:27.000 --> 01:40:29.000
There's like 38 trillion of those.

2368
01:40:29.000 --> 01:40:29.840
Yeah.

2369
01:40:29.840 --> 01:40:32.640
And they just specs with life on them

2370
01:40:32.640 --> 01:40:35.480
that we understand at some granular level

2371
01:40:35.480 --> 01:40:37.200
but maybe not the deepest granular level.

2372
01:40:37.200 --> 01:40:39.880
So maybe I'm just another gut in the bug

2373
01:40:39.880 --> 01:40:42.320
of some toddler in some other space.

2374
01:40:42.320 --> 01:40:43.640
And I just don't know the answer.

2375
01:40:43.640 --> 01:40:45.080
What do you do with that information?

2376
01:40:45.080 --> 01:40:46.600
No idea.

2377
01:40:46.600 --> 01:40:48.720
But the new theory is that this consciousness

2378
01:40:48.720 --> 01:40:50.160
is external to our body.

2379
01:40:51.640 --> 01:40:52.840
What does that mean?

2380
01:40:52.840 --> 01:40:56.720
Like our brains act as a receiver and a filter

2381
01:40:56.720 --> 01:41:00.440
for consciousness is not a creator of consciousness.

2382
01:41:00.440 --> 01:41:03.840
So hypothetically, maybe DMT is something

2383
01:41:03.840 --> 01:41:06.360
that just pops that filter off

2384
01:41:06.360 --> 01:41:09.160
and allows us to experience full consciousness.

2385
01:41:10.600 --> 01:41:12.280
And then if the all is mind,

2386
01:41:12.280 --> 01:41:15.360
so if everything in my dream is made up of me

2387
01:41:15.360 --> 01:41:18.120
and we just copy paste that up to this level,

2388
01:41:18.120 --> 01:41:19.840
we're all maybe part of one mind

2389
01:41:19.840 --> 01:41:21.800
and there aren't any people.

2390
01:41:24.400 --> 01:41:26.280
It's just a mind.

2391
01:41:26.280 --> 01:41:28.800
So like the distance between us doesn't exist.

2392
01:41:28.800 --> 01:41:30.840
It's just just like a dream

2393
01:41:30.840 --> 01:41:33.200
except we're sharing a dream up here.

2394
01:41:33.200 --> 01:41:36.080
And that's one of the, I think that's a part

2395
01:41:36.080 --> 01:41:38.200
of that new consciousness theory.

2396
01:41:38.200 --> 01:41:40.040
I don't subscribe to any of them,

2397
01:41:40.040 --> 01:41:41.560
any one of them in particular.

2398
01:41:41.560 --> 01:41:43.880
You haven't got to believe any of this stuff

2399
01:41:47.080 --> 01:41:49.440
because it's hard to, you're never gonna know for sure,

2400
01:41:49.440 --> 01:41:51.880
but even hearing it makes me feel

2401
01:41:51.880 --> 01:41:54.560
a lot more empathetic for my fellow being.

2402
01:41:54.760 --> 01:41:56.440
Because it makes me you.

2403
01:41:56.440 --> 01:41:58.640
It makes your enemy you.

2404
01:41:58.640 --> 01:41:59.800
It makes your friend you.

2405
01:41:59.800 --> 01:42:01.840
It makes the person you love hate whatever.

2406
01:42:01.840 --> 01:42:03.320
It makes all of them you.

2407
01:42:03.320 --> 01:42:05.160
And none of us would, I think,

2408
01:42:05.160 --> 01:42:07.240
I think we treat ourselves much better sometimes

2409
01:42:07.240 --> 01:42:10.280
than we would treat someone a thousand miles away

2410
01:42:10.280 --> 01:42:12.160
in a different country with a different color skin.

2411
01:42:12.160 --> 01:42:13.000
Yeah.

2412
01:42:13.000 --> 01:42:15.360
So that's what I love about this conversation

2413
01:42:15.360 --> 01:42:16.880
and actually every time I bring myself back

2414
01:42:16.880 --> 01:42:19.000
to this point about consciousness being one,

2415
01:42:19.000 --> 01:42:22.480
it does make me more empathetic to things.

2416
01:42:22.800 --> 01:42:25.720
And it's not because you're a moral person.

2417
01:42:25.720 --> 01:42:27.560
Like you don't have to have morals anymore.

