WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.840 the more that there are female filmmakers, 2 00:00:02.840 --> 00:00:05.520 then those stories will be more visible. 3 00:00:05.520 --> 00:00:07.400 Women are really, really interesting, 4 00:00:07.400 --> 00:00:11.600 and they're not just the ongenoo or the victim or whatever. 5 00:00:11.600 --> 00:00:12.800 They're all a villain. 6 00:00:12.800 --> 00:00:15.960 You know, there's so much going on there 7 00:00:15.960 --> 00:00:18.960 and having the confidence to kind of go, 8 00:00:18.960 --> 00:00:19.960 why not? 9 00:00:19.960 --> 00:00:21.840 Why doesn't she, can't she do this? 10 00:00:21.840 --> 00:00:24.960 No one would think twice if a man did this action, 11 00:00:24.960 --> 00:00:27.520 but because a woman's doing it, oh my gosh, you know, 12 00:00:27.520 --> 00:00:28.880 it's taboo. 13 00:00:28.880 --> 00:00:29.880 Let's see what happens. 14 00:00:29.880 --> 00:00:30.880 Let's see the reaction. 15 00:00:30.880 --> 00:00:32.440 Let's get people talking. 16 00:00:32.440 --> 00:00:33.920 And I think that's important. 17 00:00:41.920 --> 00:00:43.400 Hello, Joanne, welcome to Half the Picture. 18 00:00:43.400 --> 00:00:44.480 How are you doing today? 19 00:00:44.480 --> 00:00:45.400 I'm good. 20 00:00:45.400 --> 00:00:47.680 Thank you very much for having me. 21 00:00:47.680 --> 00:00:48.360 No problem. 22 00:00:48.360 --> 00:00:50.360 We're here to talk about your film Broken Bird, 23 00:00:50.360 --> 00:00:53.400 which is soon to come out on a home media in the UK 24 00:00:53.400 --> 00:00:57.840 and is soon to be getting a theatrical release in the US. 25 00:00:57.840 --> 00:01:01.160 Yeah, as I was saying before, I saw it last night. 26 00:01:01.160 --> 00:01:02.000 I loved it. 27 00:01:02.000 --> 00:01:03.520 What's interesting to me about that film 28 00:01:03.520 --> 00:01:05.160 is that it feels very assured, 29 00:01:05.160 --> 00:01:07.080 but it's your directorial debut. 30 00:01:07.080 --> 00:01:09.160 And a question I've been asking on the pod 31 00:01:09.160 --> 00:01:10.800 a lot lately about, yes, is like, 32 00:01:10.800 --> 00:01:14.160 what makes a good sort of film profession insert here? 33 00:01:14.160 --> 00:01:17.040 So what makes a good editor or makes a good composer 34 00:01:17.040 --> 00:01:18.160 or makes a good director? 35 00:01:18.160 --> 00:01:20.880 And I guess for you, as seeing as this was your first film, 36 00:01:20.880 --> 00:01:22.960 what do you think makes a good director 37 00:01:22.960 --> 00:01:25.400 based on what you learned from this film? 38 00:01:25.400 --> 00:01:26.840 I think what makes a good director 39 00:01:26.840 --> 00:01:29.240 is having amazing people around you. 40 00:01:29.240 --> 00:01:33.400 Just having an amazing team, amazing HODs, crew, 41 00:01:33.400 --> 00:01:34.760 and casting it. 42 00:01:35.880 --> 00:01:38.000 I think it always starts with the story. 43 00:01:38.000 --> 00:01:39.680 I think it starts with the writing 44 00:01:39.680 --> 00:01:41.640 and I think it starts with the characters 45 00:01:41.640 --> 00:01:43.680 so that when you've got really great characters 46 00:01:43.680 --> 00:01:47.520 and a great arc and a clear story 47 00:01:47.520 --> 00:01:50.320 that means something that resonates with you 48 00:01:50.320 --> 00:01:54.480 so that then you can visualize it 49 00:01:54.480 --> 00:01:58.480 and express that vision to your team, 50 00:01:58.480 --> 00:02:00.080 then that really, really helps. 51 00:02:00.080 --> 00:02:04.640 I think I've been working on the story for quite some time 52 00:02:04.640 --> 00:02:07.200 so I was very clear of what I wanted, 53 00:02:07.200 --> 00:02:08.400 which always helps. 54 00:02:08.400 --> 00:02:11.200 And I was working in Serbia, 55 00:02:11.200 --> 00:02:13.920 so I had to be super, super clear 56 00:02:13.920 --> 00:02:16.080 because there was a language barrier, 57 00:02:17.640 --> 00:02:20.120 which we can talk about later on if you want to, 58 00:02:20.120 --> 00:02:23.200 but yes, so I think ultimately, 59 00:02:23.200 --> 00:02:27.120 it really boils down to you having that clear vision 60 00:02:27.120 --> 00:02:30.240 of what you want and being able to express it to your team 61 00:02:30.240 --> 00:02:32.000 and for that team to really, 62 00:02:32.920 --> 00:02:34.560 to have that support of your team 63 00:02:34.560 --> 00:02:37.320 because you can't do it without them. 64 00:02:37.320 --> 00:02:38.640 To having good people around you 65 00:02:38.640 --> 00:02:41.400 and being able to communicate sounds like the hallmarks 66 00:02:41.400 --> 00:02:42.240 of a good character. 67 00:02:42.240 --> 00:02:46.720 And I think the start of it is the script and the story 68 00:02:46.720 --> 00:02:48.120 and casting. 69 00:02:48.120 --> 00:02:50.160 Yeah, so there's quite a lot actually. 70 00:02:50.160 --> 00:02:52.160 But yeah, I think it's, 71 00:02:52.160 --> 00:02:53.800 I think those are the most, 72 00:02:53.800 --> 00:02:55.640 it starts with the story, 73 00:02:55.640 --> 00:02:59.760 the characters, the team and the casting. 74 00:02:59.760 --> 00:03:00.760 Yeah. 75 00:03:00.760 --> 00:03:02.200 Mm, good answer. 76 00:03:02.200 --> 00:03:04.120 And with this story then, 77 00:03:04.120 --> 00:03:06.000 because I'm curious to ask about the sort of, 78 00:03:06.000 --> 00:03:07.320 what was the germ of the idea? 79 00:03:07.320 --> 00:03:09.120 Because the story is so, 80 00:03:09.120 --> 00:03:12.120 it goes to so many sort of strange, twisted, dark places. 81 00:03:12.120 --> 00:03:13.040 I mean, it is a horror film. 82 00:03:13.040 --> 00:03:15.280 So you know, it's what you'd expect. 