WEBVTT

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President Zelensky, how are you doing?

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Well, it's hard.

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I'll be honest.

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I don't sleep.

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It's a huge, terrifying pain that I wouldn't wish on anyone.

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I can see the tears in your eyes.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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The war started February 24th of 22.

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I didn't think there would be a full-scale invasion.

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I was with my family, told my wife that to the kids, the war has started.

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I love you, I'll call you, and ran out.

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Satellite imagery captured a massive 64-kilometer long Russian military convoy leading to Kiev.

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And just imagine, 200,000 people are coming at you.

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It's simply impossible to defend.

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Missiles were raining down on your head.

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Those were absolutely horrifying moments.

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And I was in the bunker built right inside my office.

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Biden called me.

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We are ready to help you evacuate.

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What did you say to Biden?

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I need ammunition.

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not a ride.

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They expected people to run and me.

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I couldn't abandon the people.

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And then people showed up as volunteers, and our army grew from 200,000 to an army of 800,000.

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Day after day, we pushed back harder.

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What was your hardest day through the last four years?

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We liberated Bucha.

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I went there, dead bodies lying everywhere.

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Kids, adults, elderly people, chopped meat.

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Butchered them, hands tied, tortured, and then buried in pits.

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When you see a mass today finding a grave in the US or in Britain, God forbid, with 500 tortured people, how do you forgive?

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And that's why when President Trump says we need to find a compromise, well, you can't just forgive everything like that.

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Is there a realistic path to the end of this war?

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President Zelensky, sometimes the question I'm about to ask you, we answer it flippantly when people ask, but I really want you to answer it in the fullest honest context you possibly can.

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How are you doing?

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Well, it's hard.

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Hard because...

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It's like I'm surviving along with my country and with the people.

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And it's like really a question like, will tomorrow come or not?

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And the answer to that is, yes, it will.

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You can't answer it any other way because I am, that means my family, my relatives, my country, I'm an inseparable part of it.

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And so how do I feel?

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Hard, but with love.

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Understanding the difficult reality with optimism because I still believe good wins.

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I believe in that.

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Truly.

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Is it a bit of a rollercoaster on a human level for you?

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Are there days where there's more hope and days where there's less hope?

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You can't live without hope.

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I understand sometimes inside, you know, you can be shattered inside, especially during wartime, especially families who, you know, lose someone close in their family, a child, God forbid, or a wife, a husband, a mother.

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That is just an internal breakdown.

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It's very hard.

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And it's much harder for them, I believe.

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Just so much harder than it is for me with all these challenges.

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The weight of all of this sits often on your shoulders.

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And when someone does lose a child or a loved one or a wife or a sister or daughter, I imagine, as I've seen from some of these photos I have here of you, I mean, this photo in particular stands out to me.

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Oh, that's a terrible story.

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It's just a terrible story.

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That was, uh, that's when a missile hit a playground.

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And the missile speed was such that the siren didn't help at all.

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So it was a matter of seconds.

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And the missile struck and children were killed.

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And both children were killed there.

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Mostly.

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And adults.

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Just adults.

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Right there.

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A couple I remember, they were just out walking, passing by.

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And because they were walking by and were killed.

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Parents.

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You know, like right on this side there are homes too, and parents there, some of them saw through the window.

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Do you understand what it's like to see through a window one of your children just torn apart?

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And toys, during such a tragedy, it's a tradition to bring flowers for adults and toys for children.

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I went there, it's pain, I'll say it again, my pain can't even, it's not even 10% of the parents' pain.

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It's terrifying, just terrifying.

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A missile that cut short the life of a child who had seen nothing yet.

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Imagine, by the way, and there are children, a lot of them, among the fallen as well, who never lived in peace.

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I mean, we lived in a different time.

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We understand what it's like to live when there are no sirens, no shelling, and so on.

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But there are kids, every night they go down to the bomb shelter when the alarm goes off, and the alarm goes off every night, then they come back up, and some of them have died.

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And just imagine, there are children who never knew what peace was.

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That's horrifying.

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Absolutely.

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You said at the start of this invasion, this war, that you weren't sleeping.

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You said early in this invasion, you said you've not earned the right to sleep.

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And I'm really curious about the sort of human toll that all of this has taken on you over the last four or five years, because it never stops.

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It never ends.

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And you are a human being just like all the rest of us.

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You have a

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but you have the burden of this kind of horrific incident taking place in your country all the time.

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What is the sort of human burden there?

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And are you sleeping?

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I'll be honest.

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I don't sleep.

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I'm a responsible person.

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I have different traits, good ones, not so good ones.

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Like every person, nobody's perfect.

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Yeah.

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And every night I speak with our air defense operators, with our guys who run the air defense.

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Every night we talk.

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Well, yeah, thanks to modern technology, it's very easy.

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And we text back and forth what's needed right now.

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Let's pull some over from another region.

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So it's an active discussion, which obviously, well, doesn't let you sleep.

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Yeah, you know, getting eight hours of sleep like that is something.

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something totally new to me during these years, almost five years of war.

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I'm not complaining.

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I'm not complaining at all.

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And that's how I live.

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The burden, the strongest emotion, I once answered this honestly.

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There's a moment when I present awards.

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And there's this moment when I award, and personally the hero of Ukraine, it's the highest honor, when I present this award to parents who lost a child, yeah, a boy or a girl, soldiers.

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That feeling...

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You know, well, how I cease to exist in that moment.

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I'm just, well, it's not pain.

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It's something terrible.

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I look at these people, at their eyes, at what they say.

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Many of them say something.

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And there are people who just ask for a hug.

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Imagine you give an award to a father whose very strong hand you can feel.

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He's, you know, a strong man.

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You feel his strong hand and he just quietly says to you, can we hug?

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So they, well, you know, they're gone.

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Gone as people anymore.

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Well, for a time.

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Then strong people go.

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Try to survive.

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And these moments, on the one hand, I respect them.

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I do it.

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But on the other hand, it's hard to bear.

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I understand them.

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And it's a huge, terrifying pain that I wouldn't wish on anyone.

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What these parents feel, having lost a child, a soldier.

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These parents didn't lose a child on a playground.

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They lost a soldier.

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They knew that could happen.

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But knowing and losing are completely different things.

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I can see the tears in your eyes as you describe this.

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I'm a human being.

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I'm not ashamed to be who I am.

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I'm not the strongest man in the world.

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I try to set an example, but

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I'm definitely not a perfect person.

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Yeah.

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Is there anything that you... Because this is a lot to deal with.

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You know, I hear you recounting the stories of dealing with these parents.

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Is there anything that you do to take care of yourself?

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What is it that keeps you strong?

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My kids.

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My kids.

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I just, you know...

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I have to be an example.

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I told myself, maybe I don't have to, but that's what I told myself.

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I have to set an example for my kids.

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This is the way.

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That is not.

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And you have to set an example.

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Be strong.

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Be as brave as possible.

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But don't...

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Don't hide the pain.

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If you have it, you shouldn't say, I don't feel anything.

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Because human beings, by nature, they're alive.

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And that's their weakness.

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But it's also where a person's strength lies.

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That really is where our strength is.

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And so my kids keep me grounded, very much so.

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I want to set an example.

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I want them to be proud of me.

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We'll talk about that later.

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But there's one big outstanding question, which is, who is President Zelensky?

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And I've been through hundreds and hundreds of photos and stories from your childhood.

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I've got some wonderful photos here of your earliest days.

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And this is a beautiful one of your wonderful mother as well.

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That's my mom.

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Yeah.

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Mom was very beautiful.

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Well, she still is, but she's gotten older.

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Can you take me into your earliest context, just so I can get a sort of a view of what childhood was like for you?

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What's the context in which you grew up?

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And really, I want to understand how that context and early experience fed into the man you are today, the perspective you have, the values that you cherish.

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I'm from the generation that straddled two, let's say, two different lives.

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Meaning I was born in the Soviet Union when Ukraine was part of the Soviet Union.

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And I grew up in an independent Ukraine.

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And I've always said that my kids...

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They're lucky because they were born in an independent country without all these shades of gray.

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This is gray.

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That's something else.

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No, it's black and white.

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Totally clear.

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They're patriots.

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They love their country and their country is Ukraine.

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While we were born in the Soviet Union and, you know, we were kids.

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Yeah.

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From a fairly, let's say, I don't want to offend anyone so my dad doesn't get upset.

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Well, from a regular, very ordinary family, not very well off.

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Let's put it that way.

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Yeah, let's put it that way.

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Well, that's, and I think it's totally clear from the photos.

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I was born in Krivi Rijs.

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An academic family in Soviet era Ukraine wasn't not like, you know, in Europe or in the United States.

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An academic family with everything provided.

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Usually our academics didn't make a lot of money.

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But again, I'm not complaining.

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I respect my father.

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An honest man, a professor.

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Well, values.

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Again and again, I got an education.

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And I got raised right.

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And my parents love, I think those three things are enough to be grateful to your parents.

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I'm not sure people find this interesting.

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So let's move on.

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When you were a young boy in those photos, when you're under the age of 10, had I asked you what you wanted to be when you grew up?

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What would you have answered?

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Because, and to be honest, I changed like the wind.

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Honestly, there was a time when I really wanted to be a diplomat, wanted to be a border guard.

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Yeah.

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And then I went to law school, graduated from law faculty.

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And while studying, I realized that I was more interested in media.

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So I got out and started working that exact field.

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I mean, at 17 years old, you became interested in comedy.

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Yeah.

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And you joined a comedy group.

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And from what I read, you did that up until the age of about 26 years old.

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So you were a comedian up until the age of 26 years old before starting a media company.

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I, yeah, but I was more, I enjoyed, I was a script writer.

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And so sometimes as a writer, I also did a little acting.

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I enjoyed it.

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Yeah, until I was 26.

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And then at 26, I got my own company.

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There's some interesting stats I found.

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At 28 years old, you won Ukraine's Dancing with the Stars.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

237
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So you can dance?

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I think, yes.

239
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I'm not sure that now I can.

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And later, you voiced Paddington Bear in the Ukrainian language film.

241
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Yeah, I really, really loved...

242
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I think Paddington is a very cool thing.

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Really right.

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And for the people, I'm not sure all of it is just for kids, to be honest.

245
00:15:24.778 --> 00:15:25.578
But nonetheless...

246
00:15:26.819 --> 00:15:29.741
That character resonated deeply with me.

247
00:15:29.761 --> 00:15:36.684
And even after I became president, the next Paddington installment was coming out.

248
00:15:37.584 --> 00:15:39.465
And all this was before the war.

249
00:15:40.185 --> 00:15:46.348
And they were sending me signals, would you consider voicing another Paddington movie?

250
00:15:47.129 --> 00:15:49.690
I said, well, I'd really love to, but I didn't, yeah.

251
00:15:51.102 --> 00:15:51.282
No.

252
00:15:52.703 --> 00:15:57.046
And then between 34 years old and 37 years old, you appeared in a bunch of different feature films.

253
00:15:57.506 --> 00:16:09.094
And most interestingly, you starred as one particular character, a school teacher, who accidentally becomes president in the satirical TV series called Servant of... Of the people.

254
00:16:09.415 --> 00:16:09.975
The people.

255
00:16:10.636 --> 00:16:11.676
I think I have a photo.

256
00:16:12.197 --> 00:16:12.417
Yeah.

257
00:16:12.597 --> 00:16:13.377
Teacher of history.

258
00:16:13.397 --> 00:16:13.497
Yeah.

259
00:16:14.378 --> 00:16:17.841
You've got to explain the context here because people can't believe that this is true.

260
00:16:17.861 --> 00:16:23.706
They can't believe that you actually acted as an actor who accidentally becomes president.

261
00:16:24.687 --> 00:16:33.294
And you must find this bizarre that you then became president because presumably at that time you weren't expecting to become president when you became an actor pretending to be president.

262
00:16:33.594 --> 00:16:34.235
Absolutely.

263
00:16:34.775 --> 00:16:36.196
I definitely didn't expect it.

264
00:16:36.356 --> 00:16:36.937
Absolutely.

265
00:16:37.257 --> 00:16:41.280
And this idea, this idea was about 10 to 12 years old.

266
00:16:42.380 --> 00:16:49.723
Once this idea came to me and I thought about it, I lived with this idea for a long time.

267
00:16:49.743 --> 00:16:50.964
I love doing that.

268
00:16:51.124 --> 00:16:54.386
And at some point, the feeling was that...

269
00:16:55.743 --> 00:16:56.883
The world is changing.

270
00:16:57.384 --> 00:16:58.404
Ukraine is changing.

271
00:16:58.504 --> 00:17:00.505
And right now this idea is relevant.

272
00:17:00.805 --> 00:17:03.486
It will resonate and people will like it.

273
00:17:03.666 --> 00:17:06.147
What was the idea when you say the idea?

274
00:17:06.167 --> 00:17:15.270
The person from the people without any, uh, history, without any political background becomes president.

275
00:17:17.011 --> 00:17:19.992
And that's how it turned out to be honest.

276
00:17:21.757 --> 00:17:31.364
So you were playing a character in a TV series called Servant of the People, and the character was pretending to be the president.

277
00:17:32.084 --> 00:17:43.932
And you realized that actually the idea of there being a sort of Servant of the People party or president was probably quite a good idea based on what was going on in Ukraine at that time.

278
00:17:44.613 --> 00:17:50.637
And because of the government instability at the time, you actually registered Servant of the People as a real political party in Ukraine.

279
00:17:52.302 --> 00:18:00.029
Well, that sounds basically like a pretty good script, but it wasn't honestly calculated like that.

280
00:18:01.590 --> 00:18:03.452
The series was very popular.

281
00:18:04.373 --> 00:18:06.634
In parallel, there were a few other projects.

282
00:18:06.734 --> 00:18:09.597
We had a political satire project.

283
00:18:10.338 --> 00:18:11.318
It was very popular.

284
00:18:11.358 --> 00:18:13.120
It was even before that series.

285
00:18:13.380 --> 00:18:16.202
So I already had my bearings in politics anyway.

286
00:18:16.222 --> 00:18:16.903
Yeah.

287
00:18:17.205 --> 00:18:24.851
The point was that indeed, I decided to try my hand in this direction.

288
00:18:24.971 --> 00:18:32.477
I really wanted, after the occupation of Crimea, after the occupation of Donbass, this whole situation changed us.

289
00:18:32.597 --> 00:18:37.681
And you started to feel like something was going wrong here.

290
00:18:40.503 --> 00:18:46.065
and its war, but there still wasn't that feeling yet because it wasn't a full-scale war.

291
00:18:46.585 --> 00:18:55.227
And so I didn't want to... We were doing business with Belarus and with Kazakhstan and with Russia as well.

292
00:18:55.527 --> 00:18:59.369
We had offices and projects that we were filming and so on.

293
00:18:59.409 --> 00:19:01.449
So life changed.

294
00:19:01.969 --> 00:19:04.370
I wanted to drop it all.

295
00:19:04.810 --> 00:19:07.691
And this sense of betrayal by Russia,

296
00:19:09.022 --> 00:19:10.043
Well, all of that happened.

297
00:19:10.203 --> 00:19:15.628
And that's why, and you changed this whole period, changed you as well.

298
00:19:16.029 --> 00:19:18.591
And so it's not like it was some calculated plan.

299
00:19:18.811 --> 00:19:21.054
The TV show comes out and then a political party.

300
00:19:21.074 --> 00:19:21.694
I know about that.

301
00:19:22.795 --> 00:19:23.436
I know about that.

302
00:19:23.676 --> 00:19:24.657
Some people might think that.

303
00:19:24.917 --> 00:19:25.518
And that's fine.

304
00:19:25.538 --> 00:19:26.018
That's normal.

305
00:19:26.058 --> 00:19:27.079
People have their own opinions.

306
00:19:27.099 --> 00:19:27.380
That's normal.

307
00:19:27.400 --> 00:19:27.680
That's normal.

308
00:19:29.687 --> 00:19:30.568
It coincided.

309
00:19:31.428 --> 00:19:40.393
The mood in society coincided with my inner mood and with my determination and desire.