2418
01:42:27.560 --> 01:42:32.360
So if I see you as me, I'm just protecting myself.

2419
01:42:32.360 --> 01:42:34.400
Yeah, like it's just a natural

2420
01:42:34.400 --> 01:42:35.960
in the same way I would with my children.

2421
01:42:35.960 --> 01:42:38.240
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2422
01:42:38.240 --> 01:42:40.720
And then the morality doesn't need to exist anymore.

2423
01:42:40.720 --> 01:42:43.560
It's just the right thing.

2424
01:42:44.440 --> 01:42:46.960
Chase, what is the most important idea

2425
01:42:46.960 --> 01:42:48.600
we didn't talk about that we should have talked about?

2426
01:42:48.600 --> 01:42:52.760
Specifically, as it relates to the most important skills

2427
01:42:52.760 --> 01:42:54.120
people are going to need,

2428
01:42:54.120 --> 01:42:56.800
whether it's body language or people skills or sales skills

2429
01:42:56.800 --> 01:42:57.920
in the world we're heading towards,

2430
01:42:57.920 --> 01:43:00.440
where they're positing that robots are going to take away

2431
01:43:00.440 --> 01:43:02.200
lots of the manual labor jobs

2432
01:43:02.200 --> 01:43:04.240
and artificial intelligence is going to take away

2433
01:43:04.240 --> 01:43:06.040
a lot of the cognitive work.

2434
01:43:06.040 --> 01:43:08.120
And we might be rendered left with each other

2435
01:43:08.120 --> 01:43:09.400
in the real world.

2436
01:43:09.400 --> 01:43:10.880
Yeah.

2437
01:43:10.880 --> 01:43:15.880
Number one is making people feel heard and seen

2438
01:43:16.720 --> 01:43:20.320
and resonating with them when they're heard

2439
01:43:20.320 --> 01:43:22.240
and not judging them when they're seen.

2440
01:43:24.240 --> 01:43:25.400
That's the number one.

2441
01:43:25.400 --> 01:43:29.000
Because AI, you can mark my words,

2442
01:43:29.000 --> 01:43:32.360
AI will never, in a million years,

2443
01:43:33.560 --> 01:43:35.800
serve as a replacement for humans

2444
01:43:35.800 --> 01:43:39.000
on the social level of Maslow's hierarchy of needs,

2445
01:43:39.000 --> 01:43:41.400
where we have survival, safety, belonging,

2446
01:43:41.400 --> 01:43:44.760
that third row of Maslow's pyramid

2447
01:43:44.760 --> 01:43:47.520
cannot be fulfilled through electronic needs

2448
01:43:47.520 --> 01:43:48.840
as of yet anyway.

2449
01:43:48.840 --> 01:43:52.360
And maybe they're going to start making sex robots

2450
01:43:52.360 --> 01:43:53.200
and all that kind of stuff

2451
01:43:53.200 --> 01:43:55.360
when these things come out.

2452
01:43:55.360 --> 01:43:58.920
But we cannot fulfill that desire.

2453
01:43:58.920 --> 01:44:00.600
We cannot fulfill that need.

2454
01:44:00.600 --> 01:44:03.200
So what's above that?

2455
01:44:03.200 --> 01:44:06.760
Then we have a steam, our self-esteem

2456
01:44:06.760 --> 01:44:09.440
and our self-actualization.

2457
01:44:09.440 --> 01:44:12.000
We can never move past level three

2458
01:44:12.000 --> 01:44:14.720
because we're getting a placebo of connection

2459
01:44:14.720 --> 01:44:18.320
from Twitter and TikTok and all these apps

2460
01:44:18.320 --> 01:44:21.880
and these pseudo-social apps, YouTube.

2461
01:44:21.880 --> 01:44:25.040
We have these pair of social relationships on YouTube.

2462
01:44:25.040 --> 01:44:29.000
And it cannot fulfill that level.

2463
01:44:29.000 --> 01:44:32.240
Our brains were not wired to receive digital connection.

2464
01:44:33.480 --> 01:44:35.840
Our brains have not developed one more wrinkle

2465
01:44:35.840 --> 01:44:38.320
in the last 200,000 years.

2466
01:44:38.320 --> 01:44:40.240
Exactly the same brain.

2467
01:44:40.240 --> 01:44:43.320
So we're not going to out-science

2468
01:44:43.320 --> 01:44:44.720
the lower part of the brain.