83 00:03:15.280 --> 00:03:17.760 But like, it goes to some very unpredictable places. 84 00:03:17.760 --> 00:03:20.080 Like, you know, it kind of kept me and my girlfriend 85 00:03:20.080 --> 00:03:21.320 on our toes when we watched it. 86 00:03:21.320 --> 00:03:23.640 I mean, what, and I know it, yeah. 87 00:03:23.640 --> 00:03:26.800 And I know, yes, thumbs up, success. 88 00:03:26.800 --> 00:03:29.600 And because I know it started as a short film originally, 89 00:03:29.600 --> 00:03:30.680 then expanded to feature length. 90 00:03:30.680 --> 00:03:32.840 I mean, what was the germination of this idea 91 00:03:32.840 --> 00:03:35.760 that is at the sort of heart of the film? 92 00:03:35.760 --> 00:03:40.760 Well, it's all kudos to the woman who actually, 93 00:03:41.240 --> 00:03:44.360 it was her original story, her original idea, 94 00:03:44.360 --> 00:03:45.560 which was from the short film, 95 00:03:45.560 --> 00:03:48.320 which was originally called Cypill 96 00:03:48.320 --> 00:03:52.720 and Tracy came to us with this idea 97 00:03:52.720 --> 00:03:55.960 and said, look, what do you think about this? 98 00:03:55.960 --> 00:03:57.480 And she wrote us an email. 99 00:03:57.480 --> 00:03:59.800 And I thought, oh, gosh, that's really, really interesting. 100 00:03:59.800 --> 00:04:00.640 Let's give it a go. 101 00:04:00.640 --> 00:04:02.480 And it was for a short film because at that time, 102 00:04:02.480 --> 00:04:04.560 I hadn't directed anything I'd co-produced 103 00:04:04.560 --> 00:04:07.200 and co-written and been in quite a bit of stuff, 104 00:04:07.200 --> 00:04:09.760 but with my other half. 105 00:04:09.760 --> 00:04:13.920 So I really, I had this sort of urge to want to direct. 106 00:04:13.920 --> 00:04:15.840 So I liked her. 107 00:04:15.840 --> 00:04:18.520 I liked this character, even though it was any sort of, 108 00:04:18.520 --> 00:04:20.560 in the end, the script was like five or six pages 109 00:04:20.560 --> 00:04:24.040 and it was under sort of between 10 and 15 minute short film. 110 00:04:24.040 --> 00:04:25.840 There was something about her that I liked, 111 00:04:25.840 --> 00:04:27.560 even though she was completely odd 112 00:04:27.560 --> 00:04:29.120 and did despicable things. 113 00:04:30.560 --> 00:04:34.160 But that was the sort of, from there, 114 00:04:34.160 --> 00:04:38.760 the journey expanded because I wanted to understand 115 00:04:38.760 --> 00:04:43.280 more about her and why she did these things that she does 116 00:04:43.280 --> 00:04:48.520 because there was some part of me that really was indeed to her. 117 00:04:48.520 --> 00:04:53.000 But there was another part that was, you know, 118 00:04:53.000 --> 00:04:55.800 I felt I was reviled by her. 119 00:04:55.800 --> 00:04:58.680 So I was really interested in that sort of juxtaposition. 120 00:04:58.680 --> 00:05:03.800 So we did myself and Tracy and Dominic. 121 00:05:03.800 --> 00:05:07.800 We did a lot of, you know, brainstorming 122 00:05:07.800 --> 00:05:10.600 and I was really thinking about where she came from 123 00:05:10.640 --> 00:05:14.120 and why she did the things that she did. 124 00:05:14.120 --> 00:05:19.120 And for me, it has to, it has to be based in emotional truth. 125 00:05:20.200 --> 00:05:25.800 And that's what, you know, that's what I think the film is. 126 00:05:25.800 --> 00:05:28.840 I think even though it does sit within the horror genre, 127 00:05:28.840 --> 00:05:34.160 it is each character has an emotional truth and honesty to them. 128 00:05:34.160 --> 00:05:38.680 And for me, that really then helped me expand 129 00:05:38.680 --> 00:05:41.440 what I could do with the storytelling 130 00:05:41.440 --> 00:05:44.120 because as we know in horror, 131 00:05:44.120 --> 00:05:48.920 it's a wonderful platform for storytelling and anything can go. 132 00:05:48.920 --> 00:05:50.280 And you can really play with that 133 00:05:50.280 --> 00:05:52.320 and we can play with the imagination. 134 00:05:52.320 --> 00:05:56.520 So yeah, so that's how it's sort of evolved into what Broke and Bird. 135 00:05:57.600 --> 00:06:00.120 And because I absolutely agree with you about the horror genre 136 00:06:00.120 --> 00:06:01.720 that it can be, it's so elastic 137 00:06:01.720 --> 00:06:05.920 and it can be used basically to tell any story and sort of probe any taboo. 138 00:06:05.920 --> 00:06:07.000 I mean, what is it about horror? 139 00:06:07.000 --> 00:06:09.400 Is that the sort of element of horror that sort of galvanises you 140 00:06:09.400 --> 00:06:12.360 and galvanises you into making this movie in one of them? 141 00:06:12.360 --> 00:06:15.200 Yeah, I mean, as you know, as you've just said, 142 00:06:15.200 --> 00:06:19.000 there are so many sub-genres within horror. 143 00:06:19.000 --> 00:06:24.000 And for me, personally, I like the sort of more character-led horror movies. 144 00:06:28.400 --> 00:06:34.600 And I think that's where my sensibility lies 145 00:06:34.600 --> 00:06:37.360 within the genre. 146 00:06:37.360 --> 00:06:41.560 And yeah, so I think that's what will always compel me. 147 00:06:41.560 --> 00:06:43.400 It's always to do with character. 148 00:06:43.400 --> 00:06:45.760 So I mean, it could be any genre to be honest, 149 00:06:45.760 --> 00:06:50.600 but I think, you know, as long as the character's strong and real, 150 00:06:50.600 --> 00:06:54.600 I think I can then play and go anywhere 151 00:06:54.600 --> 00:06:58.680 because the audience will be drawn in to the character 152 00:06:58.680 --> 00:07:00.720 and taken on that journey. 