310
00:19:40.833 --> 00:19:43.475
So it's a coincidence of many things.

311
00:19:44.699 --> 00:19:46.039
Guys, I've got a favour to ask.

312
00:19:46.079 --> 00:19:52.141
The algorithm, if you follow a show, will deliver you the best episodes from that show very prominently in your feed.

313
00:19:52.421 --> 00:19:57.622
So when we have our best episodes on this show, the most shared episodes, the most rated episodes, I would love you to know.

314
00:19:57.782 --> 00:20:00.602
And the simple way for you to know that is to hit that follow button.

315
00:20:00.782 --> 00:20:05.003
But also, it's the simple, easy, free thing that you can do to help us make the show better.

316
00:20:05.023 --> 00:20:10.544
And I would be hugely grateful if you could take a minute on the app you're listening to this one right now and hit that follow button.

317
00:20:10.784 --> 00:20:13.445
Thank you so, so, so much.

318
00:20:15.438 --> 00:20:25.646
So you talked about how it was really sort of a change in the climate in Ukraine that caused you to move closer to politics.

319
00:20:25.686 --> 00:20:32.211
Because everything that was going on at the time, Russia invaded Crimea here in 2014.

320
00:20:32.411 --> 00:20:33.212
Yeah.

321
00:20:33.252 --> 00:20:34.252
The annexed Crimea.

322
00:20:34.913 --> 00:20:41.218
And so four years after this point, you announced that you're going to run for president.

323
00:20:41.238 --> 00:20:41.558
Yeah.

324
00:20:42.583 --> 00:20:45.484
Is this really when the war began, in your view?

325
00:20:45.784 --> 00:20:48.785
Because there's been lots of people that have posited when the war began.

326
00:20:48.825 --> 00:20:51.006
Some people say the war began a thousand years ago.

327
00:20:51.527 --> 00:20:56.649
And they talk about the old Crimea and everything that took place there with the ruse.

328
00:20:57.509 --> 00:20:59.630
Some people say it began in 2014.

329
00:20:59.950 --> 00:21:01.390
And some people say it began in 2022.

330
00:21:01.410 --> 00:21:03.191
In your mind, when did the war begin?

331
00:21:05.641 --> 00:21:11.142
I think for many people, that time really is different.

332
00:21:11.722 --> 00:21:30.505
But if we take the new Ukraine that regained its independence in 1991, in the 20th century, then I think that in 2014, all of us just couldn't believe it that this kind of occupation was happening.

333
00:21:31.065 --> 00:21:34.226
The war really started with the occupation of Crimea.

334
00:21:35.335 --> 00:21:35.835
That's true.

335
00:21:36.176 --> 00:21:39.318
It's just that it was slow, that occupation.

336
00:21:39.718 --> 00:21:41.619
It didn't look much like a war.

337
00:21:41.739 --> 00:21:41.999
Why?

338
00:21:42.179 --> 00:21:45.501
Well, because Ukraine wasn't fighting back at that point.

339
00:21:45.982 --> 00:21:55.468
Meaning when they occupied Crimea, there were shots fired there, of course, but for a very long time, Russia wouldn't admit these were its people.

340
00:21:56.028 --> 00:21:57.909
They looked like regular people.

341
00:21:57.929 --> 00:22:00.790
They even called them little green men.

342
00:22:00.970 --> 00:22:07.974
That's what they called them because you couldn't tell what that uniform was, meaning these are people carrying some kind of weapons on the peninsula.

343
00:22:08.254 --> 00:22:20.180
And the problem was that there were no clear orders from the Ukrainian authorities that you need to defend your land, that someone violated your borders with weapons and is seizing, seizing, gradually seizing Crimea.

344
00:22:20.220 --> 00:22:22.681
So it was really that kind of creeping situation

345
00:22:23.021 --> 00:22:23.741
occupation.

346
00:22:24.242 --> 00:22:34.687
Looking at that time today, not back in 2014, not in 2015, but today, you realize that that's when the war really began.

347
00:22:35.467 --> 00:22:37.988
Our mistake was not pushing them back.

348
00:22:38.308 --> 00:22:47.633
And of course, if there had been an order to defend the country, I'm sure that I think a full-scale war will

349
00:22:48.805 --> 00:22:52.508
in the form it has today, wouldn't have happened.

350
00:22:53.489 --> 00:22:55.170
Well, at least that's how it seems to me.

351
00:22:57.172 --> 00:23:05.957
I read that your great-grandfather and his grandfather's four brothers were killed by the Nazis, and his grandfather was the only brother to survive the war.

352
00:23:06.617 --> 00:23:19.423
And I wondered how that experience of having that in your family tree has changed how you think about this moment in time when you're facing a war with Russia and Russia.

353
00:23:21.310 --> 00:23:25.553
My grandfather went through World War II from start to finish.

354
00:23:26.553 --> 00:23:35.339
My grandfather, my father's dad, and he was, yeah, from a family where there were several brothers and all of them were killed by the Nazis.

355
00:23:36.240 --> 00:23:43.684
I have very few relatives in general on both sides of my family, on my father's and my mother's.

356
00:23:44.805 --> 00:23:48.708
Many relatives were killed by the fascists.

357
00:23:49.308 --> 00:23:57.771
And that's why it always sounded so bizarre when Russia accused us, Ukraine, of supposedly having Nazis.

358
00:23:58.331 --> 00:24:00.232
It's bizarre and completely wild.

359
00:24:01.132 --> 00:24:11.316
If people all knew even a little bit of history, they would realize that fascists in Ukraine, fascism as such, doesn't exist.

360
00:24:11.596 --> 00:24:11.876
Why?

361
00:24:12.336 --> 00:24:18.058
Because Ukraine understands deep in its roots what it means to be under the fascists.

362
00:24:18.678 --> 00:24:25.642
Because during World War II, Ukraine was occupied 100%, completely, completely, totally.

363
00:24:26.643 --> 00:24:44.314
Whereas Russia, Ukraine, Belarus was occupied, Ukraine, and Nazi Germany, it lost a huge number of its soldiers who died specifically in Belarus, Ukraine, because we all, well, because our countries or our lands, they stood and fought.

364
00:24:44.855 --> 00:24:46.316
Russia was not occupied.

365
00:24:46.336 --> 00:24:46.836
Okay.

366
00:24:47.196 --> 00:24:50.178
And that is also very important to understand.

367
00:24:50.198 --> 00:25:02.065
That's why all of our people in Ukraine saw it, well, you know, as barbaric and an outrage when Putin attacked us and said, we have fascism and he's liberating Ukraine from fascists.

368
00:25:02.525 --> 00:25:03.306
I mean, it's absurd.

369
00:25:03.366 --> 00:25:04.686
We fought against the fascists.

370
00:25:05.527 --> 00:25:06.547
We were the ones liberating.

371
00:25:07.468 --> 00:25:10.570
A lot of people don't have the historical context on how this all began.

372
00:25:12.885 --> 00:25:25.675
If I was a 16-year-old and I had no understanding of geopolitics and I asked you, President, I said, could you explain to me the background context that I need to understand to understand what the hell is going on at the moment?

373
00:25:26.755 --> 00:25:28.737
Why are Russia going into Crimea?

374
00:25:29.097 --> 00:25:31.539
What is Vladimir Putin's perspective?

375
00:25:31.559 --> 00:25:33.080
Why does he think that that's okay?

376
00:25:33.260 --> 00:25:35.742
Why does he think that he can invade Ukraine?

377
00:25:36.082 --> 00:25:41.747
What is the historical context explained in the simplest terms to a 16-year-old about what the hell is going on here?

378
00:25:41.807 --> 00:25:44.128
And I'm going to give you all the time in the world to inform me.

379
00:25:45.289 --> 00:25:50.493
There was an empire called the Soviet Union.

380
00:25:51.774 --> 00:25:56.878
And that empire, it included a large number of what are now independent states.

381
00:25:58.328 --> 00:25:59.548
It's always like that with empires.

382
00:26:00.208 --> 00:26:03.549
Without getting into the historical context, everyone will understand this.

383
00:26:03.589 --> 00:26:04.709
It's always like that with empires.

384
00:26:04.809 --> 00:26:09.850
Empires exist for a while and then they collapse.

385
00:26:11.230 --> 00:26:24.432
Because you can only hold everything together through autocracy, a territory like that, through tyranny, through feudalism, through slavery, certainly not through freedom.

386
00:26:25.253 --> 00:26:27.773
Empires don't survive on freedom.

387
00:26:28.917 --> 00:26:30.102
And this is very important.

388
00:26:30.764 --> 00:26:31.928
Why do empires fall apart?

389
00:26:31.949 --> 00:26:33.274
Because people want to be free.

390
00:26:34.232 --> 00:26:38.896
Because people compare their lives in an empire with life in other countries, even small ones.

391
00:26:39.036 --> 00:26:40.357
They see how things develop there.

392
00:26:40.377 --> 00:26:50.124
They see how things develop there, how they live, walk freely, choose any partner they want, whatever hair color you like, music, clothes, and so on.

393
00:26:50.824 --> 00:26:56.128
While the Soviet Union, these empires, like everyone always said, the iron curtain.

394
00:26:56.569 --> 00:26:57.590
Why an iron curtain?

395
00:26:58.010 --> 00:27:00.852
So you wouldn't see what's out there in the West anymore.

396
00:27:01.478 --> 00:27:05.581
in Europe, in the United States of America, in Britain, or anywhere in Asia.

397
00:27:05.701 --> 00:27:06.781
So people couldn't see.

398
00:27:07.182 --> 00:27:13.866
In terms of information, an empire is hold, control everything, right?

399
00:27:14.106 --> 00:27:17.108
So a complete information vacuum.

400
00:27:17.808 --> 00:27:18.929
There you don't exist.

401
00:27:19.029 --> 00:27:19.750
Nothing exists.

402
00:27:19.810 --> 00:27:20.850
No internet, nothing.

403
00:27:21.411 --> 00:27:25.813
Television that you run and control, and people get the information.

404
00:27:26.274 --> 00:27:28.115
People live like fish in a fish tank.

405
00:27:29.025 --> 00:27:29.706
That's all it is.

406
00:27:30.026 --> 00:27:33.990
The fish tank can be massive like the Soviet Union, but it's still a fish tank.

407
00:27:35.191 --> 00:27:37.894
North Korea is a smaller fish tank, but it's a fish tank.

408
00:27:38.914 --> 00:27:40.856
And that's what happened with the Soviet Union.

409
00:27:41.397 --> 00:27:43.459
The Soviet Union fell apart.

410
00:27:44.460 --> 00:27:45.641
Countries were happy.

411
00:27:46.522 --> 00:27:48.524
Countries became independent, smaller.

412
00:27:48.644 --> 00:27:50.045
Ukraine is one of those countries.

413
00:27:50.666 --> 00:27:50.746
And

414
00:27:52.265 --> 00:27:57.926
When identity emerges, you have your own language, your own music, your own clothes, and so on.

415
00:27:58.126 --> 00:28:00.707
What exists all around the world, it's great.

416
00:28:00.947 --> 00:28:01.407
Tourism.

417
00:28:01.547 --> 00:28:02.707
You travel to Asia.

418
00:28:03.068 --> 00:28:04.228
You travel to Thailand.

419
00:28:04.248 --> 00:28:05.388
You travel to Japan.

420
00:28:05.428 --> 00:28:07.389
You travel to the United States.

421
00:28:07.629 --> 00:28:12.810
Different culture, different music, food, people, and everyone lives freely.

422
00:28:13.150 --> 00:28:15.270
And it's really cool to soak in another culture.

423
00:28:15.771 --> 00:28:16.651
That's the diversity.

424
00:28:16.691 --> 00:28:18.831
Why does an empire fall apart?

425
00:28:19.291 --> 00:28:21.112
Because it's made up of these kinds of

426
00:28:22.289 --> 00:28:25.492
people, nations that want to have their own thing.

427
00:28:26.954 --> 00:28:33.982
The Soviet Union fell apart, but nostalgia for the Soviet Union stayed with people.

428
00:28:34.883 --> 00:28:44.393
Putin was the president of Russia, and he set a goal for himself, and he's a purely Soviet man.

429
00:28:45.661 --> 00:28:46.882
a very Soviet man.

430
00:28:46.962 --> 00:28:49.464
He was an intelligence officer.

431
00:28:49.604 --> 00:28:53.507
He worked in the KGB in Germany and so on.

432
00:28:54.048 --> 00:29:04.496
He said, and this is his very famous phrase, that the greatest collapse of the 20th century in the world was the fall of the Soviet Union.

433
00:29:05.745 --> 00:29:08.966
And all of that shows that Russia just wasn't enough for him.

434
00:29:09.466 --> 00:29:22.448
And he had the ambition to go back to that, to bring back the empire, to bring back the Soviet Union, because he believes that another major country is to blame for the collapse of the Soviet Union.

435
00:29:22.548 --> 00:29:22.948
Which one?

436
00:29:23.429 --> 00:29:24.809
The United States of America.

437
00:29:26.309 --> 00:29:28.310
Because this has always been a geopolitical war.

438
00:29:28.350 --> 00:29:28.930
They're enemies.

439
00:29:29.650 --> 00:29:34.811
The Soviet Union and the United States of America, they were allies during World War II.

440
00:29:35.763 --> 00:29:39.425
And after that, you know, their enemies, the Cold War and so on.

441
00:29:39.906 --> 00:29:40.826
So it's very simple.

442
00:29:41.807 --> 00:29:44.929
Putin wanted to bring back the Soviet Union.

443
00:29:45.469 --> 00:29:46.810
And what is the Soviet Union?

444
00:29:48.852 --> 00:29:50.012
It is above all Ukraine.

445
00:29:51.593 --> 00:29:51.954
Ukraine.

446
00:29:51.994 --> 00:29:52.654
It's Ukraine.

447
00:29:52.734 --> 00:29:54.255
Ukraine is country number two.

448
00:29:55.116 --> 00:29:55.336
Why?

449
00:29:57.297 --> 00:30:00.019
They called the Soviet Union a forge of talent.

450
00:30:01.430 --> 00:30:14.146
in Ukraine, there were so many people who later led, had that kind of education because there were many scientists, many engineers, many universities, a huge intelligentsia.

451
00:30:14.166 --> 00:30:18.231
That's what they said that for the Soviet Union, Ukraine was the forge of talent.

452
00:30:18.511 --> 00:30:19.072
In other words,

453
00:30:20.380 --> 00:30:30.667
In other words, many people who came from Ukraine, who then ran various institutions, ministries in the Soviet Union and so on, meaning it's the intellectual part of the Soviet Union.

454
00:30:31.267 --> 00:30:39.512
Ukraine was always the biggest rocket manufacturing was here, nuclear weapons, which Ukraine handed over.

455
00:30:39.632 --> 00:30:42.514
A lot of things were made in Ukraine.

456
00:30:43.255 --> 00:30:46.637
And what's the problem for Russia?

457
00:30:47.943 --> 00:30:57.096
If Ukraine becomes part of Europe, and without the Soviet Union, Ukraine started taking gradual steps in the other direction.

458
00:30:57.537 --> 00:31:01.383
Meaning if Ukraine becomes part of Europe, then Russia will collapse.

459
00:31:03.138 --> 00:31:03.899
it will fall apart.

460
00:31:03.919 --> 00:31:10.287
There are many different peoples, different religions, entirely and simply different nations into many different countries.

461
00:31:10.968 --> 00:31:13.752
And Putin decided to piece this whole empire back together.

462
00:31:14.012 --> 00:31:16.475
This ambition, where do you start piecing it together?

463
00:31:17.116 --> 00:31:21.021
He started the war in Chechnya.

464
00:31:22.548 --> 00:31:27.532
He occupied Chechnya, a small country that is now part of Russia.

465
00:31:28.313 --> 00:31:29.794
He destroyed it completely.

466
00:31:30.194 --> 00:31:40.383
Everything that's happening in eastern Ukraine, it's the very same commanders, military commanders who fought in Chechnya, who destroyed Chechnya completely.

467
00:31:40.583 --> 00:31:42.765
There was nothing left, no buildings, nothing.