2469
01:44:44.720 --> 01:44:46.960
And you can't meditate your way

2470
01:44:46.960 --> 01:44:49.200
out of having good relationships

2471
01:44:49.200 --> 01:44:50.640
and being around 3D people.

2472
01:44:50.640 --> 01:44:52.520
You need it in your life.

2473
01:44:52.520 --> 01:44:56.600
And I genuinely think AI's never going to replace it.

2474
01:44:56.600 --> 01:44:58.080
I would agree.

2475
01:44:58.080 --> 01:44:58.880
I would agree.

2476
01:45:00.880 --> 01:45:02.560
I think one of the things that's been really persuasive

2477
01:45:02.560 --> 01:45:04.920
in this regard is I remember in psychology lessons

2478
01:45:04.920 --> 01:45:08.560
when I was like maybe 16 years old, Mrs. Launey.

2479
01:45:09.560 --> 01:45:11.080
I've always missed Mrs. Launey.

2480
01:45:11.080 --> 01:45:12.760
Miss Launey, if you're listening, please get in touch.

2481
01:45:12.760 --> 01:45:14.920
My, I shouldn't say my email.

2482
01:45:14.920 --> 01:45:18.000
But just get in touch through Gareth, you know me.

2483
01:45:18.000 --> 01:45:18.840
But I just wanted to say that

2484
01:45:18.840 --> 01:45:21.080
because she was a great teacher for me in psychology.

2485
01:45:21.080 --> 01:45:22.560
I really only like two lessons in school,

2486
01:45:22.560 --> 01:45:23.560
business and psychology.

2487
01:45:23.560 --> 01:45:26.640
So Mr. Hughes and Mrs. Launey's lessons.

2488
01:45:26.640 --> 01:45:28.200
The others I found a bit tricky.

2489
01:45:28.200 --> 01:45:30.880
But I thought those two teachers saw something in me.

2490
01:45:30.880 --> 01:45:34.280
Miss Launey was talking about the Reese's Monkeys experiment

2491
01:45:34.280 --> 01:45:36.080
where they got these like Reese's Monkeys

2492
01:45:36.080 --> 01:45:40.600
to either they gave them a fake mother

2493
01:45:40.600 --> 01:45:42.720
but had that had cloth on it.

2494
01:45:42.720 --> 01:45:44.560
Or they gave them a wire mother.

2495
01:45:44.560 --> 01:45:47.680
So a mother made out of wires

2496
01:45:47.680 --> 01:45:49.920
and they looked at their psychological outcomes over time.

2497
01:45:49.920 --> 01:45:50.920
I'm probably butchering this.

2498
01:45:50.920 --> 01:45:52.160
So please, community note me.

2499
01:45:52.160 --> 01:45:55.000
Diary of a CO team so that the facts are on the screen.

2500
01:45:55.000 --> 01:45:57.320
And what they found is if you want the monkeys

2501
01:45:57.320 --> 01:46:01.200
that grew to be most psychologically stable and happy

2502
01:46:01.200 --> 01:46:04.440
and weren't psychopaths were the ones that had a cloth mother.

2503
01:46:04.440 --> 01:46:06.600
And the monkeys that became erratic

2504
01:46:06.600 --> 01:46:08.280
and clearly had deep psychological problems

2505
01:46:08.280 --> 01:46:09.560
were the ones that just had a wire mother.

2506
01:46:09.560 --> 01:46:12.760
So that's always reminded me that even in a world of robots

2507
01:46:12.760 --> 01:46:13.880
or AI or whatever,

2508
01:46:13.880 --> 01:46:15.880
there's still something irreplaceably human

2509
01:46:15.880 --> 01:46:18.560
about physical human connection and touch.

2510
01:46:18.560 --> 01:46:20.160
Which I actually think is going to become,

2511
01:46:20.160 --> 01:46:21.680
is going to absolutely surge in a world

2512
01:46:21.680 --> 01:46:23.400
where we do have robots and intelligence

2513
01:46:23.400 --> 01:46:24.280
and attentive algorithms.

2514
01:46:24.280 --> 01:46:26.440
I think there's going to be this biification of society

2515
01:46:26.440 --> 01:46:29.400
where many people flee back to the real world.

2516
01:46:30.440 --> 01:46:31.280
Yeah.