153 00:07:00.720 --> 00:07:03.240 So everything else that you throw at them 154 00:07:03.240 --> 00:07:07.840 within the confines of that character becomes compelling 155 00:07:07.840 --> 00:07:14.560 and dare I say believable in a kind of dark way. 156 00:07:14.560 --> 00:07:18.480 So yeah, that's what, for me, that really, 157 00:07:18.480 --> 00:07:21.200 that's where my interest lies. 158 00:07:21.200 --> 00:07:24.720 And speaking about characters and making characters believable, 159 00:07:24.720 --> 00:07:26.880 the star of this movie is Rebecca Kolder, 160 00:07:26.880 --> 00:07:29.280 who is fantastic in the film. 161 00:07:29.280 --> 00:07:32.800 And as we say, this film in this character particularly 162 00:07:32.800 --> 00:07:35.160 of Sybil goes to so many dark places. 163 00:07:35.160 --> 00:07:36.840 And as I was watching it, I was thinking, 164 00:07:36.840 --> 00:07:38.400 there must be a great degree of trust. 165 00:07:38.400 --> 00:07:40.920 There would have had to have been a great degree of trust to me anyway 166 00:07:40.920 --> 00:07:43.840 between you and her as a director and actor combo 167 00:07:43.840 --> 00:07:47.040 in order to take this character into these sort of twisted areas 168 00:07:47.040 --> 00:07:48.040 and make that believable. 169 00:07:48.040 --> 00:07:50.320 I mean, what was it like working with her on the film? 170 00:07:50.320 --> 00:07:53.400 Oh, I mean, Rebecca is amazing. 171 00:07:53.400 --> 00:07:56.080 And I didn't know her before. 172 00:07:56.120 --> 00:08:00.600 I didn't manage to meet her before because I was in Belgrade 173 00:08:00.600 --> 00:08:05.000 and there was no time for me to actually get over to London 174 00:08:05.000 --> 00:08:06.480 and do the audition process. 175 00:08:06.480 --> 00:08:10.480 So which was hard actually, which worried me 176 00:08:10.480 --> 00:08:12.800 because you can see someone on screen, 177 00:08:12.800 --> 00:08:14.120 but what happens if you don't gel? 178 00:08:14.120 --> 00:08:17.040 And as you said, there needs to be a lot of trust 179 00:08:17.040 --> 00:08:21.640 with this character because she does go to some deep dark places. 180 00:08:22.280 --> 00:08:26.280 However, Rebecca was phenomenal 181 00:08:26.280 --> 00:08:31.280 and she is such an instinctive, nuanced, enigmatic actor. 182 00:08:34.240 --> 00:08:39.080 And she really, really asks all the questions 183 00:08:39.080 --> 00:08:41.720 and wants to know all the backstory 184 00:08:41.720 --> 00:08:44.280 because there is a little bit touched on in the film, 185 00:08:44.280 --> 00:08:49.520 but in order to make her a really fully rounded, layered character, 186 00:08:50.520 --> 00:08:54.080 she needed to ask questions about other stuff. 187 00:08:54.080 --> 00:08:56.840 So we did discuss a lot when she came. 188 00:08:56.840 --> 00:08:58.480 I think it was only like maybe two weeks 189 00:08:58.480 --> 00:08:59.720 before we started shooting. 190 00:08:59.720 --> 00:09:02.560 So you can imagine there wasn't much time for a rehearsal, 191 00:09:02.560 --> 00:09:06.880 but we would go out for coffees and we'd talk extensively 192 00:09:06.880 --> 00:09:11.560 and she made a sort of Bible of her character's journey 193 00:09:11.560 --> 00:09:14.360 and everything in the script and had lists 194 00:09:14.360 --> 00:09:16.080 and lists of questions for me. 195 00:09:16.080 --> 00:09:17.960 And it was so much fun to work on 196 00:09:18.000 --> 00:09:21.400 because I've done acting in the past myself 197 00:09:21.400 --> 00:09:25.320 so that helped me be able to relate stuff with her. 198 00:09:25.320 --> 00:09:30.800 And yeah, as long as it was based in truth 199 00:09:30.800 --> 00:09:35.800 and as long as it was done with care and consideration, 200 00:09:38.520 --> 00:09:43.720 everything, and she understood why it was happening, 201 00:09:43.720 --> 00:09:46.840 then she was completely fine with it with everything 202 00:09:46.880 --> 00:09:49.360 because there are, as you said, some moments 203 00:09:49.360 --> 00:09:51.480 where you kind of go, ooh, you know, 204 00:09:52.880 --> 00:09:56.280 but without giving any spoilers away, 205 00:09:56.280 --> 00:10:01.080 it's because it's real to her, it's her truth 206 00:10:01.080 --> 00:10:05.680 and she's totally justified in everything she does. 207 00:10:05.680 --> 00:10:08.160 So, and also you have to, 208 00:10:08.160 --> 00:10:10.240 and we got on very well in that way. 209 00:10:10.240 --> 00:10:11.960 So I think that really helped. 210 00:10:12.920 --> 00:10:15.000 I think it's really important for actors 211 00:10:15.960 --> 00:10:20.280 from my experience as well to feel really safe on set 212 00:10:20.280 --> 00:10:23.480 because especially in a foreign country 213 00:10:23.480 --> 00:10:26.560 where everyone is speaking Serbian on set 214 00:10:26.560 --> 00:10:30.640 and a lot of them don't even speak English 215 00:10:30.640 --> 00:10:32.320 and they're all wonderful, they're brilliant, 216 00:10:32.320 --> 00:10:34.760 they're an amazing crew, but you know, 217 00:10:34.760 --> 00:10:36.720 they're very passionate people, the Serbs, 218 00:10:36.720 --> 00:10:38.440 and so they're quite loud 219 00:10:38.440 --> 00:10:41.200 and this is quite a quiet film. 220 00:10:41.200 --> 00:10:44.000 So when they're sort of shouting, here we are, 221 00:10:44.000 --> 00:10:45.920 I could feel sometimes the actors going, 222 00:10:47.680 --> 00:10:50.400 but you know, they really sort of, 223 00:10:50.400 --> 00:10:52.160 they stepped up to that challenge 224 00:10:52.160 --> 00:10:55.120 and it was just, for me, it was really important 225 00:10:55.120 --> 00:10:59.400 to that they all felt heard and seen and nurtured 226 00:11:00.680 --> 00:11:05.680 and I think that was the experience that they had. 227 00:11:06.800 --> 00:11:09.720 Yeah, and with that Serbian crew 228 00:11:09.720 --> 00:11:11.160 because as we said at the start, like, you know, 229 00:11:11.160 --> 00:11:12.520 as you said, you know, one of the hallmarks 230 00:11:12.520 --> 00:11:14.120 of a good director is good communication. 