468
00:31:42.785 --> 00:31:43.966
People were killed, killed.

469
00:31:44.006 --> 00:31:46.428
A huge number of people, by the way, were killed in Chechnya.

470
00:31:47.369 --> 00:31:48.310
And he occupied it.

471
00:31:50.125 --> 00:31:56.108
And then he decided to bring back the empire, starting with Ukraine, with a free state.

472
00:31:56.969 --> 00:31:59.170
One that wants to be in the European Union.

473
00:31:59.530 --> 00:32:02.452
One that is smart, intellectual.

474
00:32:02.572 --> 00:32:04.933
Other countries too, but here, here's what it is.

475
00:32:06.134 --> 00:32:12.017
Well, and the start, there always has to be a pretext to start an occupation.

476
00:32:12.278 --> 00:32:13.038
What pretext?

477
00:32:13.578 --> 00:32:14.679
It's always a pretext.

478
00:32:15.539 --> 00:32:17.601
The pretext is always language.

479
00:32:18.873 --> 00:32:20.215
And he starts with Crimea.

480
00:32:21.116 --> 00:32:22.879
He starts the occupation with Crimea.

481
00:32:22.919 --> 00:32:23.199
Why?

482
00:32:23.339 --> 00:32:28.667
In Crimea, there were a lot of Russian-speaking people, Russian-speaking Ukrainians.

483
00:32:29.188 --> 00:32:32.492
But to understand this and...

484
00:32:33.828 --> 00:32:35.949
In Crimea, there was deportation.

485
00:32:35.989 --> 00:32:39.649
There was more than one deportation, expulsion of the Tatars.

486
00:32:40.170 --> 00:32:45.951
In other words, Crimea has indigenous peoples, and it's a multi-ethnic peninsula.

487
00:32:46.991 --> 00:32:54.253
But what happened is he started the occupation with Crimea and with Domba, with the East.

488
00:32:54.533 --> 00:32:54.793
Why?

489
00:32:54.853 --> 00:33:00.875
Because he divided society, unleashed this war based on language.

490
00:33:01.715 --> 00:33:05.476
Because language is always such an issue, a painful issue.

491
00:33:05.496 --> 00:33:09.398
And when you want to divide society, it's totally unfair.

492
00:33:09.718 --> 00:33:11.999
It's totally despicable toward the people.

493
00:33:12.099 --> 00:33:15.000
You start bringing up the language issue.

494
00:33:15.240 --> 00:33:19.961
So he brought it up, said that I'm protecting Russian-speaking people, which wasn't true.

495
00:33:20.521 --> 00:33:22.602
Nobody took anything from anyone.

496
00:33:23.422 --> 00:33:25.903
Yeah, but it was just easier.

497
00:33:26.504 --> 00:33:30.585
The east of the country borders with the Russian Federation.

498
00:33:32.060 --> 00:33:43.544
Days before, I think it was the day before Vladimir Putin ordered troops to invade Ukraine, he did a statement where he said modern Ukraine was entirely and completely created by Russia.

499
00:33:44.165 --> 00:33:47.186
More precisely, Bolshevik communist Russia.

500
00:33:47.626 --> 00:33:51.327
This process began almost immediately after the 1917 revolution.

501
00:33:51.387 --> 00:33:55.689
Soviet Ukraine is the result of Bolshevik policy and can rightly be called

502
00:33:56.269 --> 00:33:57.690
Vladimir leans Ukraine.

503
00:33:57.870 --> 00:34:00.732
Ukraine never had a tradition of genuine statehood.

504
00:34:01.032 --> 00:34:05.455
So he's very much denying that Ukraine is a nation of its own.

505
00:34:05.755 --> 00:34:09.238
Why did he choose to invade February 24th?

506
00:34:09.978 --> 00:34:11.779
Why did he choose then to invade?

507
00:34:12.400 --> 00:34:22.306
If he had invaded Crimea in 2014, why was, in your view, that the moment where he decided to cross the border and try and, by the looks of it, take control of the whole of Ukraine?

508
00:34:23.126 --> 00:34:27.889
First of all, notice he talks about the Soviet Revolution of 1917.

509
00:34:28.549 --> 00:34:30.030
That's ridiculous to anyone.

510
00:34:30.610 --> 00:34:35.513
Your country's history can't start in 1917.

511
00:34:35.913 --> 00:34:41.216
In Ukraine, there are churches, everyone knows, we have very beautiful churches that are a thousand years old.

512
00:34:41.776 --> 00:34:47.279
Ukrainian churches, painted by Ukrainians, total master professionals, a thousand years old.

513
00:34:47.599 --> 00:34:48.880
Ukraine is...

514
00:34:50.545 --> 00:35:08.081
It's the heir to Kivan Rus, a great state that was very well known in Europe, on the European continent at least, with an advanced civilization, it really, with its own art, with its own traditions and so on.

515
00:35:08.241 --> 00:35:10.263
Russia wasn't even close to existing.

516
00:35:10.363 --> 00:35:12.865
Russia came after Ukraine already existed.

517
00:35:13.165 --> 00:35:15.926
But he cuts all that out, starts with the revolution.

518
00:35:16.046 --> 00:35:18.988
Why from the October revolution of 1917?

519
00:35:19.468 --> 00:35:27.992
Because he's talking about the history of the Soviet Union, not about the history of Russia, and not about the history of Ukraine, the Soviet Union.

520
00:35:28.092 --> 00:35:28.373
Why?

521
00:35:28.753 --> 00:35:30.654
Because he's signaling to people who,

522
00:35:31.733 --> 00:35:36.777
are in Russia, who honestly, the kids, they get information in schools and they take it.

523
00:35:37.057 --> 00:35:38.639
They don't go any deeper.

524
00:35:38.939 --> 00:35:45.084
He's signaling to them that their life is the Soviet Union, and that's where we're heading back to.

525
00:35:45.204 --> 00:35:46.065
That's what he's doing.

526
00:35:47.045 --> 00:35:49.107
He started a full-scale war.

527
00:35:50.048 --> 00:35:53.170
The war started 24th of February 24th.

528
00:35:53.190 --> 00:35:54.972
Missile strikes were launched.

529
00:36:01.005 --> 00:36:02.906
immediately from the territory.

530
00:36:03.547 --> 00:36:05.769
It was flying from every side.

531
00:36:05.929 --> 00:36:09.631
Troops were also entering from the territory of Belarus, right?

532
00:36:10.452 --> 00:36:14.755
From here, because it's the closest route to the capital.

533
00:36:14.795 --> 00:36:23.822
They were advancing on Kiev and also came from all directions.

534
00:36:24.402 --> 00:36:26.284
The main goal was to seize the...

535
00:36:27.404 --> 00:36:29.026
the capital of Ukraine.

536
00:36:29.586 --> 00:36:31.187
That was their main goal.

537
00:36:31.608 --> 00:36:42.296
Naturally, they were counting on the tough guys who were both Russian and the separatists already in the occupied territory of Donbass.

538
00:36:42.496 --> 00:36:44.157
Why in February 2022?

539
00:36:45.578 --> 00:36:46.779
Why not later?

540
00:36:46.839 --> 00:36:47.659
Why not sooner?

541
00:36:47.859 --> 00:36:48.980
Why was that the moment?

542
00:36:49.020 --> 00:36:49.840
What had happened?

543
00:36:50.720 --> 00:37:05.727
You know, because part of the reason I ask this question is because President Donald Trump often blames Joe Biden for being weak and that giving Vladimir Putin an opportunity to invade because he didn't respect President Biden.

544
00:37:05.747 --> 00:37:06.568
That's what's claimed.

545
00:37:06.948 --> 00:37:07.808
Is there truth in that?

546
00:37:08.649 --> 00:37:09.249
I'll explain.

547
00:37:09.349 --> 00:37:10.170
I think that...

548
00:37:11.509 --> 00:37:12.849
It was a little bit earlier.

549
00:37:14.530 --> 00:37:18.391
In 21, there was a summit.

550
00:37:18.411 --> 00:37:19.651
I don't remember when anymore.

551
00:37:19.671 --> 00:37:21.191
I think I don't remember.

552
00:37:21.591 --> 00:37:23.392
There was a Biden-Putin summit.

553
00:37:23.432 --> 00:37:24.932
Remember that famous summit?

554
00:37:24.972 --> 00:37:26.293
We didn't have all the details.

555
00:37:26.393 --> 00:37:30.714
They came out and started talking about something publicly and so on.

556
00:37:32.734 --> 00:37:40.296
Then rumors started that they discussed the issue of a possible escalation against Ukraine.

557
00:37:41.518 --> 00:37:45.742
And we kept bringing up this issue over the next few months.

558
00:37:46.022 --> 00:37:48.044
We kept bringing it up with the Americans.

559
00:37:48.885 --> 00:37:50.306
And this could really happen.

560
00:37:50.827 --> 00:37:52.929
And they were saying, well, it could happen.

561
00:37:53.009 --> 00:38:00.916
We asked them, then please give us what we need to defend ourselves if there are such risks that some kind of occupation could start.

562
00:38:01.136 --> 00:38:02.457
We couldn't imagine, though, that

563
00:38:03.438 --> 00:38:13.630
full scale invasion would start because we saw what Russian occupation looked like with Crimea and with Donetsk and Luhansk Oblasts.

564
00:38:13.890 --> 00:38:15.953
So you imagined it differently.

565
00:38:15.993 --> 00:38:19.076
You couldn't imagine that overnight missiles would just start flying.

566
00:38:19.637 --> 00:38:21.377
Nobody had ever seen anything like that.

567
00:38:21.457 --> 00:38:22.578
Why were kids screaming?

568
00:38:22.858 --> 00:38:23.978
Why were people fleeing?

569
00:38:24.338 --> 00:38:25.919
Why was there absolute chaos?

570
00:38:26.059 --> 00:38:31.480
Those were absolutely horrifying moments because missiles are literally flying at you.

571
00:38:31.920 --> 00:38:36.021
Nowadays, a thousand drones fly in and we shoot them down.

572
00:38:36.161 --> 00:38:36.681
We fight.

573
00:38:37.161 --> 00:38:41.223
But back then, right around four in the morning, missiles were raining down on your head.

574
00:38:41.683 --> 00:38:42.563
Everyone was in shock.

575
00:38:43.203 --> 00:38:49.307
So he did it in February because that's what he wanted to do.

576
00:38:50.348 --> 00:38:52.289
That was his plan.

577
00:38:53.109 --> 00:38:55.651
I think he told Biden a whole lot of things.

578
00:38:56.792 --> 00:39:01.575
I remember, unfortunately, I think, unfortunately, President Biden stepped in later

579
00:39:04.116 --> 00:39:07.519
in the first minutes or days of the war.

580
00:39:07.639 --> 00:39:12.042
I had a call with him back then when he offered to evacuate me.

581
00:39:12.482 --> 00:39:14.964
Back then, a lot of people offered me help.

582
00:39:15.044 --> 00:39:19.287
I said, give us weapons, help us defend the country.

583
00:39:19.867 --> 00:39:24.070
And I think they realized that it's impossible to occupy us.

584
00:39:25.763 --> 00:39:27.546
That's what I think happened.

585
00:39:28.427 --> 00:39:41.867
I think that the United States back then, I don't know, maybe they did consider that it could turn out that there'd be a conflict and we might be occupied, but nobody counted on us holding out for sure.

586
00:39:42.959 --> 00:39:47.642
I remember that I think a day before, God, that was so long ago.

587
00:39:47.662 --> 00:39:48.722
I've forgotten so much already.

588
00:39:48.982 --> 00:40:00.969
A day before the invasion, the Europeans who knew less than the Americans, they were talking with Putin and Putin promised them there wouldn't be an invasion.

589
00:40:01.269 --> 00:40:02.770
Oh, he lied to all of them back then.

590
00:40:02.950 --> 00:40:05.451
Just he knew there would be an invasion.

591
00:40:05.671 --> 00:40:06.432
He knew everything.

592
00:40:07.900 --> 00:40:14.165
When did you first get a phone call telling you that Russia were planning to invade Ukraine?

593
00:40:15.206 --> 00:40:17.327
How many days before it happened did you get that call?

594
00:40:17.607 --> 00:40:18.888
And who was the call from?

595
00:40:19.589 --> 00:40:28.956
It was never direct, like Russia plans an invasion on such and such day and there will be a full-scale war like this and that.

596
00:40:28.996 --> 00:40:30.037
It was never like that.

597
00:40:30.077 --> 00:40:33.819
These were very cautious diplomatic signals and so on.

598
00:40:35.080 --> 00:40:38.082
And this, how can I put it?

599
00:40:39.002 --> 00:40:41.044
We kept bringing up this issue.

600
00:40:41.104 --> 00:40:41.424
Why?

601
00:40:41.764 --> 00:40:43.085
Because people were worried.

602
00:40:43.685 --> 00:40:44.706
And people were worried.

603
00:40:44.746 --> 00:40:48.748
That affected the economy and affected the currency.

604
00:40:49.448 --> 00:40:55.111
And the stability of the national currency started to drop, which affected the country's economy.

605
00:40:55.491 --> 00:40:58.713
And we asked the Americans, give us a clear signal.

606
00:40:58.853 --> 00:41:03.256
If you believe this is war, then give us weapons urgently.

607
00:41:04.343 --> 00:41:09.486
Everything you can give because, well, that's what our dialogue was like.

608
00:41:10.267 --> 00:41:12.608
Yeah, well, but nobody would give anything.

609
00:41:12.668 --> 00:41:14.390
And I asked, impose sanctions.

610
00:41:14.870 --> 00:41:17.432
That's something everybody in Europe knew about.

611
00:41:17.492 --> 00:41:17.952
They knew.

612
00:41:18.472 --> 00:41:25.217
I asked President Biden, impose sanctions on Russia now, preemptively.

613
00:41:25.497 --> 00:41:29.399
If you know there could be an invasion, impose sanctions.

614
00:41:29.619 --> 00:41:32.862
And then he won't go in if he's really decided to.

615
00:41:33.722 --> 00:41:38.025
But President Biden said we'll impose sanctions if there's an invasion.

616
00:41:38.605 --> 00:41:39.286
Post-factum.

617
00:41:39.506 --> 00:41:41.567
Not preemptive sanctions, but post-factum.

618
00:41:42.508 --> 00:41:51.053
I'm not God to judge a president, but I believe that was a mistake in my view.

619
00:41:52.548 --> 00:42:07.125
Russia invaded Ukraine in February 2022, but in October 2021, the Director of National Intelligence and CIA Director briefed US leadership and top NATO allies that Putin was making concrete plans for a multi-front invasion.

620
00:42:07.145 --> 00:42:07.245
Yeah.

621
00:42:08.106 --> 00:42:16.877
And European media published satellite imagery showing 100,000 Russian troops' tanks in field hospitals that had started to emerge.

622
00:42:17.057 --> 00:42:22.264
And CIA director flew to Moscow to warn Putin directly against invading in November 2021.

623
00:42:22.664 --> 00:42:23.746
Then in December 2021...

624
00:42:25.047 --> 00:42:37.135
The US government took the rare step of declassifying intelligent maps and troop estimates, predicting an invasion force of up to 175,000 troops to prevent Russia from using a false flag operation as a pretext.

625
00:42:37.716 --> 00:42:47.242
And then in late January, early February 2021, the US National Security Advisor publicly warned that an invasion could begin at any time, urging foreign citizens to evacuate Ukraine.

626
00:42:47.723 --> 00:42:52.866
And then on February 24th, 2022, Russia launched the full-scale invasion.

627
00:42:54.087 --> 00:42:56.769
And they launched the invasion from multiple sides.

628
00:42:57.050 --> 00:42:58.371
Really with the focus on Kiev.

629
00:42:58.711 --> 00:42:58.911
Yes.

630
00:43:00.773 --> 00:43:08.159
Can you remember where you were when you realized that they had crossed multiple borders of Ukraine at the same time?

631
00:43:10.020 --> 00:43:14.584
If I was a fly on the wall in whatever room you were in, wherever you were, what would I have seen?

632
00:43:14.684 --> 00:43:15.325
Where were you?