2517
01:46:31.280 --> 01:46:33.000
And the two biggest things that we have

2518
01:46:33.000 --> 01:46:36.040
as a result of all of this is loneliness and division.

2519
01:46:37.040 --> 01:46:38.800
And the division is manufactured

2520
01:46:38.800 --> 01:46:40.800
than the loneliness is a byproduct.

2521
01:46:41.840 --> 01:46:44.000
Is there anything else you wanted to share?

2522
01:46:44.000 --> 01:46:45.480
Yeah, there may be some good news.

2523
01:46:45.480 --> 01:46:46.640
That was some...

2524
01:46:46.640 --> 01:46:48.520
I'd be sharing to stop on that note.

2525
01:46:48.520 --> 01:46:49.680
Give me some good news.

2526
01:46:50.680 --> 01:46:54.000
I think one of the number one thing that people need to know

2527
01:46:54.000 --> 01:46:57.800
is that if you wrote down the biggest insecurities

2528
01:46:57.800 --> 01:46:59.560
that you've ever had in your entire life,

2529
01:46:59.560 --> 01:47:05.040
every crazy, crazy thing about how you thought it was a big deal.

2530
01:47:05.040 --> 01:47:07.800
You have to forgive yourself for that shit you did

2531
01:47:07.800 --> 01:47:09.160
when you were 12.

2532
01:47:09.160 --> 01:47:11.320
You have to stop doing this.

2533
01:47:11.320 --> 01:47:14.080
You have to stop hiding yourself from other people.

2534
01:47:14.080 --> 01:47:17.000
If you just wrote down every one of your insecurities

2535
01:47:17.000 --> 01:47:21.680
with 100 people and then had someone type all of them out,

2536
01:47:21.680 --> 01:47:26.120
all 100 people, you wouldn't be able to find your own.

2537
01:47:30.560 --> 01:47:33.560
You'd be very confused.

2538
01:47:33.560 --> 01:47:37.560
You'd think that someone just paraphrased you a hundred times

2539
01:47:37.560 --> 01:47:40.560
if you're digging through that hat trying to find your insecurities.

2540
01:47:40.560 --> 01:47:42.560
And it would shock you.

2541
01:47:42.560 --> 01:47:44.560
And it's one thing to hear it maybe on a podcast,

2542
01:47:44.560 --> 01:47:46.560
but to see it in real life,

2543
01:47:46.560 --> 01:47:49.560
if you see the depth of other people,

2544
01:47:49.560 --> 01:47:52.560
we are so much the same

2545
01:47:52.560 --> 01:47:55.560
and all the shit that we hide

2546
01:47:55.560 --> 01:47:57.560
because we don't want anybody else to see it,

2547
01:47:58.560 --> 01:48:01.160
everyone else is hiding the exact same stuff.

2548
01:48:01.160 --> 01:48:04.160
Everybody else is feeling the exact same way.

2549
01:48:04.160 --> 01:48:06.560
The number one thing that people regret on their deathbed

2550
01:48:06.560 --> 01:48:09.920
is like, I should have treated it more like a game.

2551
01:48:09.920 --> 01:48:12.080
I should have figured out what was important in the game

2552
01:48:12.080 --> 01:48:14.560
and done what was actually important.

2553
01:48:14.560 --> 01:48:15.560
And that's it.

2554
01:48:18.840 --> 01:48:20.640
That means a lot to you, doesn't it?

2555
01:48:20.640 --> 01:48:21.640
That particular point,

2556
01:48:21.640 --> 01:48:25.560
it's almost like you've changed since last time we spoke in a way.

2557
01:48:25.560 --> 01:48:27.560
I think there's been a bit of an evolution.

2558
01:48:27.560 --> 01:48:28.560
Yeah.

2559
01:48:28.560 --> 01:48:33.560
And I think that level of empathy is super important to life

2560
01:48:33.560 --> 01:48:35.560
and it helps slow things down.

2561
01:48:35.560 --> 01:48:38.560
And no matter what you're going through,

2562
01:48:38.560 --> 01:48:41.560
make a poster and put this up on your wall.

2563
01:48:41.560 --> 01:48:43.560
It's supposed to be fun.

2564
01:48:43.560 --> 01:48:46.560
It's supposed to be a game.