231 00:11:14.120 --> 00:11:16.960 As you say, you're working with a predominantly Serbian crew, 232 00:11:16.960 --> 00:11:18.680 you know, a lot of them don't speak English. 233 00:11:18.680 --> 00:11:20.960 I mean, what challenges do that pose for you on set 234 00:11:20.960 --> 00:11:22.240 as you're trying to get the shots 235 00:11:22.240 --> 00:11:23.120 and get the performances 236 00:11:23.120 --> 00:11:24.720 and get just get the movie made? 237 00:11:24.720 --> 00:11:25.720 Yeah, yeah. 238 00:11:27.080 --> 00:11:31.320 So I was very clear, I had a very clear shot list 239 00:11:31.320 --> 00:11:33.960 of what I wanted and my camera plans 240 00:11:33.960 --> 00:11:39.200 and I'd worked with the D.O.P. Ego Manovic beforehand 241 00:11:39.200 --> 00:11:40.840 and we'd obviously discussed everything 242 00:11:40.840 --> 00:11:43.320 and obviously with the other HODs, production designers, 243 00:11:43.320 --> 00:11:45.720 customer designers, art directors. 244 00:11:45.720 --> 00:11:49.560 So everything was very clear about what we wanted. 245 00:11:49.560 --> 00:11:53.720 Now, when an Ego was actually, his English is fine 246 00:11:53.720 --> 00:11:58.720 and I had a very, very wonderful first AD, Miliner 247 00:11:59.480 --> 00:12:02.480 and she had very, very good English. 248 00:12:02.480 --> 00:12:07.480 So what happened because the time is always against you 249 00:12:08.120 --> 00:12:12.120 and if I would say, okay, this is what's gonna happen now 250 00:12:12.120 --> 00:12:15.360 in English and then she would have to then translate 251 00:12:15.360 --> 00:12:19.360 to Serbian, that's taking up time, that's eating time. 252 00:12:19.360 --> 00:12:22.680 So every day, you know, she'd have my shot list 253 00:12:22.680 --> 00:12:24.360 and I'd say, this is what I want blah, blah, blah. 254 00:12:24.360 --> 00:12:27.760 So we decided in the end because we were looking at the clock 255 00:12:27.760 --> 00:12:31.080 and she said, look, Joe, can I just say everything 256 00:12:31.080 --> 00:12:33.120 instead of you saying it in English? 257 00:12:33.120 --> 00:12:35.640 I'll just tell them, we all know what you want. 258 00:12:35.640 --> 00:12:36.960 I'll just tell them all in Serbian. 259 00:12:37.000 --> 00:12:38.840 I went, yeah, do it, do it, whatever works, 260 00:12:38.840 --> 00:12:40.280 let's just get moving. 261 00:12:40.280 --> 00:12:43.600 So we found a way of making it work 262 00:12:43.600 --> 00:12:47.960 because I was nervous about exactly that 263 00:12:47.960 --> 00:12:50.920 because this is a very British film as well 264 00:12:50.920 --> 00:12:54.120 and most of them haven't even been to England. 265 00:12:54.120 --> 00:12:59.120 So it was really important to get that tone right 266 00:13:00.440 --> 00:13:04.400 and to really, and I think what happened was 267 00:13:04.400 --> 00:13:08.560 was that it always takes a while to find the rhythm, 268 00:13:08.560 --> 00:13:12.080 maybe at the first few days, maybe a week to find the rhythm 269 00:13:12.080 --> 00:13:14.080 and everyone's sort of sussing everybody out 270 00:13:14.080 --> 00:13:18.640 and I'm a woman and there's all these kind of things going on 271 00:13:18.640 --> 00:13:21.960 and then I think everyone sort of found their flow 272 00:13:21.960 --> 00:13:26.720 and everyone then trusted and then it became a big family. 273 00:13:26.720 --> 00:13:27.560 So it was great. 274 00:13:27.560 --> 00:13:29.680 So it didn't really matter about the language. 275 00:13:29.680 --> 00:13:32.960 There was a smile here, how are you thumbs up 276 00:13:32.960 --> 00:13:35.160 all that kind of stuff when you're walking on set 277 00:13:35.160 --> 00:13:37.640 and stuff because literally some people 278 00:13:37.640 --> 00:13:39.400 didn't speak a word of English. 279 00:13:39.400 --> 00:13:42.960 But I think it's to do with how you are 280 00:13:42.960 --> 00:13:46.640 and how everyone is and how everyone treated each other 281 00:13:46.640 --> 00:13:48.360 with that sort of basic humanity 282 00:13:49.680 --> 00:13:53.320 which kind of made for a very enjoyable experience 283 00:13:53.320 --> 00:13:55.560 despite all the challenges. 284 00:13:56.560 --> 00:13:58.560 And as you say, the movie is a British movie 285 00:13:58.560 --> 00:14:00.920 in that sort of tone and I mean particularly, 286 00:14:00.920 --> 00:14:05.040 it has a very interesting, very morbid northern sensibility 287 00:14:05.040 --> 00:14:07.400 and northern style and sense of humor. 288 00:14:07.400 --> 00:14:09.720 And as you say, you're making it in Serbia 289 00:14:09.720 --> 00:14:12.600 but then obviously it's also about a very specific sort 290 00:14:12.600 --> 00:14:13.440 of part of the UK. 291 00:14:13.440 --> 00:14:16.040 I mean, how important was it for you to capture 292 00:14:16.040 --> 00:14:17.800 that sort of northern tone? 293 00:14:17.800 --> 00:14:20.560 At least it seems to me on screen in the film. 294 00:14:21.520 --> 00:14:25.880 Yeah, it was super important that I got that 295 00:14:25.880 --> 00:14:28.160 and I didn't know how I was going to get that 296 00:14:28.160 --> 00:14:29.240 when I went out there. 