633
00:43:15.825 --> 00:43:16.686
How did you find out?

634
00:43:18.293 --> 00:43:26.500
First of all, I'd like you to know that in Belarus, the Russians were conducting drills, training.

635
00:43:26.820 --> 00:43:28.021
These were annual drills.

636
00:43:28.602 --> 00:43:37.949
That's very important because when we talked to our partners and they briefed, like you're saying, folks from NATO and so on, nobody fully believed it.

637
00:43:38.090 --> 00:43:38.350
Why?

638
00:43:38.770 --> 00:43:42.113
Because everybody said they were just saber rattlers.

639
00:43:43.607 --> 00:43:46.370
Putin was intentionally trying to scare everyone.

640
00:43:46.870 --> 00:43:48.852
He wouldn't launch an invasion.

641
00:43:49.012 --> 00:43:49.933
What I just told you.

642
00:43:50.214 --> 00:43:51.595
European leaders called him.

643
00:43:51.655 --> 00:43:53.457
He said, I won't invade.

644
00:43:53.937 --> 00:43:57.341
He had exercises in Belarus, military exercises.

645
00:43:57.481 --> 00:44:02.886
On top of that, our defense minister was invited there to these exercises.

646
00:44:03.046 --> 00:44:03.867
And he was there.

647
00:44:04.908 --> 00:44:05.989
Just so you understand.

648
00:44:07.008 --> 00:44:07.688
Imagine that.

649
00:44:08.049 --> 00:44:10.510
He went there, came back, and so on.

650
00:44:11.011 --> 00:44:15.253
And then the full-scale invasion started from multiple directions.

651
00:44:16.014 --> 00:44:25.760
And what the Europeans said, echoing my messages, was impose sanctions and give weapons to the Ukrainians if you know an invasion is coming.

652
00:44:26.180 --> 00:44:27.441
The Americans didn't do that.

653
00:44:27.481 --> 00:44:29.822
They didn't give them and didn't impose sanctions.

654
00:44:29.862 --> 00:44:31.463
And that's why everyone had doubts.

655
00:44:31.924 --> 00:44:34.265
Everyone thought the Russians were just bluffing.

656
00:44:34.465 --> 00:44:34.705
Why?

657
00:44:34.805 --> 00:44:46.973
Because he wanted to push us into the Minsk agreements and so on, so that we'd give them Donbass and recognize Donbass as not Ukraine and also recognize Crimea as not Ukraine.

658
00:44:47.333 --> 00:44:50.595
That's what, in other words, that was the format of pressure.

659
00:44:51.235 --> 00:44:52.616
But what happened, happened.

660
00:44:52.696 --> 00:44:53.477
What did you believe?

661
00:44:55.147 --> 00:44:58.490
I didn't think there would be a full scale invasion and so on.

662
00:44:58.510 --> 00:45:05.155
So that we give them Donbass and recognize as not Ukraine and also recognize Crimea as not Ukraine.

663
00:45:05.775 --> 00:45:08.077
That's what, in other words, that was the format of pressure.

664
00:45:08.838 --> 00:45:09.879
But what happened happened.

665
00:45:09.919 --> 00:45:12.060
I didn't think there would be a full scale invasion.

666
00:45:12.301 --> 00:45:19.306
I didn't think so because I believe that if people know there's going to be a full scale invasion, partners and so on, and they don't take preemptive steps.

667
00:45:20.347 --> 00:45:21.508
Don't sit him down at the table.

668
00:45:21.528 --> 00:45:23.049
Don't tell him, are you out of your mind?

669
00:45:24.090 --> 00:45:27.733
Have you lost your mind to wage war in the 20th century, to kill people?

670
00:45:27.753 --> 00:45:29.034
You're completely unhinged.

671
00:45:30.154 --> 00:45:37.940
But even so, a full-scale invasion happened, and they approached Kiev very quickly.

672
00:45:39.361 --> 00:45:40.462
Like, really quickly.

673
00:45:41.843 --> 00:45:43.344
I mean, it was just...

674
00:45:44.325 --> 00:45:46.167
It was, well, an avalanche.

675
00:45:46.487 --> 00:45:47.167
And I was...

676
00:45:48.633 --> 00:45:50.295
I was with my family.

677
00:45:52.297 --> 00:45:54.480
And I was with my family.

678
00:45:54.560 --> 00:46:01.287
I got a call from the office saying that before that, during the night, missiles.

679
00:46:02.117 --> 00:46:03.477
were flying missiles.

680
00:46:03.818 --> 00:46:10.580
I got ready, told my wife, told the kids, told them the war has started.

681
00:46:11.520 --> 00:46:12.500
And I went to the office.

682
00:46:12.540 --> 00:46:13.421
I arrived at the office.

683
00:46:13.481 --> 00:46:29.706
I was the first or second, the second person, I think, in the office, and I called everyone in, and we started the workday, such a terrible workday, the first one during the full-scale war.

684
00:46:31.291 --> 00:46:32.071
What did your wife say?

685
00:46:34.893 --> 00:46:35.533
I don't remember.

686
00:46:37.714 --> 00:46:38.494
It was very fast.

687
00:46:38.574 --> 00:46:39.675
Everything happened so fast.

688
00:46:40.735 --> 00:46:42.396
I told my wife, wake up quickly.

689
00:46:42.416 --> 00:46:43.357
The war has started.

690
00:46:44.177 --> 00:46:44.657
I love you.

691
00:46:44.737 --> 00:46:45.357
I'll call you.

692
00:46:45.778 --> 00:46:46.978
And ran out.

693
00:46:49.279 --> 00:46:50.860
And life has not been the same since?

694
00:46:52.501 --> 00:46:53.141
Absolutely.

695
00:46:53.481 --> 00:46:54.582
It's just a different life.

696
00:46:55.222 --> 00:46:56.022
Everything is different.

697
00:46:57.083 --> 00:46:57.903
Everything's different.

698
00:46:58.824 --> 00:46:58.944
100%.

699
00:47:03.296 --> 00:47:12.840
When I was doing my research on that day when Russia invaded, what I couldn't believe is just the volume of troops that rolled across the border.

700
00:47:13.421 --> 00:47:23.045
I read one thing that said there was 65 kilometers of armored vehicles and troops on one particular road as they tried to take Kiev.

701
00:47:24.005 --> 00:47:33.451
I want to talk about that, but I just really want to also get an answer to this sort of outstanding question in my head, which is Trump has repeatedly said probably 100 times now that this never would have begun.

702
00:47:33.631 --> 00:47:36.253
It never would have happened if he was president.

703
00:47:36.813 --> 00:47:37.594
Do you believe that?

704
00:47:45.919 --> 00:47:48.661
I think that nobody knows the answer, honestly.

705
00:47:48.681 --> 00:47:50.402
Yeah.

706
00:47:53.164 --> 00:47:58.588
The fact remains that this happened during Biden's presidency.

707
00:48:00.289 --> 00:48:00.829
That's a fact.

708
00:48:02.070 --> 00:48:04.952
It's a fact that this didn't happen under Trump.

709
00:48:05.952 --> 00:48:06.293
A fact.

710
00:48:08.994 --> 00:48:16.679
But it's also a fact that Putin chose the moment for a full occupation.

711
00:48:16.719 --> 00:48:17.560
That's also a fact.

712
00:48:19.938 --> 00:48:24.503
I think Trump had a special relationship with Putin and still does.

713
00:48:25.565 --> 00:48:37.058
And maybe it really is possible that Trump being on friendly terms with Putin could have prevented a full scale invasion.

714
00:48:37.719 --> 00:48:38.020
But Trump.

715
00:48:39.185 --> 00:48:46.612
One thing you have to know for sure, neither I nor Trump, we're not eternal in these presidential seats.

716
00:48:47.512 --> 00:48:57.601
And so either way, Trump's presidency would have ended and Putin still wouldn't have been able to change his main goal, the occupation of Ukraine.

717
00:48:58.282 --> 00:49:05.368
So I think that honestly, it doesn't matter who the president is as long as Putin is there.

718
00:49:07.164 --> 00:49:18.889
On February the 24th, when Russia invaded Ukraine, it is reported that they sent, there's different numbers, but some of the numbers go up to 200,000 troops that were assembled across the Ukrainian border.

719
00:49:18.909 --> 00:49:20.990
It varies between 150,000, 190,000.

720
00:49:21.610 --> 00:49:28.113
And when I look at the total active number of troops in Ukraine at the time, it's almost the same number.

721
00:49:29.261 --> 00:49:39.569
So it's almost as if Russia deployed the full size of the number of active duty personnel you had into Ukraine to attack Ukraine and specifically to take Kiev.

722
00:49:40.950 --> 00:49:44.833
Can you just explain to me in simple terms how they staged that attack?

723
00:49:44.854 --> 00:49:46.855
You said that some troops came in from Belarus.

724
00:49:47.055 --> 00:49:50.158
There was support that came in trying to take Kiev as well.

725
00:49:50.178 --> 00:49:54.361
I think they knew that our main forces...

726
00:49:56.462 --> 00:50:03.585
our main forces were in the east of our country, Donetsk and Luhansk regions.

727
00:50:03.865 --> 00:50:05.586
Yes, Donetsk, Luhansk region.

728
00:50:06.066 --> 00:50:12.188
Why were Donetsk, Luhansk regions where our main units were?

729
00:50:12.208 --> 00:50:15.209
Look, there is Kharkiv, which was also their target.

730
00:50:15.249 --> 00:50:16.670
Look, this whole, all this

731
00:50:17.650 --> 00:50:18.670
All this whole part.

732
00:50:19.191 --> 00:50:21.732
Mariupol, which was very important to them.

733
00:50:22.072 --> 00:50:24.193
Donetsk, which was already occupied and so on.

734
00:50:24.313 --> 00:50:26.474
So what was the bottom line?

735
00:50:27.914 --> 00:50:36.858
Because when part of it was occupied, when Donetsk was occupied, all of that was after the occupation of Crimea.

736
00:50:37.078 --> 00:50:40.239
Look, all of this was occupied, this entire part.

737
00:50:40.559 --> 00:50:42.360
Very strong troops were stationed here.

738
00:50:43.422 --> 00:50:46.405
Strong both in terms of numbers and strength.

739
00:50:46.585 --> 00:50:50.909
And the separatists, and they were fighting against us.

740
00:50:50.969 --> 00:50:55.293
Meaning you have to understand, these are people who consider Donetsk their homeland.

741
00:50:55.533 --> 00:50:56.714
These aren't just Russians.

742
00:50:56.754 --> 00:50:57.595
These are separatists.

743
00:50:57.615 --> 00:50:59.857
So there were both separatists and Russians here.

744
00:50:59.897 --> 00:51:02.059
So this was their strongest grouping.

745
00:51:02.639 --> 00:51:05.382
And our strongest grouping was stationed right here.

746
00:51:06.973 --> 00:51:12.374
And that was constantly, they were here, they were stationed right here.

747
00:51:12.494 --> 00:51:14.275
Why were they stationed here?

748
00:51:14.455 --> 00:51:18.696
Because they were holding back the strongest Russian grouping so it wouldn't break through.

749
00:51:20.656 --> 00:51:28.078
And nobody expected that they would go through Belarus and advance on the capital.

750
00:51:29.038 --> 00:51:32.099
And that's why we didn't have any strong troops here.

751
00:51:32.439 --> 00:51:33.559
That is an absolute fact.

752
00:51:33.599 --> 00:51:35.360
We simply didn't have that kind of army.

753
00:51:36.124 --> 00:51:43.930
The entire Ukrainian army was, well, excuse me, it was later, I changed the law to make it 200,000 plus up to 250.

754
00:51:44.290 --> 00:51:46.892
But before that, it was an even smaller force.

755
00:51:46.952 --> 00:51:49.174
And just imagine, 200,000 people are coming at you.

756
00:51:50.075 --> 00:51:52.296
Well, it's simply impossible to defend.

757
00:51:52.576 --> 00:52:01.223
You need an army like the one we have today, 800,000, which was actually the main problem for the Russian troops.

758
00:52:01.483 --> 00:52:03.705
When they couldn't take our capital,

759
00:52:05.932 --> 00:52:12.756
We held out and destroyed them.

760
00:52:13.537 --> 00:52:17.719
They didn't have enough troops to hold the occupied territories here.

761
00:52:19.440 --> 00:52:21.702
And they had to pull back.

762
00:52:21.802 --> 00:52:23.483
We were hitting them and they were pulling back.

763
00:52:24.578 --> 00:52:30.160
And that's how we fully took back Kiev region, Chernihiv region, and that whole front.

764
00:52:30.200 --> 00:52:33.301
We completely restored it and pushed them out entirely.

765
00:52:33.502 --> 00:52:35.322
So it's completely obvious.

766
00:52:35.342 --> 00:52:36.763
They just didn't have enough troops.

767
00:52:37.923 --> 00:52:41.765
Just like at first when they pushed in, we didn't have a strong army here.

768
00:52:42.547 --> 00:52:43.907
We didn't have enough troops.

769
00:52:44.887 --> 00:52:46.248
And later the same happened to them.

770
00:52:46.908 --> 00:52:51.629
Naturally, when the full-scale invasion started, there was mobilization.

771
00:52:52.129 --> 00:52:53.949
And people, there were lines.

772
00:52:54.029 --> 00:52:55.770
People showed up as volunteers.

773
00:52:56.150 --> 00:53:00.591
And our army grew from 200,000 to an army of 800,000.

774
00:53:01.551 --> 00:53:06.072
While the Russian presence was around... By the way, the Russian presence was...

775
00:53:07.192 --> 00:53:14.642
around 700, probably at that moment, around 700,000 across all directions on Ukrainian territory.

776
00:53:15.963 --> 00:53:18.747
Meaning this was a massive onslaught coming in, a massive onslaught.

777
00:53:19.763 --> 00:53:29.387
There's, in late February, satellite imagery captured a massive 64 kilometer, which is 40 mile long Russian military convoy.

778
00:53:29.407 --> 00:53:30.927
Yeah, it was terrifying footage.

779
00:53:31.287 --> 00:53:31.828
Yeah, all of that.

780
00:53:32.608 --> 00:53:35.109
Backed up along a single highway leading to Kiev.

781
00:53:35.569 --> 00:53:45.813
And when you see 64 kilometers of military vehicles and armored vehicles heading to one city, and then you hear that they failed to take that city, the question like,

782
00:53:47.390 --> 00:53:47.610
How?

783
00:53:47.990 --> 00:53:49.811
How?

784
00:53:50.451 --> 00:53:54.632
They captured, by the way, the Chernobyl nuclear plant where the disaster happened.

785
00:53:54.732 --> 00:53:55.853
All of that was occupied.

786
00:53:55.893 --> 00:53:57.293
That whole route was occupied.

787
00:53:58.493 --> 00:54:00.754
They occupied it and blockaded Kiev.

788
00:54:00.854 --> 00:54:03.635
How did we... People stepped up.

789
00:54:04.895 --> 00:54:06.336
People went to mobilize.

790
00:54:06.376 --> 00:54:07.516
Yes, a huge number.

791
00:54:07.656 --> 00:54:13.398
On the first day, we left the country.

792
00:54:14.654 --> 00:54:18.699
headed toward Western Ukraine, the Western part of our country.

793
00:54:18.759 --> 00:54:32.134
They left, but a lot of people stayed, mobilized, and we brought up our troops and started fighting them day after day.

794
00:54:35.713 --> 00:54:36.714
We pushed back harder.

795
00:54:37.115 --> 00:54:41.640
They cut off our food, cut off our water, cut everything off completely.

796
00:54:42.120 --> 00:54:44.563
So that was their mission.

797
00:54:45.304 --> 00:54:49.509
They expected people to run and me.

798
00:54:50.410 --> 00:54:54.374
And certain people came to me and they said, Kiev is cut off.

799
00:54:55.639 --> 00:55:06.181
And Kiev is surrounded and the Russians are suggesting you hand over your powers and that's it, meaning Kiev must surrender.

800
00:55:08.462 --> 00:55:10.682
Naturally, I told those people where to go.