2565
01:48:46.560 --> 01:48:49.560
And I think Alan Watts had a quote that said,

2566
01:48:49.560 --> 01:48:52.560
most of man's memory comes from taking very seriously

2567
01:48:52.560 --> 01:48:54.560
what God made for fun.

2568
01:49:01.560 --> 01:49:03.560
It's hard not to take it seriously though,

2569
01:49:03.560 --> 01:49:08.560
when it seems to threaten some of our prehistoric design.

2570
01:49:10.560 --> 01:49:13.560
And if we go back to the triangle where you've got friends

2571
01:49:13.560 --> 01:49:15.560
and rewards and you've got safety,

2572
01:49:15.560 --> 01:49:17.560
if it threatens any of these things,

2573
01:49:17.560 --> 01:49:18.560
then it doesn't feel so fun.

2574
01:49:18.560 --> 01:49:19.560
Right.

2575
01:49:19.560 --> 01:49:21.560
Depending on your perspective.

2576
01:49:21.560 --> 01:49:23.560
And that's where the big perspective shift comes in.

2577
01:49:23.560 --> 01:49:28.560
I've got to remind myself this is supposed to be fun.

2578
01:49:28.560 --> 01:49:30.560
Chase, we have a closing traditional in this podcast

2579
01:49:30.560 --> 01:49:32.560
where the last guest leaves a question for the next.

2580
01:49:32.560 --> 01:49:33.560
Not knowing who they're leaving it for.

2581
01:49:33.560 --> 01:49:34.560
And the question left for you.

2582
01:49:34.560 --> 01:49:36.560
Sounds like you've rehearsed that.

2583
01:49:36.560 --> 01:49:41.560
Yeah, I've said it quite a few times now, probably 500 times.

2584
01:49:41.560 --> 01:49:46.560
If you were going to take on a new challenge this year

2585
01:49:46.560 --> 01:49:51.560
to expand the territory of your skill set

2586
01:49:51.560 --> 01:49:56.560
in a way that would make you happy, what would it be?

2587
01:49:56.560 --> 01:50:02.560
I think developing the ability to shut the fuck up

2588
01:50:02.560 --> 01:50:06.560
and celebrate when there's a win.

2589
01:50:06.560 --> 01:50:08.560
We just had a giant record month

2590
01:50:08.560 --> 01:50:10.560
in our company, massive record month.

2591
01:50:10.560 --> 01:50:12.560
And I was like, okay, okay.

2592
01:50:12.560 --> 01:50:15.560
And then I just joined another meeting

2593
01:50:15.560 --> 01:50:17.560
and it fell by the wayside.

2594
01:50:17.560 --> 01:50:19.560
And I think I'm going to regret doing that.

2595
01:50:19.560 --> 01:50:22.560
And I think celebrating when is a skill

2596
01:50:22.560 --> 01:50:28.560
that I need to cultivate better.

2597
01:50:28.560 --> 01:50:32.560
Mogul from episode 101 was the most shared episode

2598
01:50:32.560 --> 01:50:35.560
of any podcast in 2023 on Apple in the UK.

2599
01:50:35.560 --> 01:50:36.560
Called into Apple.

2600
01:50:36.560 --> 01:50:38.560
And one of the things he said in that conversation,

2601
01:50:38.560 --> 01:50:41.560
he's head of Google Apps who left when his son died

2602
01:50:41.560 --> 01:50:43.560
and he went in search of happiness.

2603
01:50:43.560 --> 01:50:45.560
So at Google, he was leading the innovation teams

2604
01:50:45.560 --> 01:50:47.560
all like the AI stuff, robots and all that stuff.

2605
01:50:47.560 --> 01:50:50.560
And I remember he like becomes a backpacker at 50 odd years old,

2606
01:50:50.560 --> 01:50:53.560
ends up having a divorce from his wife after 18 years.

2607
01:50:53.560 --> 01:50:55.560
And his whole life when he sat in the chair,

2608
01:50:55.560 --> 01:50:57.560
he was like backpacking at this one shirt.

2609
01:50:57.560 --> 01:50:59.560
He'd come to my studio in Shoreditch and London,

2610
01:50:59.560 --> 01:51:01.560
this old kitchen, this used to be my kitchen.

2611
01:51:01.560 --> 01:51:03.560
And he said aligned to me, which is always stayed with me.