297 00:14:29.240 --> 00:14:31.800 That's the one thing that made me feel sick 298 00:14:31.800 --> 00:14:34.600 because I just thought, I've never been to Serbia. 299 00:14:34.600 --> 00:14:36.720 I'd looked at the pictures of Serbia 300 00:14:36.720 --> 00:14:39.160 and I was like, this isn't going to work. 301 00:14:39.160 --> 00:14:40.200 This is not going to work. 302 00:14:40.200 --> 00:14:41.720 And then I was driven from the airport 303 00:14:41.720 --> 00:14:43.680 to the production offices 304 00:14:43.680 --> 00:14:45.600 and there was like brutalist architecture 305 00:14:45.600 --> 00:14:46.800 but it means beautiful. 306 00:14:46.800 --> 00:14:50.760 But I just thought, my God, this is not your chair. 307 00:14:52.160 --> 00:14:56.320 And anyway, so it was kind of terrifying. 308 00:14:56.320 --> 00:14:58.440 I did feel sick for quite a lot of the time 309 00:14:58.520 --> 00:15:02.560 and then I was, when I started going out to the locations 310 00:15:02.560 --> 00:15:05.480 and when I had a great scout and location manager 311 00:15:05.480 --> 00:15:09.200 and it did take time to find what I wanted 312 00:15:09.200 --> 00:15:11.280 because don't forget they hadn't been to England. 313 00:15:11.280 --> 00:15:15.040 So they were only going online lookbook and what I said. 314 00:15:15.040 --> 00:15:19.080 But given that time, I think I had two or three weeks 315 00:15:19.080 --> 00:15:23.640 for scouting, I started finding locations that I, 316 00:15:23.640 --> 00:15:25.720 but I think that was also to do with me 317 00:15:25.720 --> 00:15:27.960 having to really open my mind 318 00:15:28.000 --> 00:15:31.200 because it was very set in my head, the landscape 319 00:15:31.200 --> 00:15:32.680 because I live in the landscape. 320 00:15:32.680 --> 00:15:33.880 So I know what it looks like. 321 00:15:33.880 --> 00:15:35.280 I know what the stone looks like. 322 00:15:35.280 --> 00:15:38.320 I know what the wet gray looks like. 323 00:15:38.320 --> 00:15:43.320 And so it was a challenge, but we did find it. 324 00:15:43.840 --> 00:15:48.840 So for example, the pub scene, it was written 325 00:15:49.560 --> 00:15:52.560 as a pub scene in a kind of open mic night 326 00:15:52.560 --> 00:15:55.000 in one of those old pubs with wooden beams 327 00:15:55.000 --> 00:15:57.320 of white walls and sticky carpets. 328 00:15:57.320 --> 00:16:01.640 But there was no way I was going to find that in Belgrade 329 00:16:01.640 --> 00:16:02.880 or Serbia. 330 00:16:02.880 --> 00:16:07.160 And you know, they sort of given me, 331 00:16:07.160 --> 00:16:11.800 presented to me a few kind of those themed Irish pubs. 332 00:16:11.800 --> 00:16:15.080 And it was like, no, no, no, no, no, it's not going to work. 333 00:16:15.080 --> 00:16:17.160 But then I was going to have a pizza one day 334 00:16:17.160 --> 00:16:21.440 around the back of the, where the production offices are. 335 00:16:21.440 --> 00:16:24.840 And I just found, I came across this like little restaurant. 336 00:16:24.840 --> 00:16:26.520 I was like, do you know what? 337 00:16:26.520 --> 00:16:30.040 This could be a little poetry bar. 338 00:16:30.040 --> 00:16:31.760 And we could convert this. 339 00:16:31.760 --> 00:16:32.840 And this would work well. 340 00:16:32.840 --> 00:16:34.520 I could see this in Hebdenbridge. 341 00:16:34.520 --> 00:16:36.920 This is the way it looked, the way it felt, 342 00:16:36.920 --> 00:16:39.280 the sort of ambiance, the tone of it. 343 00:16:39.280 --> 00:16:41.400 So then I brought the production designer in 344 00:16:41.400 --> 00:16:44.640 and obviously this cinematographer, and we discussed it. 345 00:16:44.640 --> 00:16:47.920 And actually, for me, because there's a kind of 346 00:16:47.920 --> 00:16:49.160 pretentiousness to it. 347 00:16:49.160 --> 00:16:51.560 And I think that kind of worked really well, 348 00:16:51.560 --> 00:16:54.040 that kind of arty, farty pretentiousness. 349 00:16:54.040 --> 00:16:56.480 And I think it worked better, actually, 350 00:16:56.480 --> 00:16:59.920 than just a local pub in the Yorkshire Dales. 351 00:16:59.920 --> 00:17:01.040 So yeah, I was really happy. 352 00:17:01.040 --> 00:17:04.760 But I think it's that kind of flexibility of opening your mind 353 00:17:04.760 --> 00:17:09.120 when you have a very clear vision. 354 00:17:09.120 --> 00:17:14.120 So it's, that's just filmmaking through and through. 355 00:17:14.120 --> 00:17:16.120 Don't let the plan get in the way of a better idea. 356 00:17:16.120 --> 00:17:19.560 Exactly, exactly, exactly. 357 00:17:19.560 --> 00:17:22.600 And what kind of influences were sort of bearing down 358 00:17:22.600 --> 00:17:24.240 on the movie, because like, as I say, 359 00:17:24.240 --> 00:17:25.920 we talk about that northern sort of soul, 360 00:17:25.920 --> 00:17:27.800 that northern morbidness and that energy. 361 00:17:27.800 --> 00:17:30.400 And I mean, I'm reminded of things like League of Gentlemen 362 00:17:30.400 --> 00:17:32.680 and that kind of strand of, like, even sort of films 363 00:17:32.680 --> 00:17:34.480 up by Ben Wheatley, like Kill List and stuff, 364 00:17:34.480 --> 00:17:36.760 that sort of strand of sort of northern kind of, 365 00:17:36.760 --> 00:17:38.280 like, darkness and humor. 366 00:17:38.280 --> 00:17:39.920 I mean, what kind of things were influencing you 367 00:17:39.920 --> 00:17:42.000 on the making of the movie? 368 00:17:42.000 --> 00:17:42.720 Good question. 369 00:17:42.720 --> 00:17:47.600 I think subconsciously, I was influenced subconsciously 370 00:17:47.600 --> 00:17:51.840 by certain films and filmmakers. 