801
00:55:11.822 --> 00:55:14.783
Let's put it that way, out of my office.

802
00:55:16.003 --> 00:55:23.425
And then, as you know, leaders were calling, offering to evacuate before all the roads were blocked.

803
00:55:24.917 --> 00:55:50.751
to get out of kiev who called you and asked you if you wanted to be evacuated and did they make you an offer to evacuate you themselves biden joe biden asked you if you wanted to be about he was the first the first what did he say we are ready to help you evacuate because uh naturally well the invasion kiev is surrounded and you we are ready to help you you and your family

804
00:55:52.232 --> 00:55:56.576
Likewise, many Europeans offered me that later, several Europeans.

805
00:55:57.517 --> 00:56:09.407
And people around me as well, let's say, people around me from our political circle also suggested doing all that.

806
00:56:10.468 --> 00:56:11.409
What did you say to Biden?

807
00:56:15.513 --> 00:56:17.935
I need ammunition, not a ride.

808
00:56:20.758 --> 00:56:22.379
Did you tell your wife and your family to leave?

809
00:56:31.364 --> 00:56:40.629
They all... Nobody could go anywhere because that was a choice that was...

810
00:56:42.398 --> 00:56:48.663
The families and theirs, naturally, they weren't in the office with me.

811
00:56:49.424 --> 00:56:55.268
Or the security detail took them and they went to another location.

812
00:56:56.148 --> 00:57:05.975
Well, because it was clear that there was shooting right around the president's office and it was obvious how this could all end.

813
00:57:07.378 --> 00:57:09.559
And they asked me to go down to the bunker.

814
00:57:09.839 --> 00:57:17.620
Down there I had, it was very deep underground, built right inside my office.

815
00:57:17.640 --> 00:57:20.041
And in that bunker, I started working.

816
00:57:20.741 --> 00:57:22.081
That's where Biden called me.

817
00:57:23.401 --> 00:57:29.703
All around my office was secured by snipers, various guys of ours, special services.

818
00:57:30.763 --> 00:57:32.043
And I was in the bunker.

819
00:57:33.224 --> 00:57:35.024
Down there, I had people.

820
00:57:36.118 --> 00:57:38.779
communications and I spoke with all the leaders from there.

821
00:57:39.099 --> 00:57:47.443
That's where I first did a video call with the Europeans pleading with them to unite help Ukraine not abandon us and it worked.

822
00:57:47.803 --> 00:57:48.003
Yeah.

823
00:57:49.330 --> 00:58:01.596
And I continued being there, going out into the street, talking to the people, showing myself because there were so many in those first few days, there were so, so many narratives.

824
00:58:02.036 --> 00:58:06.158
Russia was putting out a lot of information claiming I had fled.

825
00:58:06.478 --> 00:58:13.762
So basically their whole idea was for people to run and people would run if they saw that their leader abandoned them.

826
00:58:14.542 --> 00:58:21.246
Well, I mean, excuse me, if the leader abandoned the capital, well, then everyone has to survive on their own.

827
00:58:21.346 --> 00:58:23.268
So that was the whole story.

828
00:58:23.628 --> 00:58:24.649
They wanted me to run.

829
00:58:25.409 --> 00:58:29.372
And for them, that was, yeah, obviously, that was their goal.

830
00:58:30.913 --> 00:58:34.975
I couldn't abandon Kiev, the office, the people.

831
00:58:35.636 --> 00:58:36.436
It's just impossible.

832
00:58:36.716 --> 00:58:37.557
That would be betrayal.

833
00:58:38.097 --> 00:58:38.998
Betrayal or...

834
00:58:39.758 --> 00:58:42.139
my human decency and the constitution of Ukraine.

835
00:58:43.099 --> 00:58:46.201
So I couldn't do that.

836
00:58:47.241 --> 00:58:48.221
Well, and that's it.

837
00:58:48.441 --> 00:58:48.802
That's it.

838
00:58:48.922 --> 00:58:53.063
And then, and they put, the Russians constantly pushed information that I wasn't there.

839
00:58:53.543 --> 00:58:55.604
Then that I was spotted at the border.

840
00:58:55.964 --> 00:58:57.245
Then that I was seen...

841
00:58:58.365 --> 00:59:00.066
somewhere else than in other countries.

842
00:59:00.186 --> 00:59:04.269
And all of that forced me to go out into the street all the time.

843
00:59:04.749 --> 00:59:15.676
Two, three times a day, I made a decision to constantly communicate, constantly say something to people so people could see that I was in the office on Bankova, that I hadn't fled anywhere, hadn't run away.

844
00:59:15.716 --> 00:59:17.297
That was important for the military too.

845
00:59:17.758 --> 00:59:19.499
Later on with time, the military...

846
00:59:20.439 --> 00:59:22.440
told me that it meant a lot to them.

847
00:59:22.501 --> 00:59:35.689
They stood strong, fought, defended, and liberated Kiev because they believed they were liberating their capital, their home, and their president, meaning that he didn't abandon us, that he stayed with us.

848
00:59:35.749 --> 00:59:36.449
That's what they said.

849
00:59:37.130 --> 00:59:39.891
Well, it was my duty.

850
00:59:40.212 --> 00:59:46.215
I don't see it as some kind of very special choice of mine.

851
00:59:46.255 --> 00:59:48.637
I believe that this was the only way I could act.

852
00:59:51.708 --> 00:59:52.628
Were you scared?

853
00:59:53.688 --> 01:00:13.933
Because if you have a nuclear power, one of the biggest militaries in the world, that have 64 miles of military equipment heading towards where you are, and you have them invading also by air, firing missiles into the cities that you're in and your family are in, you've made the decision you're going to stay.

854
01:00:16.154 --> 01:00:16.874
Were you scared?

855
01:00:20.918 --> 01:00:33.589
Scared It's a different feeling It's not about fear It's about being Laser focused On what needs to be done right now We were working at such speed

856
01:00:35.422 --> 01:00:36.303
I can't even tell you.

857
01:00:37.143 --> 01:00:38.684
I was just running around the office.

858
01:00:39.405 --> 01:00:42.307
I was running, making decisions, calling leaders.

859
01:00:42.427 --> 01:00:43.428
I just had no breaks.

860
01:00:43.628 --> 01:00:50.733
I had, I don't know, dozens of calls with leaders every single day, every hour, every second.

861
01:00:50.833 --> 01:00:54.776
I'd run outside, come back, talk to the military, come back.

862
01:00:54.976 --> 01:00:57.077
So I just didn't have time for that.

863
01:00:57.358 --> 01:01:00.840
I only realized it all about 20 days ago.

864
01:01:02.303 --> 01:01:02.944
into the war.

865
01:01:03.224 --> 01:01:17.135
I just realized that something happened, something terrible, and the speed, you know, when the speed slightly began to shift, you started to realize, my God, well, this is war.

866
01:01:17.195 --> 01:01:19.977
This is, and it's without a doubt, a horrible war.

867
01:01:20.930 --> 01:01:23.773
Yeah, but at first I was just working.

868
01:01:24.033 --> 01:01:26.996
Honestly, I have this trait.

869
01:01:27.256 --> 01:01:29.178
I don't even think it's just me.

870
01:01:29.498 --> 01:01:33.442
People have this trait to pull yourself together when, you know, shock.

871
01:01:35.424 --> 01:01:38.507
People around you are in shock and you see it in their eyes.

872
01:01:38.567 --> 01:01:41.109
You see that they, you know, well, they're in shock.

873
01:01:41.770 --> 01:01:43.772
And you realize that you need to act right now.

874
01:01:45.470 --> 01:01:49.971
Just act, act every second, draw conclusions.

875
01:01:50.131 --> 01:01:58.253
Kiev is blockaded, open it up, tell the military, open the road, we need food to get in, water and so on.

876
01:01:58.513 --> 01:02:00.253
That's what crisis management is.

877
01:02:01.013 --> 01:02:06.115
And in tough situations, basically that's usually how I act in tough situations.

878
01:02:06.455 --> 01:02:09.915
And it's not like I'm, again, the bravest person.

879
01:02:09.975 --> 01:02:11.716
It's just when this kind of thing hits,

880
01:02:12.556 --> 01:02:15.940
I see people around me falling apart, you know, falling apart.

881
01:02:15.960 --> 01:02:19.423
Well, because it's a terrible war, I pull myself together completely.

882
01:02:19.663 --> 01:02:27.171
And only later, once you've relaxed, you realize that a terrible tragedy occurred.

883
01:02:27.852 --> 01:02:34.038
A war and it's just immense grief.

884
01:02:35.259 --> 01:02:36.120
Pretty much like that.

885
01:02:37.945 --> 01:02:44.950
When did things slow down enough for you to realize the severity and the impact of the tragedy that had taken place in the lives that were lost?

886
01:02:44.970 --> 01:02:46.091
Was there a particular moment?

887
01:02:47.452 --> 01:02:51.474
The first few days, I didn't sleep at all.

888
01:02:52.175 --> 01:03:02.182
The first few days we just worked, I was sleeping about, yeah, 15 minutes, sleeping 15 minutes because I had, my entire job was communication.

889
01:03:02.942 --> 01:03:08.165
I was talking in circles with every leader, deliver this over there, do that there.

890
01:03:08.525 --> 01:03:12.588
We set up flawless logistics for weapons.

891
01:03:12.648 --> 01:03:18.231
We were able, I was talking at night with Poland, with Andrzej Duda.

892
01:03:18.711 --> 01:03:20.052
There was a warehouse there.

893
01:03:20.092 --> 01:03:23.474
We were waking leaders up, meaning in the middle of the night.

894
01:03:23.514 --> 01:03:25.876
So it was, well, it's improper to say this today.

895
01:03:25.916 --> 01:03:28.417
You shouldn't treat people like that, but that's how it was.

896
01:03:28.657 --> 01:03:31.099
And about 20 days later,

897
01:03:32.055 --> 01:03:45.607
into the war, everything started coming together into some steps that needed to be taken into some kind of, well, like the realization that, well, a war had begun.

898
01:03:46.508 --> 01:03:49.971
War, tragedy, and we have to move forward.

899
01:03:50.771 --> 01:03:52.873
And well, that's about how it was.

900
01:03:52.913 --> 01:03:57.237
At first, it was crisis management, unblocking.

901
01:03:58.566 --> 01:04:04.052
bring back troops, break the siege of Kiev, strike back at them.

902
01:04:04.973 --> 01:04:13.502
And definitely the most crucial things were communications, food, water,

903
01:04:14.303 --> 01:04:17.306
the population, so many cities were cut off.

904
01:04:18.007 --> 01:04:23.032
It wasn't just the banking system, cards, making sure cards worked.

905
01:04:23.632 --> 01:04:29.077
I mean, we're a pretty digitalized country, so a lot of things were done.

906
01:04:30.335 --> 01:04:32.596
A lot of things were done in those first weeks.

907
01:04:33.237 --> 01:04:35.678
We were faster than the Russians.

908
01:04:36.458 --> 01:04:38.940
They broke through quickly toward Kiev.

909
01:04:39.380 --> 01:04:46.484
And once we stopped them at Kiev, we became much faster in the information space and so on.

910
01:04:46.724 --> 01:04:53.588
We shattered their whole wave of disinformation and just broke them down step by step, step by step.

911
01:04:59.090 --> 01:05:03.991
They realized that they lost the capital to us.

912
01:05:04.771 --> 01:05:08.832
And then it became clear that we had to push harder.

913
01:05:09.633 --> 01:05:10.913
Our partners helped.

914
01:05:11.333 --> 01:05:15.294
Our partners realized that we wouldn't give up, and they started helping.

915
01:05:15.934 --> 01:05:17.695
That was definitely it.

916
01:05:17.895 --> 01:05:18.935
I remember how it happened.

917
01:05:20.373 --> 01:05:36.845
It is often said that Vladimir Putin believed he would be able to take Kiev and Ukraine in just a number of days and actually captured Russian assault units carried only three to 10 days of combat rations alongside formal dress uniforms meant for a victory parade.

918
01:05:37.445 --> 01:05:42.969
While state media accidentally released a pre-scheduled victory declaration on day three.

919
01:05:43.549 --> 01:05:55.094
Although Putin never publicly uttered the phrase, three days will set a sort of timeframe himself, there are top Russian state media figures who openly bragged that the conquest would take only a few days.

920
01:05:55.854 --> 01:05:58.795
What is it that they mis-underestimated about Ukraine?

921
01:06:00.316 --> 01:06:00.796
That's right.

922
01:06:01.157 --> 01:06:04.579
Exactly what you started with today, that Ukraine is not Russia.

923
01:06:05.560 --> 01:06:06.420
That's his problem.

924
01:06:06.680 --> 01:06:11.864
Refusing to recognize a separate nation, refusing to recognize a separate country.

925
01:06:12.284 --> 01:06:13.285
That's what did him in.

926
01:06:13.705 --> 01:06:22.852
He still doesn't understand that he looks at Ukraine as Russia, as part of Russia, that I'll march in with an army, we'll have hundreds of thousands of men

927
01:06:23.372 --> 01:06:25.013
He'll slam his fist on the table.

928
01:06:25.073 --> 01:06:26.314
The president will run away.

929
01:06:26.595 --> 01:06:27.455
People will hide.

930
01:06:27.936 --> 01:06:30.898
And the Ukrainian flag will be swapped for the Russian flag.

931
01:06:30.918 --> 01:06:31.398
And that's it.

932
01:06:31.478 --> 01:06:32.019
Three days.

933
01:06:32.319 --> 01:06:35.521
We showed a military operation that was supposed to take three days.

934
01:06:35.822 --> 01:06:36.442
That's how it is.

935
01:06:36.782 --> 01:06:40.125
When our guys hit their tanks and stuff, we found parade uniforms.

936
01:06:40.245 --> 01:06:40.665
It's true.

937
01:06:40.685 --> 01:06:44.148
They found parade uniforms in their various military vehicles.

938
01:06:44.588 --> 01:06:46.870
They were literally marching to a parade.

939
01:06:46.890 --> 01:06:49.152
They specifically wanted to capture Kyiv.

940
01:06:49.692 --> 01:07:01.157
in three days and symbolically hold some kind of regular spectacle of pseudo-victory on Khrushchev on Independence Square.

941
01:07:02.275 --> 01:07:04.096
Well, I mean, that's the most important thing.

942
01:07:04.396 --> 01:07:11.781
He still doesn't understand and doesn't want to admit that this is a different nation, a different people.

943
01:07:12.421 --> 01:07:20.706
Just 12 hours ago, Trump weighed in on what he believed happened with Kiev and why Vladimir Putin wasn't able to take Kiev.

944
01:07:20.786 --> 01:07:21.447
This is what he said.

945
01:07:21.467 --> 01:07:23.068
I'll throw it up on the screen for the listeners.

946
01:07:23.648 --> 01:07:26.790
But then it was supposed to be a very quick war.

947
01:07:26.810 --> 01:07:27.170
Right.

948
01:07:27.410 --> 01:07:40.677
And if you remember, the tanks going up the highway right into Kiev had the general, who was obviously not a very good general, not made a right turn into farmland, which was soaked and soaking wet from the heaviest rain in 10 years, they say.

949
01:07:41.257 --> 01:07:44.038
He went right up into the mud, and it was like quicksand.

950
01:07:44.659 --> 01:07:50.942
And those tanks, so they got, I guess, I don't know if you call it lucky or not lucky, frankly, because it's been five years, and Ukraine has lost...

951
01:07:51.602 --> 01:07:57.087
a tremendous, you know, Ukraine has lost so many of its men.

952
01:07:57.388 --> 01:08:03.894
Number one, had they not taken the right turn onto dirt instead of going up a concrete highway, it would have ended in one day.

953
01:08:05.255 --> 01:08:12.602
So Trump says that it was a Russian mistake, taking a wrong turn, that stopped this war being over in a day.

954
01:08:14.371 --> 01:08:15.772
No, they surrounded Kiev.

955
01:08:16.192 --> 01:08:17.754
They reached Kiev.

956
01:08:18.434 --> 01:08:21.496
They occupied towns on the way to Kiev.