2612
01:51:03.560 --> 01:51:05.560
He said happiness is when your expectations

2613
01:51:05.560 --> 01:51:07.560
of how your life are supposed to be going on met.

2614
01:51:07.560 --> 01:51:09.560
And so from that, I can deduce the opposite to be true,

2615
01:51:09.560 --> 01:51:11.560
which is unhappiness is when your expectations

2616
01:51:11.560 --> 01:51:14.560
of how you thought your life was supposed to be going go on met.

2617
01:51:14.560 --> 01:51:16.560
And in there, I've always come back to this

2618
01:51:16.560 --> 01:51:20.560
because like almost all of my unhappiness is when I had an expectation

2619
01:51:20.560 --> 01:51:22.560
of how my life was supposed to be going

2620
01:51:22.560 --> 01:51:24.560
or something was supposed to be going.

2621
01:51:24.560 --> 01:51:26.560
Your relationship, getting cut off in traffic,

2622
01:51:26.560 --> 01:51:28.560
whatever it might be, podcasts, whatever.

2623
01:51:28.560 --> 01:51:30.560
And when you're full shot of one's expectation,

2624
01:51:30.560 --> 01:51:33.560
that gap is like, is dissatisfaction and frustration

2625
01:51:33.560 --> 01:51:34.560
or whatever else.

2626
01:51:34.560 --> 01:51:37.560
And so can one play with this

2627
01:51:37.560 --> 01:51:39.560
by being grateful?

2628
01:51:39.560 --> 01:51:43.560
Because I think great gratitude is a proxy of realizing

2629
01:51:43.560 --> 01:51:47.560
that expectations you once had are now being met and succeeded.

2630
01:51:47.560 --> 01:51:50.560
But the problem is, as striving creatures,

2631
01:51:50.560 --> 01:51:54.560
we keep a delta between where we are

2632
01:51:54.560 --> 01:51:56.560
and where we expect to be.

2633
01:51:56.560 --> 01:51:59.560
So like when you talked about celebrating your win there,

2634
01:51:59.560 --> 01:52:01.560
I think the problem is you're already thinking about the next ones.

2635
01:52:01.560 --> 01:52:02.560
You've already created a delta.

2636
01:52:02.560 --> 01:52:03.560
Yeah.

2637
01:52:03.560 --> 01:52:04.560
And that's going to keep you on.

2638
01:52:04.560 --> 01:52:06.560
Whereas like, you know,

2639
01:52:06.560 --> 01:52:09.560
Eastern traditions are all about gratitude,

2640
01:52:09.560 --> 01:52:12.560
which in that moment is going, fuck chase, we did it.

2641
01:52:12.560 --> 01:52:13.560
Yeah.

2642
01:52:13.560 --> 01:52:14.560
This was a dream.

2643
01:52:14.560 --> 01:52:15.560
Yeah.

2644
01:52:15.560 --> 01:52:16.560
And you did it.

2645
01:52:16.560 --> 01:52:17.560
And like, are you able to sit in that?

2646
01:52:17.560 --> 01:52:20.560
The problem I've also discovered with this spiel

2647
01:52:20.560 --> 01:52:23.560
is I expected it to be automatic.

2648
01:52:23.560 --> 01:52:26.560
I expected the gratitude and the excitement

2649
01:52:26.560 --> 01:52:28.560
and the joy to be automatic.

2650
01:52:28.560 --> 01:52:29.560
Yeah.

2651
01:52:29.560 --> 01:52:31.560
So when it didn't automatically show up

2652
01:52:31.560 --> 01:52:34.560
when I became a millionaire or the podcast did well,

2653
01:52:34.560 --> 01:52:38.560
I thought maybe it'll show up on the next one.

2654
01:52:38.560 --> 01:52:39.560
Yeah.

2655
01:52:39.560 --> 01:52:40.560
Yeah.

2656
01:52:40.560 --> 01:52:43.560
Instead of like taking a moment and forcing it out of me,

2657
01:52:43.560 --> 01:52:45.560
like reminding myself that this was it, Chase.

2658
01:52:45.560 --> 01:52:46.560
Yeah.

2659
01:52:46.560 --> 01:52:47.560
This was the dream.

2660
01:52:47.560 --> 01:52:48.560
And that's the perspective.

2661
01:52:48.560 --> 01:52:49.560
Yeah, perspective.