371 00:17:51.840 --> 00:17:56.320 The films that really sort of resonate with me 372 00:17:56.320 --> 00:17:59.040 are character-led films and films 373 00:17:59.040 --> 00:18:01.760 that sort of are playful and imaginative. 374 00:18:01.760 --> 00:18:06.560 So films like St. Mord, for example, 375 00:18:06.560 --> 00:18:09.760 which is very deeply embedded in emotional truth 376 00:18:09.760 --> 00:18:13.640 and character, but goes to some weird places. 377 00:18:13.640 --> 00:18:15.080 I love that. 378 00:18:15.080 --> 00:18:18.680 And then there's a kind of dark and light playfulness 379 00:18:18.680 --> 00:18:20.760 imagination of Del Toro. 380 00:18:20.760 --> 00:18:26.640 So there was this sort of, it's those sort of films for me, 381 00:18:26.640 --> 00:18:29.440 the Babadouk, they're really embedded in truth, 382 00:18:29.440 --> 00:18:31.040 but there's a playfulness to them. 383 00:18:33.800 --> 00:18:38.800 Also, I didn't, as I said, a lot of the production crew 384 00:18:40.880 --> 00:18:45.520 and my H.O.D. had never been to Britain. 385 00:18:45.520 --> 00:18:49.600 So it was really important for me to translate 386 00:18:49.600 --> 00:18:52.680 the feel of the film what I wanted to them 387 00:18:52.680 --> 00:18:56.400 if they've never even sort of been surrounded 388 00:18:56.400 --> 00:19:00.160 by anything in England, apart from what they see on the, 389 00:19:00.160 --> 00:19:02.280 well, maybe movies, not necessarily TV. 390 00:19:02.280 --> 00:19:05.160 I did say to my D.O.P. I said, look, I really want, 391 00:19:05.160 --> 00:19:06.320 and it's great that you said, like, 392 00:19:06.320 --> 00:19:08.280 League of Gentleman and stuff like that. 393 00:19:08.280 --> 00:19:10.280 And they do know things like that. 394 00:19:10.280 --> 00:19:12.400 But I said, also, look at things like Happy Valley. 395 00:19:12.400 --> 00:19:14.840 If we can get Happy Valley, because it's got that, 396 00:19:14.840 --> 00:19:17.600 I mean, it's literally set in, 397 00:19:17.600 --> 00:19:20.520 I have done bridges, Happy Valley, that's where I live. 398 00:19:20.520 --> 00:19:22.760 So it was, I said, look at that. 399 00:19:22.760 --> 00:19:24.160 There's a gritty realness to it, 400 00:19:24.160 --> 00:19:29.040 but there's a kind of, you know, normalness to it as well. 401 00:19:29.040 --> 00:19:31.280 And I want that reality. 402 00:19:31.280 --> 00:19:32.760 So they did, they watched, you know, 403 00:19:32.760 --> 00:19:34.320 they watched things like that, saying more, 404 00:19:34.320 --> 00:19:36.160 they were obsessed with, because they hadn't seen that, 405 00:19:36.160 --> 00:19:37.040 and they loved that. 406 00:19:37.040 --> 00:19:39.560 And yeah, League of Gentleman is a great one. 407 00:19:39.560 --> 00:19:40.600 I hadn't really thought about it, 408 00:19:40.600 --> 00:19:41.800 but I loved League of Gentleman. 409 00:19:41.800 --> 00:19:45.960 And any of those kind of northern dramas, 410 00:19:45.960 --> 00:19:48.680 I wish that a lot now is set up here, 411 00:19:48.680 --> 00:19:51.080 because of the wonderful landscape, 412 00:19:51.080 --> 00:19:55.400 and that sort of gritty realism and humor. 413 00:19:57.400 --> 00:19:59.840 Yeah, I mean, those films that you just reeled off, 414 00:19:59.840 --> 00:20:01.400 are terrific, like St. Mord's, 415 00:20:01.400 --> 00:20:02.720 a fantastic film, the Babadouk. 416 00:20:02.720 --> 00:20:04.280 I mean, that's one of my favorite horror films. 417 00:20:04.280 --> 00:20:05.920 And it's interesting that you mention those, 418 00:20:05.920 --> 00:20:07.480 because of course it makes sense to me, 419 00:20:07.480 --> 00:20:10.120 at least, in the lineage of Broken Bird, 420 00:20:10.120 --> 00:20:12.480 because, you know, that feminine, 421 00:20:12.480 --> 00:20:14.800 those horror sort of excursions into kind of, 422 00:20:14.800 --> 00:20:18.000 I guess, femininity and putting sort of feminine experience 423 00:20:18.000 --> 00:20:20.000 and the sort of psyche into horror. 424 00:20:20.000 --> 00:20:23.080 I mean, that's a really interesting sort of part of horror, 425 00:20:23.080 --> 00:20:24.920 which I guess in the last sort of 10, 15, 20, 426 00:20:24.920 --> 00:20:26.240 well, I mean, it's been going for decades, 427 00:20:26.240 --> 00:20:27.840 but like, I guess you've seen much more of that 428 00:20:27.840 --> 00:20:28.960 in the last 10, 15 years. 429 00:20:28.960 --> 00:20:32.000 I mean, how important do you think it is that horror 430 00:20:32.000 --> 00:20:33.640 explores that sort of, 431 00:20:33.640 --> 00:20:36.360 doing there's a lot there to sort of be carved out? 432 00:20:37.600 --> 00:20:40.760 I do, I do actually, and I think it is really important. 433 00:20:40.760 --> 00:20:44.440 And as you say, it has been going on for years, 434 00:20:44.440 --> 00:20:47.760 and decades, but not so much. 435 00:20:47.760 --> 00:20:51.640 And I think the more that there are female storytellers 436 00:20:51.640 --> 00:20:55.120 and filmmakers, then those stories will be more visible. 437 00:20:56.880 --> 00:20:58.440 And it's not to say that men can't do it, 438 00:20:58.440 --> 00:21:01.120 and it's not to say that women can't direct, you know, 439 00:21:01.120 --> 00:21:05.200 male-led films either, but it's interesting 440 00:21:05.200 --> 00:21:07.360 that it comes from a female perspective. 