957
01:08:22.357 --> 01:08:23.398
Some they didn't occupy.

958
01:08:23.458 --> 01:08:24.419
Towns fought back.

959
01:08:24.439 --> 01:08:25.639
They bypassed them.

960
01:08:26.460 --> 01:08:30.423
No, if someone took a wrong turn, I don't know what President Trump is talking about.

961
01:08:31.184 --> 01:08:32.264
Overall, it doesn't matter.

962
01:08:32.745 --> 01:08:37.348
With all the armor they lost near Kiev, Hostemel, and so on.

963
01:08:37.408 --> 01:08:39.350
In other words, dozens of...

964
01:08:40.090 --> 01:08:41.871
Hundreds of armored vehicles burned.

965
01:08:42.551 --> 01:08:44.512
They just trapped us.

966
01:08:45.032 --> 01:08:46.692
And then we started hammering them.

967
01:08:47.032 --> 01:08:52.214
And they didn't know what to do about it because some of their armor breached into Kiev, right into the capital.

968
01:08:52.454 --> 01:08:56.156
Armored vehicles drove through the streets and people burned it all down.

969
01:08:56.896 --> 01:09:04.278
They were especially shocked when they drove toward the capital and people were just throwing, burning debris.

970
01:09:04.659 --> 01:09:08.260
I mean, people were setting their armor on fire.

971
01:09:09.160 --> 01:09:12.041
It wasn't a matter of some general being an idiot.

972
01:09:12.242 --> 01:09:19.245
I believe the one who gave the order just didn't fully realize what was happening, didn't really get what it would take.

973
01:09:20.185 --> 01:09:21.966
And that's the main point.

974
01:09:22.106 --> 01:09:25.988
They needed around thousands, thousands.

975
01:09:28.219 --> 01:09:32.140
I think three to 400,000 to take Kiev.

976
01:09:32.420 --> 01:09:34.521
They needed twice as many men.

977
01:09:35.141 --> 01:09:35.381
Why?

978
01:09:35.601 --> 01:09:36.881
Because taking Kiev.

979
01:09:37.341 --> 01:09:38.582
What does taking Kiev mean?

980
01:09:38.782 --> 01:09:44.883
When you've taken those towns on the way to Kiev, you have to leave troops behind to hold those towns.

981
01:09:45.343 --> 01:09:47.264
And that takes a huge number of people.

982
01:09:47.624 --> 01:09:48.964
It's a pretty large territory.

983
01:09:49.364 --> 01:09:52.665
And you can avoid leaving many troops there only if there's no resistance.

984
01:09:53.418 --> 01:10:00.085
But if the people inside offer resistance, then you need an army to hold every town.

985
01:10:00.126 --> 01:10:01.687
That was their mistake.

986
01:10:02.228 --> 01:10:04.871
They didn't estimate, right?

987
01:10:04.991 --> 01:10:06.012
Didn't estimate.

988
01:10:06.793 --> 01:10:09.816
They didn't even realize there would be resistance.

989
01:10:10.437 --> 01:10:10.818
That's it.

990
01:10:12.199 --> 01:10:14.782
That was their main mistake, right?

991
01:10:20.228 --> 01:10:21.168
And then that's it.

992
01:10:21.208 --> 01:10:21.568
That's all.

993
01:10:21.668 --> 01:10:39.497
For example, if you take that operation back in 2014, when they went in and seized Crimea, then pardon me, in Crimea, there are 3 million people.

994
01:10:42.058 --> 01:10:43.559
And Kiev had 3 million people.

995
01:10:46.111 --> 01:10:54.314
Dozens of people entered Crimea, at most hundreds, and here hundreds of thousands.

996
01:10:55.814 --> 01:10:58.615
It's not about the operation.

997
01:10:58.835 --> 01:11:04.637
The difference is people defended it, stood up and fought, and the difference is no one fought back.

998
01:11:05.758 --> 01:11:09.399
Which is why I said, when dozens of people showed up here,

999
01:11:11.080 --> 01:11:16.202
Where Trump is right is that if Crimea hadn't been allowed to fall, there would be no war.

1000
01:11:16.362 --> 01:11:17.963
On this, I agree with President Trump.

1001
01:11:19.043 --> 01:11:20.624
Not because I'm blaming anyone, no.

1002
01:11:21.084 --> 01:11:24.206
It's just that dozens of people went into Crimea, dozens.

1003
01:11:24.426 --> 01:11:27.047
For a country like this, that's zero, that's nothing.

1004
01:11:27.567 --> 01:11:29.068
We handled hundreds of thousands.

1005
01:11:31.466 --> 01:11:32.166
here's what happened.

1006
01:11:32.466 --> 01:11:42.631
And if they'd been smacked in the head back then, the Russians, those people wearing uniforms, meaning the Russians would have even said, hey, that's, they were already saying, that's not our army.

1007
01:11:42.831 --> 01:11:43.732
Look at the uniforms.

1008
01:11:44.452 --> 01:11:45.773
You can't tell us the Russian army.

1009
01:11:46.073 --> 01:11:49.255
And if they'd been hit back then, well, it wouldn't have happened.

1010
01:11:49.675 --> 01:11:52.496
Well, at least there wouldn't have been a chance of a full scale war.

1011
01:11:52.776 --> 01:11:53.037
Why?

1012
01:11:53.357 --> 01:11:55.638
Because Putin would have known there would be

1013
01:11:57.391 --> 01:11:59.212
a blow, there would be a response.

1014
01:11:59.253 --> 01:12:01.354
But what was his mistake here?

1015
01:12:01.955 --> 01:12:11.002
First of all, when he saw how Crimea was seized so easily, so easily, that's why he thought he could seize Kiev just as easily.

1016
01:12:11.442 --> 01:12:12.423
That was his experience.

1017
01:12:13.784 --> 01:12:19.749
And there's quite a famous battle that took place to secure the Anatomov airport.

1018
01:12:20.689 --> 01:12:21.150
Hostomel.

1019
01:12:22.405 --> 01:12:24.166
Uh, Hostomel Antonov.

1020
01:12:24.186 --> 01:12:25.487
That's what I just told you.

1021
01:12:25.527 --> 01:12:26.588
That's a battle.

1022
01:12:26.608 --> 01:12:31.912
There's a terrible battle in Hostomel, a brutal battle, the airport in Hostomel.

1023
01:12:31.932 --> 01:12:33.033
Can you explain that to me?

1024
01:12:33.313 --> 01:12:40.678
Um, because I watched a documentary on this a couple of months ago and it feels like it was a really pivotal moment in defending Kiev.

1025
01:12:41.559 --> 01:12:42.860
What were Russia trying to do?

1026
01:12:43.060 --> 01:12:43.781
Where is this?

1027
01:12:43.841 --> 01:12:47.643
When they land, for them, it was crucial to seize the airports.

1028
01:12:47.664 --> 01:12:48.324
Uh,

1029
01:12:48.664 --> 01:12:55.710
Hostel Mel is one of the airports where a massive landing force could land and so on.

1030
01:12:56.290 --> 01:12:57.831
So here's how a takeover works.

1031
01:12:57.991 --> 01:13:03.315
Block Kiev, capture the airports, basically, TV towers and so forth.

1032
01:13:03.596 --> 01:13:06.418
In other words, seize information, logistics.

1033
01:13:06.938 --> 01:13:12.903
and cut off supplies of food, weapons, and so on.

1034
01:13:13.003 --> 01:13:14.784
That's basically the plan.

1035
01:13:14.885 --> 01:13:20.849
And you need the leader to run, because no leader means chaos, no chain of command.

1036
01:13:21.230 --> 01:13:22.230
That's what they were doing.

1037
01:13:22.691 --> 01:13:24.732
There was a terrible battle in Hostomel.

1038
01:13:24.813 --> 01:13:29.817
Our people burned them there, and they had very tough combat units.

1039
01:13:29.957 --> 01:13:33.920
They couldn't land a large force there.

1040
01:13:33.960 --> 01:13:34.881
They were destroyed.

1041
01:13:35.781 --> 01:13:37.422
Hostomel was taken back.

1042
01:13:38.402 --> 01:13:39.662
Our troops controlled it.

1043
01:13:40.483 --> 01:13:45.284
That was one of the striking battles, a terrible battle, one of the most striking battles.

1044
01:13:45.524 --> 01:13:52.166
So we did everything possible not to let them capture us and seize our logistics.

1045
01:13:52.426 --> 01:13:54.387
They flew in with paratroopers.

1046
01:13:54.447 --> 01:13:58.228
So they parachuted people into that airport to try and claim it.

1047
01:13:58.268 --> 01:14:00.808
And they originally did seize the airport.

1048
01:14:02.229 --> 01:14:02.689
That's right.

1049
01:14:04.173 --> 01:14:09.137
And then there was an immediate counterattack where Ukrainian National Guard units and special forces.

1050
01:14:09.157 --> 01:14:10.738
Yes, our National Guard.

1051
01:14:12.019 --> 01:14:14.040
You shelled and destroyed the runway yourself.

1052
01:14:14.060 --> 01:14:19.884
You destroyed your own runway while air defense units, forces shot down several Russian transport helicopters.

1053
01:14:20.705 --> 01:14:24.728
And from what I understood, you know, you took the airport back.

1054
01:14:24.808 --> 01:14:25.328
They fought.

1055
01:14:25.508 --> 01:14:26.369
You took it back.

1056
01:14:26.409 --> 01:14:27.290
Yes, constant.

1057
01:14:27.310 --> 01:14:27.750
That's right.

1058
01:14:28.110 --> 01:14:30.792
Hostomel changed hands back and forth.

1059
01:14:30.852 --> 01:14:31.553
That's how it was.

1060
01:14:32.455 --> 01:14:37.999
And if they had been able to seize that airport, how would that have changed the situation?

1061
01:14:40.601 --> 01:14:44.984
Likely, they could have taken most of the capital.

1062
01:14:46.285 --> 01:14:49.127
They could have broken through and captured it.

1063
01:14:49.287 --> 01:14:49.768
That's true.

1064
01:14:51.008 --> 01:14:51.489
That's true.

1065
01:14:51.529 --> 01:14:54.351
That was an utterly heroic battle.

1066
01:14:56.813 --> 01:14:58.554
When you hear these stories, you realize that

1067
01:15:00.228 --> 01:15:10.875
the future of Ukraine comes down to both heroism, but also several small battles, some big battles, but also several small moments.

1068
01:15:11.976 --> 01:15:19.641
When you reflect on that month, that moment, is there any other sort of small moments that you think really define the future of Ukraine in this regard?

1069
01:15:21.482 --> 01:15:25.145
Well, just so you know, today...

1070
01:15:27.037 --> 01:15:33.521
places like Hostomel, then further up Moschum, and several small towns around Kyiv.

1071
01:15:33.541 --> 01:15:37.063
There was a desperate battle for every single one of those towns.

1072
01:15:38.264 --> 01:15:39.484
Why the National Guard?

1073
01:15:39.604 --> 01:15:43.207
Because back then, the full army couldn't reach it yet.

1074
01:15:44.022 --> 01:15:47.864
But the National Guard are internal troops.

1075
01:15:48.865 --> 01:15:53.647
So they were there and brought in army units and so on.

1076
01:15:53.707 --> 01:15:56.829
But nonetheless, that's why it was an utterly heroic battle.

1077
01:15:57.269 --> 01:15:58.110
There was Bucha.

1078
01:15:59.035 --> 01:15:59.555
You know, right?

1079
01:15:59.575 --> 01:16:00.676
That they occupied it.

1080
01:16:00.716 --> 01:16:01.436
It was terrible.

1081
01:16:01.456 --> 01:16:04.017
It was a genocide recognized by everyone.

1082
01:16:04.057 --> 01:16:05.617
They buried hundreds of people.

1083
01:16:06.257 --> 01:16:07.278
They tortured people.

1084
01:16:07.318 --> 01:16:08.338
I mean, tortured them.

1085
01:16:08.538 --> 01:16:11.179
And hundreds of people were in a mass grave.

1086
01:16:11.279 --> 01:16:12.039
They found a grave.

1087
01:16:12.059 --> 01:16:14.960
There were, I believe, around 500 people.

1088
01:16:15.700 --> 01:16:17.281
Half a thousand people in a grave like that.

1089
01:16:17.321 --> 01:16:17.901
Just imagine.

1090
01:16:18.301 --> 01:16:23.623
Hands tied, tortured, and then buried in pits.

1091
01:16:24.703 --> 01:16:25.764
That's what was happening.

1092
01:16:26.024 --> 01:16:26.404
People were...

1093
01:16:29.401 --> 01:16:35.183
Seeing all this, this looked nothing like a war.

1094
01:16:35.503 --> 01:16:43.945
It was definitely pure looting when they occupied those towns on the way to Kiev and around Kiev.

1095
01:16:44.025 --> 01:16:52.068
They just went into homes, just killed, took microwaves, some refrigerators, TVs.

1096
01:16:53.483 --> 01:16:57.525
They acted like just well, I can't even describe it.

1097
01:16:58.085 --> 01:16:59.345
Well, they're just scavengers.

1098
01:17:00.326 --> 01:17:04.548
And all these people, they tied their hands, tortured them.

1099
01:17:06.048 --> 01:17:09.330
Well, there was sexual violence, everything.

1100
01:17:10.130 --> 01:17:14.072
And they buried people right in the yard, dumped people and so on.

1101
01:17:14.092 --> 01:17:21.855
When we liberated those towns, there emerged this, you know, this kind of,

1102
01:17:23.304 --> 01:17:24.565
Such hatred for the Russians.

1103
01:17:25.906 --> 01:17:31.070
Right at that moment, not even at the moment when they started the full-scale war.

1104
01:17:32.131 --> 01:17:34.752
Back then, nobody understood what it really was yet.

1105
01:17:35.873 --> 01:17:45.180
People understood what this war was and what Putin did personally when we found those mass graves of tortured adults, children.

1106
01:17:46.241 --> 01:17:49.863
I mean, they didn't just kill them, they tortured and killed them.

1107
01:17:50.024 --> 01:17:50.464
Children.

1108
01:17:51.245 --> 01:17:51.745
That's right.

1109
01:17:53.093 --> 01:17:53.573
That's right.

1110
01:17:54.934 --> 01:17:59.257
And then you realize that, I mean, just imagine what they went through.

1111
01:18:00.778 --> 01:18:05.882
Well, there's no... You can't even compare what all these people lived through.

1112
01:18:06.322 --> 01:18:12.066
Why Bucha is so horrifying and why the Russians immediately started saying, it's a staged performance.

1113
01:18:12.086 --> 01:18:13.287
We brought in journalists.

1114
01:18:13.707 --> 01:18:15.408
The entire world press was there.

1115
01:18:15.648 --> 01:18:16.589
They saw the bodies.

1116
01:18:17.189 --> 01:18:21.292
I deliberately, when we liberated Bucha, I went there.

1117
01:18:21.732 --> 01:18:22.433
Once I saw it,

1118
01:18:23.525 --> 01:18:25.566
I said bring every journalist here.

1119
01:18:26.986 --> 01:18:29.327
Don't touch anything, just bring the journalists.

1120
01:18:29.768 --> 01:18:31.708
The whole world simply has to see this.

1121
01:18:32.289 --> 01:18:33.649
And they brought the journalists.

1122
01:18:34.109 --> 01:18:36.050
People were literally lying on the pavement.

1123
01:18:36.590 --> 01:18:38.211
Dead bodies lying everywhere.

1124
01:18:38.531 --> 01:18:41.612
Kids, adults, elderly people and so on.

1125
01:18:42.133 --> 01:18:45.014
Witnesses who had stayed behind in Bucha, an old man.

1126
01:18:45.694 --> 01:18:48.815
An elderly man, this was a very famous story there.

1127
01:18:49.055 --> 01:18:50.736
It's one of those moments you're talking about.

1128
01:18:51.076 --> 01:18:59.059
This elderly man, he survived the occupation of this town, the town of Bucha, during World War II.

1129
01:19:00.979 --> 01:19:05.841
And he said the fascists never treated people like that.