2662
01:52:49.560 --> 01:52:52.560
Like your camera angles, like mine, I'll speak for myself.

2663
01:52:52.560 --> 01:52:56.560
It's just so zoomed in on this exact moment

2664
01:52:56.560 --> 01:52:58.560
on what's going on in the business,

2665
01:52:58.560 --> 01:53:00.560
this meeting that's coming up in a few minutes.

2666
01:53:00.560 --> 01:53:04.560
It's just like dragging that camera by the throat

2667
01:53:04.560 --> 01:53:07.560
and pulling it up to like when you zoom out on Google Maps

2668
01:53:07.560 --> 01:53:10.560
and be like, this is a big deal.

2669
01:53:10.560 --> 01:53:12.560
Like you have time to pause.

2670
01:53:12.560 --> 01:53:14.560
Nothing you think is a big deal is a huge deal.

2671
01:53:14.560 --> 01:53:17.560
You can pause, you can cancel that meeting

2672
01:53:17.560 --> 01:53:19.560
and really celebrate.

2673
01:53:19.560 --> 01:53:21.560
It's so true.

2674
01:53:21.560 --> 01:53:24.560
And maybe like when I became a millionaire,

2675
01:53:24.560 --> 01:53:28.560
I thought it was like, it's going to fix my posture.

2676
01:53:28.560 --> 01:53:32.560
It's going to make my skin look better.

2677
01:53:32.560 --> 01:53:34.560
It didn't do anything.

2678
01:53:34.560 --> 01:53:36.560
It didn't do shit.

2679
01:53:36.560 --> 01:53:39.560
And the crazy part about that is you hear often here

2680
01:53:39.560 --> 01:53:41.560
of what they call gold medal depression,

2681
01:53:41.560 --> 01:53:44.560
which again is a prime example of like you had an expectation

2682
01:53:44.560 --> 01:53:45.560
of that moment.

2683
01:53:45.560 --> 01:53:47.560
You thought confetti and a marching band

2684
01:53:47.560 --> 01:53:49.560
and it would be on the front page of the newspaper

2685
01:53:49.560 --> 01:53:50.560
or whatever.

2686
01:53:50.560 --> 01:53:52.560
And the reality is it didn't do shit.

2687
01:53:52.560 --> 01:53:54.560
So now you've got a problem.

2688
01:53:54.560 --> 01:53:56.560
Now a lot of people they get upset.

2689
01:53:56.560 --> 01:53:58.560
They get back from the Olympics with a gold medal

2690
01:53:58.560 --> 01:53:59.560
and they're depressed.

2691
01:53:59.560 --> 01:54:01.560
Because they climbed to the top of the mountain.

2692
01:54:01.560 --> 01:54:03.560
And it didn't change anything.

2693
01:54:03.560 --> 01:54:04.560
Now that's a problem.

2694
01:54:04.560 --> 01:54:05.560
Yeah.

2695
01:54:05.560 --> 01:54:09.560
So I actively practice, especially ahead of an accomplishment,

2696
01:54:09.560 --> 01:54:11.560
I actively practice forced gratitude,

2697
01:54:11.560 --> 01:54:13.560
which is like really taking a moment

2698
01:54:13.560 --> 01:54:15.560
and zooming out as you say.

2699
01:54:15.560 --> 01:54:18.560
And then the other is, like before I just got my house in LA,

2700
01:54:18.560 --> 01:54:19.560
which is an incredible fucking house,

2701
01:54:19.560 --> 01:54:21.560
and like blows from where I come from.

2702
01:54:21.560 --> 01:54:23.560
It's kid born in Botswana,

2703
01:54:23.560 --> 01:54:24.560
the UK.

2704
01:54:24.560 --> 01:54:27.560
It's before I walked into the house,

2705
01:54:27.560 --> 01:54:29.560
I literally out loud,

2706
01:54:29.560 --> 01:54:32.560
reminded myself that this was not going to change anything

2707
01:54:32.560 --> 01:54:33.560
in my life.

2708
01:54:33.560 --> 01:54:36.560
It wasn't going to make me an inch happier in any way.

2709
01:54:36.560 --> 01:54:39.560
I was going to have no material impact on anything.

2710
01:54:39.560 --> 01:54:41.560
No one's opinion of me is going to change.

2711
01:54:41.560 --> 01:54:42.560
Nothing.