441 00:21:07.360 --> 00:21:11.320 Exactly, as you say, you know, Jennifer Kent with Babadouk 442 00:21:11.320 --> 00:21:13.440 and Rose Glass with St. Mord, 443 00:21:13.440 --> 00:21:18.440 there is those kind of, you know, it's real, 444 00:21:19.400 --> 00:21:22.040 and it's dark, and it's messy, 445 00:21:22.040 --> 00:21:25.560 and there's a quirkiness to it, 446 00:21:25.560 --> 00:21:29.400 because I feel that women are really, really interesting, 447 00:21:29.400 --> 00:21:33.640 and they're not just the ongenoo or the victim or whatever. 448 00:21:33.640 --> 00:21:34.800 They're all the villain. 449 00:21:34.800 --> 00:21:38.480 You know, there's so much going on there 450 00:21:38.480 --> 00:21:43.120 that women have got to give and to show and express. 451 00:21:43.120 --> 00:21:48.120 So I think, you know, the more we can support that 452 00:21:49.960 --> 00:21:53.080 within the industry, the better, not easy, 453 00:21:53.080 --> 00:21:58.080 but, you know, let's keep challenging that. 454 00:21:58.560 --> 00:22:00.680 Because there's so much, I agree, there's so much richness 455 00:22:00.680 --> 00:22:03.600 and nuance to be found, you know, in that experience. 456 00:22:03.600 --> 00:22:05.800 And I feel like, I guess, yeah, you could argue 457 00:22:05.800 --> 00:22:07.480 in the last 10 years, you know, not just in horror, 458 00:22:07.480 --> 00:22:10.040 but like, I guess more female filmmakers have been coming 459 00:22:10.040 --> 00:22:12.240 to the fore, more, you know, female-led stories, 460 00:22:12.240 --> 00:22:14.240 but I feel like horror is just so perfectly positioned 461 00:22:14.240 --> 00:22:16.080 a lot of ways to really, as we were saying earlier, 462 00:22:16.080 --> 00:22:19.320 it's so elastic, it can really plumb those depths. 463 00:22:19.320 --> 00:22:21.080 Yeah, yeah, absolutely. 464 00:22:21.080 --> 00:22:24.040 And I think, I mean, like I've said before, 465 00:22:24.040 --> 00:22:29.040 it's just playing with it and having the confidence 466 00:22:29.280 --> 00:22:32.720 to kind of go, well, let's, why not? 467 00:22:32.720 --> 00:22:35.040 Why doesn't she, can't she do this, you know, 468 00:22:35.040 --> 00:22:37.360 it wouldn't be thought, no one would think twice 469 00:22:37.360 --> 00:22:40.920 if a man did this action, but because a woman's doing it, 470 00:22:40.920 --> 00:22:43.280 oh my gosh, you know, it's taboo. 471 00:22:43.280 --> 00:22:46.920 But again, no spoilers, but it's kind of, 472 00:22:46.920 --> 00:22:49.680 but why not, you know, let's do it. 473 00:22:49.680 --> 00:22:50.640 Let's see what happens. 474 00:22:50.640 --> 00:22:51.640 Let's see the reaction. 475 00:22:51.640 --> 00:22:55.640 Let's get people talking and I think that's important. 476 00:22:55.640 --> 00:22:56.720 Mm, absolutely. 477 00:22:56.720 --> 00:22:58.400 And as we said at the start, like the movie 478 00:22:58.400 --> 00:23:00.120 is coming out on her media in the UK 479 00:23:00.120 --> 00:23:02.520 and then soon it's coming out at Fiatch within the US. 480 00:23:02.520 --> 00:23:06.040 I mean, as we say, like the movie is such a distinctive 481 00:23:06.040 --> 00:23:08.640 British, northern British sensibility. 482 00:23:08.640 --> 00:23:10.600 I mean, how do you feel like it's going to, 483 00:23:10.600 --> 00:23:11.760 what your expectations feel like, 484 00:23:11.760 --> 00:23:13.080 American reactions to that? 485 00:23:13.080 --> 00:23:14.360 I mean, how do you think it will go down? 486 00:23:14.360 --> 00:23:16.280 And have you had any reactions yet from sort of America? 487 00:23:16.280 --> 00:23:18.160 No, no, not really. 488 00:23:18.160 --> 00:23:18.840 Not really. 489 00:23:18.840 --> 00:23:22.240 I think they might try, I mean, I just don't know. 490 00:23:22.240 --> 00:23:25.120 I mean, it's the same when it premiered in the UK 491 00:23:25.120 --> 00:23:28.040 at the Fright Fest, I was like, you just don't know 492 00:23:28.040 --> 00:23:29.880 what that reaction is going to be. 493 00:23:31.400 --> 00:23:32.960 And thankfully, it was well received. 494 00:23:32.960 --> 00:23:36.560 But, you know, are the Americans that different to us? 495 00:23:36.560 --> 00:23:37.400 I don't know. 496 00:23:37.400 --> 00:23:41.080 They might, some parts of America might be totally appalled. 497 00:23:41.080 --> 00:23:43.000 And some parts of America will really love it. 498 00:23:43.000 --> 00:23:45.120 I, you know, it's like anything. 499 00:23:45.120 --> 00:23:48.280 I think the story is strong enough 500 00:23:48.280 --> 00:23:49.920 and I think the characters are strong enough 501 00:23:49.920 --> 00:23:52.400 and because they're based in truth, they become compelling 502 00:23:52.400 --> 00:23:57.400 and we can, the audience can be taken on a journey with that. 503 00:23:57.960 --> 00:24:01.760 I think there is, it is a dark British humour 504 00:24:03.000 --> 00:24:06.080 in some areas, which I think some Americans 505 00:24:06.080 --> 00:24:09.360 might struggle with, but some Americans might absolutely lap up. 506 00:24:11.240 --> 00:24:14.200 I also think some of the themes running through the film 507 00:24:14.200 --> 00:24:15.560 are universal. 508 00:24:15.560 --> 00:24:20.560 So you've got sort of the grief, you've got isolation, 509 00:24:20.840 --> 00:24:22.160 you've got loneliness. 510 00:24:22.160 --> 00:24:24.800 And I think those are something, you know, 511 00:24:24.800 --> 00:24:26.800 we deal with them all in different ways. 512 00:24:26.800 --> 00:24:31.800 And I think we've, I've just used this film as a platform 513 00:24:32.040 --> 00:24:35.880 to explore and play with them, but not in a kind of, 514 00:24:36.840 --> 00:24:39.760 there is a morbid way, but it's, there's also a playful way 515 00:24:39.760 --> 00:24:40.920 in an imaginative way. 516 00:24:40.920 --> 00:24:44.360 So hopefully, you know, I've kept an eye on the audience 517 00:24:44.360 --> 00:24:47.960 that they are going to be entertained as well as, 518 00:24:47.960 --> 00:24:52.960 as well as compelled and provoke, you know, thought-provoking, 519 00:24:53.720 --> 00:24:55.480 I would like to say, yeah. 520 00:24:55.480 --> 00:24:56.760 Hmm, absolutely. 