1130
01:19:06.661 --> 01:19:07.622
Yes, they were enemies.

1131
01:19:08.162 --> 01:19:09.122
Yes, occupiers.

1132
01:19:10.102 --> 01:19:11.743
But they didn't torture people like that.

1133
01:19:14.518 --> 01:19:19.831
This is absolute reality and there are testimonies, there is evidence, there are criminal cases.

1134
01:19:21.001 --> 01:19:26.244
And how after all this, it's just that it was already a long time ago, in the first year of the full-scale war.

1135
01:19:26.464 --> 01:19:28.285
And sometimes people need to be reminded.

1136
01:19:28.605 --> 01:19:42.011
When you see a mass today finding a grave in the U.S. or in Britain, God forbid, with 500 tortured people, adults, kids, dogs, animals shot dead.

1137
01:19:42.311 --> 01:19:44.272
I mean, they held hunting sprees there.

1138
01:19:45.773 --> 01:19:49.675
From military vehicles, people were running, they were shooting, just hunting, playing games.

1139
01:19:51.204 --> 01:19:58.387
The whole time they were blockading Kyiv, right up until the moment we liberated it, there were people in those villages and so on.

1140
01:19:59.367 --> 01:20:00.988
They literally just played with people.

1141
01:20:01.988 --> 01:20:02.708
Like slavery.

1142
01:20:03.309 --> 01:20:03.849
Imagine that.

1143
01:20:04.009 --> 01:20:10.451
So how after this can you listen to Putin and how after this can you forgive?

1144
01:20:11.152 --> 01:20:17.914
And that's why when President Trump says we need to find a compromise, and believe me, we live with this.

1145
01:20:19.015 --> 01:20:20.015
A ceasefire.

1146
01:20:21.717 --> 01:20:24.538
And sitting down at the negotiating table, there's a huge compromise.

1147
01:20:25.878 --> 01:20:27.158
It is a huge compromise.

1148
01:20:27.258 --> 01:20:31.039
Nobody can step into the shoes of all these people in the relative zoos.

1149
01:20:31.539 --> 01:20:33.900
Children were tortured.

1150
01:20:34.080 --> 01:20:35.840
Nobody wants to forgive them for anything.

1151
01:20:36.560 --> 01:20:38.221
Nobody wants to forgive anything.

1152
01:20:38.441 --> 01:20:40.121
And you can't force people to forgive.

1153
01:20:40.461 --> 01:20:41.302
How can you force them?

1154
01:20:42.182 --> 01:20:45.863
When their child was tortured, how do you forgive?

1155
01:20:46.763 --> 01:20:47.563
Well, it's impossible.

1156
01:20:47.783 --> 01:20:50.964
But that's why we say a ceasefire is the only step

1157
01:20:51.974 --> 01:20:55.915
Because people have such hatred, it's not going away.

1158
01:20:56.635 --> 01:20:59.056
That hatred isn't going anywhere.

1159
01:21:00.016 --> 01:21:01.656
It takes time and justice.

1160
01:21:02.837 --> 01:21:04.357
And that's why it's a huge compromise.

1161
01:21:04.397 --> 01:21:12.599
I've always really wanted, I've tried many times to tell the President of the United States, just understand us, this is a huge compromise.

1162
01:21:13.420 --> 01:21:14.940
Just to hold the lines where we are.

1163
01:21:17.040 --> 01:21:19.041
Well, look, that's what it feels like.

1164
01:21:22.331 --> 01:21:25.892
What was your hardest day through the last four years?

1165
01:21:27.232 --> 01:21:33.134
What's the day that, you know, will live long in your brain, your mind, your memory?

1166
01:21:34.895 --> 01:21:38.856
Butcha, what I just told you, that was a terrible day because I stood there.

1167
01:21:38.876 --> 01:21:43.897
I had never seen people's bodies just scattered on the street in my entire life.

1168
01:21:43.937 --> 01:21:46.198
I had simply never seen anything like that in my life.

1169
01:21:47.715 --> 01:21:50.057
And after that, everything changed completely.

1170
01:21:50.437 --> 01:21:52.098
And once again, everything changed in life.

1171
01:21:52.578 --> 01:21:53.819
Everything has changed?

1172
01:21:53.939 --> 01:21:54.579
Absolutely.

1173
01:21:55.519 --> 01:21:55.920
In what way?

1174
01:21:59.121 --> 01:22:11.568
Well, you want, you want revenge.

1175
01:22:16.120 --> 01:22:22.325
I had never had it where I couldn't forgive someone.

1176
01:22:22.766 --> 01:22:25.208
And by and large, I think people make mistakes.

1177
01:22:26.148 --> 01:22:28.430
This is about something else, evil like that, you know?

1178
01:22:28.911 --> 01:22:29.731
A devil like that.

1179
01:22:30.592 --> 01:22:37.938
Just came in like that, did that to people like chopped meat, butchered them, you know?

1180
01:22:39.279 --> 01:22:40.460
I mean, that's what it looks like.

1181
01:22:41.726 --> 01:22:43.988
And you just can't fathom how that's possible.

1182
01:22:44.048 --> 01:22:47.531
And you want to find these people who aren't human.

1183
01:22:47.551 --> 01:22:52.895
You want to find them and you want to... You just want to kill them.

1184
01:22:54.196 --> 01:22:57.639
I mean, I had never wanted to kill a single human being.

1185
01:22:58.079 --> 01:22:59.481
I had never felt anything like that.

1186
01:23:01.642 --> 01:23:02.343
Pure revenge.

1187
01:23:03.900 --> 01:23:05.582
With time, you can't forget that.

1188
01:23:05.982 --> 01:23:11.428
And in moments like this, and our conversation brings back moments like that.

1189
01:23:12.490 --> 01:23:20.298
And you have to be president and you have to calm down and be more, how to put it,

1190
01:23:22.741 --> 01:23:23.362
diplomatic.

1191
01:23:24.002 --> 01:23:34.771
Yeah, well, you can't forgive, just forgive everything like that and say, well, sorry, that's Putin, a powerful country.

1192
01:23:35.272 --> 01:23:36.613
Let's just forget everything.

1193
01:23:37.093 --> 01:23:38.274
Let's forgive everything.

1194
01:23:39.115 --> 01:23:43.618
And somehow, well, we'll buy and sell gas or diesel or whatever.

1195
01:23:44.379 --> 01:23:45.100
That's difficult.

1196
01:23:45.660 --> 01:23:46.240
You understand?

1197
01:23:47.742 --> 01:23:51.725
Do you ever worry about how this experience has changed you?

1198
01:23:54.322 --> 01:23:56.945
Because you have been irreversibly changed by this.

1199
01:23:57.105 --> 01:24:03.512
I can tell both from meeting you, looking at how you used to be three, four, five years ago, you've been irreversibly changed.

1200
01:24:04.333 --> 01:24:06.455
And you're a father and you're a husband.

1201
01:24:06.515 --> 01:24:11.140
And at some point this war will be over, you know, God willing.

1202
01:24:12.082 --> 01:24:16.046
But do you ever think about how you're irreversibly changed?

1203
01:24:19.537 --> 01:24:20.579
You can't bring it back.

1204
01:24:21.201 --> 01:24:21.541
It's just...

1205
01:24:21.922 --> 01:24:24.167
It's two different worlds.

1206
01:24:24.948 --> 01:24:26.391
A re-evaluation of values.

1207
01:24:26.852 --> 01:24:27.914
My only dream is...

1208
01:24:29.520 --> 01:24:30.460
to end this war.

1209
01:24:31.501 --> 01:24:33.021
I desperately want justice.

1210
01:24:33.761 --> 01:24:39.783
I just really want, I know so many people had their hearts ripped out and there won't be a new heart.

1211
01:24:39.823 --> 01:24:41.504
You have to give them at least something.

1212
01:24:41.624 --> 01:24:46.785
So, some trial, some justice, you know, at least some moral solace is an absolute must.

1213
01:24:46.845 --> 01:24:55.348
You can't just leave it because that hole inside them, it won't heal and there will be revenge, like I told you.

1214
01:24:55.728 --> 01:24:55.808
And

1215
01:24:57.511 --> 01:25:10.779
And the revenge of so many people who lost everything, that naturally brings risks of some kind of ongoing military or combat actions, you know, and so forth.

1216
01:25:10.939 --> 01:25:12.179
So it's not that simple.

1217
01:25:12.219 --> 01:25:13.440
It doesn't just end like that.

1218
01:25:14.100 --> 01:25:16.102
Why do we talk about a just peace?

1219
01:25:16.322 --> 01:25:18.183
Some people ask, well, what is a just peace?

1220
01:25:18.823 --> 01:25:21.284
Well, somehow there has to be justice.

1221
01:25:22.405 --> 01:25:23.986
The guilty must be punished.

1222
01:25:24.006 --> 01:25:24.226
Right.

1223
01:25:25.734 --> 01:25:28.095
At the very least, you have to show a path that it will happen.

1224
01:25:28.455 --> 01:25:30.095
Maybe not right now, but that it will happen.

1225
01:25:30.615 --> 01:25:33.136
It's just totally impossible to simply forgive.

1226
01:25:34.076 --> 01:25:40.537
And you realize that you want to be with your kids, with your wife.

1227
01:25:40.917 --> 01:25:46.559
Generally, you just want to end the war and get a little bit of a life.

1228
01:25:47.399 --> 01:25:51.920
But if I asked Alina, your wife, how you have changed...

1229
01:25:53.753 --> 01:25:56.414
on a human level, because of all of this, what might she say to me?

1230
01:25:58.075 --> 01:25:58.575
I don't know.

1231
01:25:59.216 --> 01:26:00.997
She'd definitely say I've changed a lot.

1232
01:26:01.777 --> 01:26:04.058
Yeah, she tells me sometimes.

1233
01:26:04.878 --> 01:26:05.419
Yeah, well.

1234
01:26:06.579 --> 01:26:07.139
What is she saying?

1235
01:26:11.542 --> 01:26:12.742
Well, you know how it is.

1236
01:26:15.844 --> 01:26:17.805
She focuses on different things, you know.

1237
01:26:18.765 --> 01:26:19.565
Different values.

1238
01:26:20.926 --> 01:26:22.767
You just want, somehow.

1239
01:26:26.349 --> 01:26:31.451
You want to hold onto something, the people close to you.

1240
01:26:32.111 --> 01:26:33.331
You really crave that warmth.

1241
01:26:35.352 --> 01:26:36.872
You want to break through this.

1242
01:26:40.113 --> 01:26:40.233
Ah.

1243
01:26:42.094 --> 01:26:42.334
Hmm.

1244
01:26:43.038 --> 01:26:46.380
In a war, you fight and you're lonely, you know?

1245
01:26:47.681 --> 01:26:55.326
In life before this war, you're definitely not lonely because you have friends, company, business, then maybe politics.

1246
01:26:56.367 --> 01:26:57.688
But you're not lonely.

1247
01:26:58.668 --> 01:27:04.391
I run a country and this is about something completely different right now.

1248
01:27:04.712 --> 01:27:09.655
But when you hug your family, it's just like that.

1249
01:27:10.915 --> 01:27:12.676
Well, it means there are people who love you.

1250
01:27:12.976 --> 01:27:13.517
That matters.

1251
01:27:14.798 --> 01:27:15.298
Do you miss them?

1252
01:27:16.158 --> 01:27:16.659
Very much.

1253
01:27:17.839 --> 01:27:18.300
Very much.

1254
01:27:19.100 --> 01:27:21.141
Pointless sentimentality.

1255
01:27:22.002 --> 01:27:22.562
Maybe that's it.

1256
01:27:26.765 --> 01:27:27.265
Love.

1257
01:27:29.020 --> 01:27:29.721
That's how it is.

1258
01:27:30.721 --> 01:27:32.343
Years have passed, you know.

1259
01:27:33.884 --> 01:27:40.069
Between this and this, years, years, years.

1260
01:27:40.249 --> 01:27:42.070
I really miss them constantly.

1261
01:27:43.031 --> 01:27:45.093
And it feels like that, even when they're right next to me.

1262
01:27:46.154 --> 01:27:47.235
It's just this habit.

1263
01:27:48.716 --> 01:27:54.921
This habit of doing work and focusing exclusively on work.

1264
01:27:55.781 --> 01:27:56.042
Even...

1265
01:27:57.508 --> 01:27:59.029
When they're near, I miss them sometimes.

1266
01:27:59.669 --> 01:28:06.514
Meaning, well, again, I don't like to complain, and I'm not complaining.

1267
01:28:06.634 --> 01:28:08.195
I chose my own path.

1268
01:28:09.936 --> 01:28:14.959
And, of course, I didn't choose the war, but I chose this path.

1269
01:28:15.119 --> 01:28:22.223
Well, this war, it fell on my lifetime and on the lifetime of our generation.

1270
01:28:23.364 --> 01:28:23.564
Yeah.

1271
01:28:25.108 --> 01:28:26.789
Beautiful wife and beautiful kids.

1272
01:28:29.751 --> 01:28:32.954
Your daughter, she's not a child anymore.

1273
01:28:32.994 --> 01:28:34.435
Yeah, yeah.

1274
01:28:34.495 --> 01:28:37.677
They've all grown up in the last four years.

1275
01:28:38.237 --> 01:28:39.138
She's a young lady now.

1276
01:28:40.960 --> 01:28:41.681
Very much so.

1277
01:28:41.841 --> 01:28:43.462
She really has, yeah, grown up.

1278
01:28:43.662 --> 01:28:49.886
Yes, and all the children of Ukraine, and it's true, I've said this, the children of Ukraine grew up during the war.

1279
01:28:50.447 --> 01:28:51.167
Totally true.

1280
01:28:51.888 --> 01:28:58.212
They are all so grown up, and it's so sad that childhood passed during a war.

1281
01:28:58.332 --> 01:29:01.174
Well, but nonetheless, we believe in peace.

1282
01:29:01.714 --> 01:29:04.036
Peace will prevail anyway, 100%.

1283
01:29:04.736 --> 01:29:08.459
And my daughter and I are really great friends.

1284
01:29:08.639 --> 01:29:09.580
She's grown up now.

1285
01:29:10.600 --> 01:29:13.630
And well, her English is better.

1286
01:29:13.650 --> 01:29:17.222
Do you get to spend a lot of time with the kids?

1287
01:29:18.865 --> 01:29:23.207
When there's time, I try to be with them, to call, we talk.

1288
01:29:23.808 --> 01:29:25.349
These days, there are plenty of options.

1289
01:29:25.589 --> 01:29:27.650
We talk online, we talk in different ways.

1290
01:29:27.750 --> 01:29:28.610
That's how it is.

1291
01:29:28.710 --> 01:29:35.214
Is it possible, you know, gosh, I've spent, since I was 18 years old, been running businesses.

1292
01:29:35.294 --> 01:29:39.456
And, you know, running a startup, I thought, you know, was a challenge.

1293
01:29:39.536 --> 01:29:42.178
But it is incomparable from...

1294
01:29:42.838 --> 01:29:49.020
And I say this because I think about how that pulled me away from the people in my life, my relationships, being so obsessed with business.

1295
01:29:49.700 --> 01:29:57.883
But it's just totally incomparable to think about what that must be like to try and maintain those important relationships, especially with children.

1296
01:29:58.783 --> 01:30:02.945
when your country is being invaded and you are the leader of that country.

1297
01:30:03.765 --> 01:30:10.427
I almost can't fathom how you can find moments of presence with them, like true presence.

1298
01:30:11.027 --> 01:30:17.950
I understand how one might be able to fake presence for a short period of time, but true sort of intellectual presence.

1299
01:30:18.170 --> 01:30:19.030
Is it possible?

1300
01:30:22.454 --> 01:30:25.156
Differently, but differently now, absolutely.

1301
01:30:25.237 --> 01:30:26.798
But yes, that presence matters.

1302
01:30:27.078 --> 01:30:30.921
And those moments you mentioned, you've been in business since you were 18.

1303
01:30:31.622 --> 01:30:38.407
And some, I imagine, of your relationships become secondary probably, while business always consumes your whole life.