2712
01:54:42.560 --> 01:54:43.560
It's going to do nothing for me.

2713
01:54:43.560 --> 01:54:46.560
And when I walked into that house for the first time,

2714
01:54:46.560 --> 01:54:48.560
I could actually really enjoy it

2715
01:54:48.560 --> 01:54:51.560
because my expectations were so low.

2716
01:54:51.560 --> 01:54:52.560
That's beautiful.

2717
01:54:52.560 --> 01:54:54.560
It was very easy to exceed my expectations

2718
01:54:54.560 --> 01:54:55.560
because I had none, you know.

2719
01:54:55.560 --> 01:54:57.560
And I actually enjoy every day when I walk downstairs

2720
01:54:57.560 --> 01:54:59.560
because it's like blowing my light.

2721
01:54:59.560 --> 01:55:00.560
Yeah.

2722
01:55:00.560 --> 01:55:01.560
You know?

2723
01:55:01.560 --> 01:55:02.560
That is awesome.

2724
01:55:02.560 --> 01:55:05.560
But you still get to celebrate that you got the house.

2725
01:55:05.560 --> 01:55:06.560
Yeah.

2726
01:55:06.560 --> 01:55:08.560
Without it meaning something about you.

2727
01:55:08.560 --> 01:55:09.560
Yeah.

2728
01:55:09.560 --> 01:55:10.560
I think that's the difference.

2729
01:55:10.560 --> 01:55:11.560
Yeah, yeah, you're right.

2730
01:55:11.560 --> 01:55:14.560
Like you can feel good about a good YouTube comment

2731
01:55:14.560 --> 01:55:16.560
without you going,

2732
01:55:16.560 --> 01:55:19.560
yeah, Stephen is a good guy.

2733
01:55:19.560 --> 01:55:20.560
You know, like,

2734
01:55:20.560 --> 01:55:22.560
for you're not writing identity statements about it,

2735
01:55:22.560 --> 01:55:23.560
identity, that's the key.

2736
01:55:23.560 --> 01:55:24.560
Yeah.

2737
01:55:24.560 --> 01:55:25.560
That's what I was clearly doing there,

2738
01:55:25.560 --> 01:55:26.560
as I'm saying,

2739
01:55:26.560 --> 01:55:27.560
this is not going to impact my identity in any way.

2740
01:55:27.560 --> 01:55:28.560
Don't fucking think it's going to go into.

2741
01:55:28.560 --> 01:55:29.560
Yeah.

2742
01:55:29.560 --> 01:55:30.560
But it still means that when I wake up in the morning

2743
01:55:30.560 --> 01:55:31.560
and see a view,

2744
01:55:31.560 --> 01:55:32.560
I go, wow, that's so, wow.

2745
01:55:32.560 --> 01:55:33.560
Yeah.

2746
01:55:33.560 --> 01:55:34.560
You know?

2747
01:55:34.560 --> 01:55:35.560
So true.

2748
01:55:35.560 --> 01:55:36.560
So true.

2749
01:55:36.560 --> 01:55:37.560
I fully resonate with that.

2750
01:55:37.560 --> 01:55:39.560
Chase, where do people go to get more of you?

2751
01:55:39.560 --> 01:55:41.560
Where's the best place?

2752
01:55:41.560 --> 01:55:44.560
Best place is NCI.University.

2753
01:55:44.560 --> 01:55:45.560
NCI.University.

2754
01:55:45.560 --> 01:55:48.560
I'll link that below for anyone that's looking for the link.

2755
01:55:48.560 --> 01:55:51.560
And my YouTube channel is just my name.

2756
01:55:51.560 --> 01:55:53.560
We'll try and collab with you on this video.

2757
01:55:53.560 --> 01:55:55.560
So if you look down below,

2758
01:55:55.560 --> 01:55:57.560
you should see two icons.

2759
01:55:57.560 --> 01:55:59.560
You'll see the Diarrhea icon and Chases icon.

2760
01:55:59.560 --> 01:56:00.560
If you're watching on YouTube,

2761
01:56:00.560 --> 01:56:01.560
just click Chases icon

2762
01:56:01.560 --> 01:56:03.560
and you'll go over to his YouTube channel.

2763
01:56:03.560 --> 01:56:05.560
Chase, thank you so much.

2764
01:56:05.560 --> 01:56:06.560
Thanks, Stephen.