521 00:24:56.760 --> 00:24:59.120 And what kind of memorable reactions have you had to the movie 522 00:24:59.120 --> 00:25:01.760 so far, like what are some of the most memorable ones? 523 00:25:01.760 --> 00:25:06.760 Reactions, well, I, you know, when I'm actually, 524 00:25:07.680 --> 00:25:11.040 I haven't, you know, I tend not to watch it 525 00:25:11.040 --> 00:25:12.480 with other people in a cinema, 526 00:25:12.480 --> 00:25:15.600 because it makes me feel incredibly anxious. 527 00:25:15.600 --> 00:25:20.600 But I did, I was in a couple of screenings. 528 00:25:20.600 --> 00:25:22.720 And I think the reactions to, 529 00:25:24.440 --> 00:25:27.720 when Mrs. Fisher does her certain thing to her husband, 530 00:25:27.720 --> 00:25:30.240 for example, I can't, can I say what it is? 531 00:25:30.240 --> 00:25:32.560 Because it's a spoiler, but, you know, it's a really, 532 00:25:32.560 --> 00:25:36.200 I, it was, it was, when she punches him, let's say, 533 00:25:37.080 --> 00:25:40.920 it was a really, really great moment for me 534 00:25:40.920 --> 00:25:44.520 because I really wanted it to be humorous 535 00:25:44.520 --> 00:25:47.080 and it got a massive laugh and it almost, you know, 536 00:25:47.080 --> 00:25:50.240 got a clap, you know, so, so it's interesting 537 00:25:50.240 --> 00:25:53.360 in like in, in Biff at the Brussels International 538 00:25:53.360 --> 00:25:58.360 fantastic films, I didn't know that they are very vocal 539 00:25:58.640 --> 00:26:02.080 in, in, in, in, in watching films. 540 00:26:02.080 --> 00:26:06.240 And they were just like whooping, clapping, laughing. 541 00:26:06.240 --> 00:26:08.240 And I was like, oh my God, that's brilliant. 542 00:26:08.240 --> 00:26:10.480 But I think they do that anyway. 543 00:26:10.480 --> 00:26:13.840 But they do boo if it's not very, you know, if they don't like it. 544 00:26:13.840 --> 00:26:17.200 So it's kind of, sorry, luckily that didn't happen. 545 00:26:18.200 --> 00:26:20.160 But I think, yeah, I'm, I'm really, 546 00:26:20.160 --> 00:26:24.120 I, what I like is that the, the moments of light relief, 547 00:26:24.120 --> 00:26:27.000 if it is because it's darkness and light, 548 00:26:27.000 --> 00:26:30.800 they seem to be, they seem to, they seem to work 549 00:26:30.800 --> 00:26:35.640 from the audiences that I've managed to creep into. 550 00:26:37.560 --> 00:26:39.880 And I think people, yeah, I think people have, 551 00:26:39.880 --> 00:26:45.080 have this reaction of, I don't like her, 552 00:26:45.080 --> 00:26:48.240 but I kind of do, you know, they have this kind of feeling 553 00:26:48.240 --> 00:26:51.800 that I shouldn't like her because of her despicable things 554 00:26:51.800 --> 00:26:53.400 that she does, but there's something about her 555 00:26:53.400 --> 00:26:56.200 that I kind of like and I like that because it's, 556 00:26:56.200 --> 00:26:58.360 it means that people are being compelled, 557 00:26:58.360 --> 00:27:01.480 they find her interesting and they're taking on, 558 00:27:01.480 --> 00:27:03.160 they're taking on her journey. 559 00:27:03.160 --> 00:27:08.160 So, yeah, hopefully those ingredients will translate 560 00:27:10.080 --> 00:27:12.840 to the US and Europe. 561 00:27:14.160 --> 00:27:16.320 I'll say, I mean, the moment where she punches the, 562 00:27:16.320 --> 00:27:18.400 the husband was the moment where me and my girlfriend were like, 563 00:27:18.400 --> 00:27:20.320 okay, wow, okay, where's this go? 564 00:27:20.320 --> 00:27:21.880 You know, I mean, where's this going next? 565 00:27:21.880 --> 00:27:23.600 So now I'll say it works. 566 00:27:24.400 --> 00:27:26.360 Thank you, thank you. 567 00:27:26.360 --> 00:27:27.360 No worries, Joanne. 568 00:27:27.360 --> 00:27:29.480 Well, thanks so much for coming on half the picture, Joanne. 569 00:27:29.480 --> 00:27:31.600 This was such pleasure to chat to you about the movie. 570 00:27:31.600 --> 00:27:33.040 As I say, I really enjoyed the movie 571 00:27:33.040 --> 00:27:34.880 and I can't wait to see how it goes down. 572 00:27:34.880 --> 00:27:36.480 If it has a say over an American, 573 00:27:36.480 --> 00:27:38.680 a new audience, a virgin audience to it. 574 00:27:38.680 --> 00:27:39.520 Yes. 575 00:27:39.520 --> 00:27:41.040 I'm sure it's going to, I'm sure it's going to pack 576 00:27:41.040 --> 00:27:43.520 a bit of a punch, so yeah. 577 00:27:43.520 --> 00:27:45.960 Thank you, nice pun there, I like it. 578 00:27:45.960 --> 00:27:47.400 I actually didn't even realise I did that. 579 00:27:47.400 --> 00:27:50.400 I actually, I honestly didn't even realise I made that pun. 580 00:27:50.400 --> 00:27:53.400 So that, well observed, I didn't even recognise that. 581 00:27:53.600 --> 00:27:56.600 Really, really, well, thanks so much, Joanne. 582 00:27:56.600 --> 00:27:58.400 Yeah, thank you so much. 583 00:28:07.600 --> 00:28:11.600 Hey everyone, thanks so much listening to my chat with Joanne Mitchell. 584 00:28:11.600 --> 00:28:13.600 Remember to like and subscribe to the podcast 585 00:28:13.600 --> 00:28:14.600 so you never miss an episode 586 00:28:14.600 --> 00:28:16.600 and stay tuned for more exciting interviews 587 00:28:16.600 --> 00:28:19.600 and guests coming soon on half the picture. 588 00:28:23.600 --> 00:28:33.600 Thank you.