1304
01:30:38.467 --> 01:30:40.189
Well, at least it was that way for me.

1305
01:30:40.729 --> 01:30:49.096
And this re-evaluation from this war and these images and these horrific moments definitely shows me that business is secondary.

1306
01:30:50.097 --> 01:30:51.118
Everything is secondary.

1307
01:30:51.718 --> 01:30:52.618
These people right here.

1308
01:30:53.919 --> 01:30:56.900
That's what matters most.

1309
01:30:58.341 --> 01:30:59.681
Now, that you can't get back.

1310
01:31:00.922 --> 01:31:08.645
These years slip away, and in these intense moments, you remember these people.

1311
01:31:09.385 --> 01:31:10.045
It's important.

1312
01:31:12.867 --> 01:31:16.588
And your wife, Alina, has been your rock through it all, I've heard you say.

1313
01:31:17.288 --> 01:31:21.290
She's been your stability throughout all of this, all of these crazy, crazy times.

1314
01:31:23.552 --> 01:31:25.193
Well, we support each other.

1315
01:31:26.053 --> 01:31:26.594
That's true.

1316
01:31:27.434 --> 01:31:40.841
We, um, we, I think that I have a very, um, smart, uh, wife and she is so real.

1317
01:31:40.941 --> 01:31:43.103
We have real, we have real feelings.

1318
01:31:44.063 --> 01:31:47.845
We, we have love and respect.

1319
01:31:47.905 --> 01:31:49.606
I think that's very important.

1320
01:31:50.527 --> 01:31:50.867
Um, yeah.

1321
01:31:51.392 --> 01:31:52.192
to respect each other.

1322
01:31:52.273 --> 01:31:53.533
And you know, how should I put it?

1323
01:31:53.553 --> 01:31:54.974
People should find each other interesting.

1324
01:31:56.015 --> 01:31:58.356
I think that's the most important thing.

1325
01:31:58.476 --> 01:32:00.057
People need to find each other interesting.

1326
01:32:01.298 --> 01:32:01.498
Yeah.

1327
01:32:01.538 --> 01:32:02.859
And we find each other very interesting.

1328
01:32:02.879 --> 01:32:03.439
We feel good.

1329
01:32:04.720 --> 01:32:05.440
We feel very good.

1330
01:32:06.073 --> 01:32:13.900
The other very important woman in your life, your parents are still here, but your mother, I heard she calls you almost every day.

1331
01:32:14.901 --> 01:32:15.162
Still.

1332
01:32:15.202 --> 01:32:15.882
Every single day.

1333
01:32:16.663 --> 01:32:17.143
Every day.

1334
01:32:17.864 --> 01:32:18.405
Every single day.

1335
01:32:18.425 --> 01:32:18.745
That's right.

1336
01:32:18.985 --> 01:32:19.786
Every day.

1337
01:32:20.086 --> 01:32:21.748
Where does she, she's living in Ukraine still?

1338
01:32:21.788 --> 01:32:22.048
Yeah.

1339
01:32:22.308 --> 01:32:23.890
When your mother calls you, what does she say every day?

1340
01:32:25.271 --> 01:32:25.992
What is she asking you?

1341
01:32:26.452 --> 01:32:30.636
Her first question is, did you actually pick up?

1342
01:32:33.729 --> 01:32:38.532
She's already like that because I so often she, I look, God, 12 missed calls.

1343
01:32:38.632 --> 01:32:39.473
Mom, I'm working.

1344
01:32:39.533 --> 01:32:41.034
I tell her 12 calls.

1345
01:32:41.154 --> 01:32:43.115
How can you call someone so many times?

1346
01:32:43.595 --> 01:32:44.756
And she keeps dialing.

1347
01:32:44.816 --> 01:32:47.598
She'll call you all day long until I pick up.

1348
01:32:48.778 --> 01:32:51.640
So we make sure to speak once a day.

1349
01:32:52.961 --> 01:32:55.182
She asks how I'm feeling.

1350
01:32:55.883 --> 01:32:56.883
And is she worried about you?

1351
01:32:57.203 --> 01:32:57.764
Oh, yeah.

1352
01:32:58.064 --> 01:32:58.424
Yeah, yeah.

1353
01:32:58.904 --> 01:32:59.525
How are you?

1354
01:33:00.445 --> 01:33:01.326
How are you feeling?

1355
01:33:01.346 --> 01:33:01.606
How are you?

1356
01:33:03.373 --> 01:33:04.214
How are the kids?

1357
01:33:05.575 --> 01:33:05.995
Tell me.

1358
01:33:07.277 --> 01:33:07.517
Right?

1359
01:33:08.338 --> 01:33:12.301
When is Putin going to end the war?

1360
01:33:14.103 --> 01:33:16.145
And I say, mom, we're doing everything we can.

1361
01:33:19.415 --> 01:33:39.042
And as things stand at the moment, for the people don't understand what's actually going on on the ground in Ukraine, where the Russian troops currently are, what life is like on a day-to-day basis if you're a Ukrainian, can you explain to me which parts of Ukraine are currently occupied and generally what life is like for Ukrainians at the moment?

1362
01:33:42.804 --> 01:33:43.404
Occupied?

1363
01:33:45.805 --> 01:33:46.585
Occupied was...

1364
01:33:48.066 --> 01:33:48.506
Crimea.

1365
01:33:49.347 --> 01:33:58.617
Then they took the Azov, that's an inland sea of ours, and that's our sea.

1366
01:33:58.657 --> 01:34:02.041
They made it, yes, they turned it into an inland sea.

1367
01:34:02.781 --> 01:34:10.449
They took Mariupol, they took Mariupol, they took Berdyansk, all of the Azov.

1368
01:34:11.130 --> 01:34:13.491
Kerch is a city on the Black Sea.

1369
01:34:14.051 --> 01:34:16.633
They made it so we can't get out.

1370
01:34:16.913 --> 01:34:25.056
Next, Oleski is where right now people and children are trapped without food, without anything.

1371
01:34:25.096 --> 01:34:26.017
They won't let them through.

1372
01:34:26.397 --> 01:34:27.938
Right now we are working to unblock it.

1373
01:34:27.958 --> 01:34:29.398
There were 2,500 people.

1374
01:34:31.248 --> 01:34:32.909
left Kherson.

1375
01:34:32.949 --> 01:34:35.431
We fought to take back the major city of Kherson.

1376
01:34:36.032 --> 01:34:36.993
We reclaimed it.

1377
01:34:38.194 --> 01:34:41.076
Kherson is split by the Dnipro River.

1378
01:34:41.176 --> 01:34:45.960
Our people live on one bank, the enemy is on the other bank, and that's why they shell out Kherson.

1379
01:34:46.280 --> 01:34:49.482
And Zaporizhia, she's also under our control.

1380
01:34:49.502 --> 01:34:49.983
So they took

1381
01:34:51.384 --> 01:34:55.485
Crimea, Donetsk region, Luhansk region.

1382
01:34:56.186 --> 01:35:00.047
They couldn't take like, you can call it, I have Kherson.

1383
01:35:00.907 --> 01:35:03.308
This part, this part is ours.

1384
01:35:03.388 --> 01:35:06.049
So upside, the map is just upside down.

1385
01:35:09.811 --> 01:35:13.292
From Kharkiv here, this is what they call Luhansk Oblast.

1386
01:35:14.168 --> 01:35:14.568
right here.

1387
01:35:14.588 --> 01:35:15.769
This is our Kramatorsk.

1388
01:35:16.189 --> 01:35:17.991
Like this right here.

1389
01:35:18.031 --> 01:35:22.313
They took Yenaki, they took Mativta, Donetskoblast right here.

1390
01:35:22.474 --> 01:35:23.454
Zaporizhia is ours.

1391
01:35:23.854 --> 01:35:37.183
So basically people can see that all of this is all of this is this is roughly roughly sorry I'm not very good at drawing.

1392
01:35:38.824 --> 01:35:41.046
All of this is all of this is roughly 18

1393
01:35:44.182 --> 01:36:11.108
18 to 19 percent of our territory that's roughly roughly it roughly because their maps are one thing to be honest they sell uh one story to the people we have different maps we believe we're right well naturally they have their own their own approach to talking with society and presenting information but roughly that's what it is

1394
01:36:12.373 --> 01:36:18.159
And they're attacking via missiles and drones other parts of Ukraine constantly, right?

1395
01:36:18.799 --> 01:36:19.340
Completely.

1396
01:36:19.520 --> 01:36:19.760
Yes.

1397
01:36:20.000 --> 01:36:20.221
Yes.

1398
01:36:20.721 --> 01:36:24.765
See, they're focused on, well, honestly, you could point everywhere here.

1399
01:36:24.785 --> 01:36:26.186
They've already started today.

1400
01:36:26.947 --> 01:36:28.809
Right here, they kill people in Lutsk.

1401
01:36:28.869 --> 01:36:31.091
That's the western part of our country.

1402
01:36:31.632 --> 01:36:32.873
Right here, a missile struck.

1403
01:36:32.953 --> 01:36:34.534
And they're hitting Kyiv,

1404
01:36:35.815 --> 01:36:37.399
uh, Puelucci right here.

1405
01:36:37.439 --> 01:36:41.548
We went with the British secretary, saw 23 people killed.

1406
01:36:41.908 --> 01:36:44.915
Gitomir is under constant shelling.

1407
01:36:45.817 --> 01:36:45.917
Uh,

1408
01:36:46.685 --> 01:36:48.625
Well, Rivne has fewer strikes.

1409
01:36:49.786 --> 01:36:53.806
Lviv, this part, fewer strikes here.

1410
01:36:54.487 --> 01:37:06.069
This part, to be honest, all of this part is far away from the line of occupation, from the contact line and from the Russian Federation.

1411
01:37:06.109 --> 01:37:10.850
So obviously the distance is great, which is why there are no massive strikes there.

1412
01:37:12.010 --> 01:37:14.011
Yes, well, that's roughly it.

1413
01:37:14.791 --> 01:37:16.051
What are they trying to accomplish?

1414
01:37:17.106 --> 01:37:18.707
Adessa is being shelled.

1415
01:37:19.367 --> 01:37:20.028
Leave for life.

1416
01:37:20.368 --> 01:37:20.848
What do they want?

1417
01:37:21.408 --> 01:37:27.151
To pull out of the east of our country so that Putin... And the east is...

1418
01:37:27.371 --> 01:37:28.132
Here's what he wants.

1419
01:37:29.199 --> 01:37:32.560
He wants, basically, he wants to take the city of Zaporizhia, but he can't.

1420
01:37:33.240 --> 01:37:34.260
That's a target for him.

1421
01:37:34.660 --> 01:37:37.881
Zaporizhia and Kherson and Mykolaev, all targets.

1422
01:37:37.941 --> 01:37:39.381
But he doesn't say that.

1423
01:37:40.122 --> 01:37:40.942
He doesn't say it.

1424
01:37:41.002 --> 01:37:44.283
But after all, we liberated those cities.

1425
01:37:44.803 --> 01:37:46.023
We liberated Kherson.

1426
01:37:46.463 --> 01:37:46.623
And...

1427
01:37:47.243 --> 01:37:48.984
But have you heard directly from them?

1428
01:37:49.484 --> 01:37:49.664
Right.

1429
01:37:49.944 --> 01:37:55.165
As to what their demands are, what they say that they want to stop launching missiles?

1430
01:37:55.405 --> 01:37:55.605
Yes.

1431
01:38:01.495 --> 01:38:03.677
They want to take pretty much the east of Ukraine.

1432
01:38:03.897 --> 01:38:04.537
Yes, the east.

1433
01:38:04.557 --> 01:38:07.059
That means they want Slovyansk.

1434
01:38:07.079 --> 01:38:07.840
Well, these are key.

1435
01:38:07.860 --> 01:38:11.163
Slovyansk, Kramatorsk, Drushkivka.

1436
01:38:11.663 --> 01:38:18.068
And that leads right out into the Dnipropetrovsk region, into Pavlohrad, Dnipropetrovsk.

1437
01:38:18.088 --> 01:38:18.769
These are the most.

1438
01:38:18.909 --> 01:38:20.490
Krvij Rij is my hometown.

1439
01:38:21.031 --> 01:38:23.372
Nikopol is an industrial hub.

1440
01:38:24.198 --> 01:38:26.819
an engineering hub, a manufacturing hub.

1441
01:38:26.919 --> 01:38:30.161
It's the economy of our country.

1442
01:38:30.881 --> 01:38:39.845
And so it's very dangerous because if you surrender this part to them, and this is heavily reinforced defense of our nation right here.

1443
01:38:44.127 --> 01:38:44.507
Like this.

1444
01:38:45.548 --> 01:38:47.969
And if we hand these cities of ours over to them,

1445
01:38:49.237 --> 01:38:50.578
then the risk is huge.

1446
01:38:51.319 --> 01:39:00.027
If he wants to keep going, he could seize a huge number of our cities if he pushes further.

1447
01:39:00.668 --> 01:39:01.468
And the risk is real.

1448
01:39:01.508 --> 01:39:02.569
Nobody guarantees anything.

1449
01:39:02.589 --> 01:39:03.170
You understand?

1450
01:39:03.310 --> 01:39:06.573
Everyone talks about security guarantees and we're open.

1451
01:39:06.613 --> 01:39:07.834
We're completely open to that.

1452
01:39:07.854 --> 01:39:09.396
We say, well, okay, security guarantees.

1453
01:39:09.436 --> 01:39:10.617
Let's do NATO.

1454
01:39:11.931 --> 01:39:13.492
Well, NATO, you know, the Russians.

1455
01:39:13.572 --> 01:39:19.595
Well, again, they keep sending signals to the Russians because you have to give security guarantees.

1456
01:39:20.135 --> 01:39:27.179
On top of that, like I told you, the biggest compromise with so many dead, the biggest compromise we're already making is a ceasefire.

1457
01:39:27.219 --> 01:39:28.400
Let's just stop this war.

1458
01:39:28.660 --> 01:39:30.321
But they want us to pull out even further.

1459
01:39:30.681 --> 01:39:32.762
And if we pull out, where are the security guarantees?

1460
01:39:33.642 --> 01:39:34.963
Aside from the fact that it's unfair.

1461
01:39:37.250 --> 01:39:42.613
You know, you talked about the barbaric nature of how they've treated Ukrainians.

1462
01:39:42.894 --> 01:39:49.137
Are you at all concerned that they might escalate using more horrific weapons like nuclear weapons at any point?

1463
01:39:50.418 --> 01:39:51.559
Has that ever crossed your mind?

1464
01:39:54.709 --> 01:39:59.313
Well, it crosses everyone's mind after what they've done that they might do something worse.

1465
01:39:59.773 --> 01:40:12.725
But as of today, well, I don't think they'll take the risk of using nuclear weapons because then I think they won't definitely I'm sure they won't have any allies left.

1466
01:40:13.436 --> 01:40:15.797
including countries like America, China.

1467
01:40:16.877 --> 01:40:21.739
Well, excuse me, but that's far too dangerous even for nuclear powers.

1468
01:40:21.979 --> 01:40:34.523
That means if one country can do it, then if there's a conflict somewhere else on another continent in another theater, I don't know, the Middle East, whatever, that means if a nuclear weapon is used once, it might be used a second and a third time.

1469
01:40:34.983 --> 01:40:38.865
So I don't think Putin will risk nuclear weapons.

1470
01:40:39.365 --> 01:40:41.586
But then again, we're dealing with

1471
01:40:42.695 --> 01:41:04.328
Look, we're dealing with a man and with a system that until the end of his days will hold on to him and he to it because only when his life ends will he leave the Kremlin and hand over, well physically hand over, naturally transfer power.

1472
01:41:05.329 --> 01:41:07.811
I'm more than certain of that.

1473
01:41:07.831 --> 01:41:08.171
Okay.

1474
01:41:08.853 --> 01:41:22.716
Regarding the current situation this week with Trump, with Russia, and this deal that's been done, from my understanding, because there's an energy crisis globally, Trump has now done a deal with Russia for diesel.

1475
01:41:23.156 --> 01:41:27.636
He then asked you not to attack any energy infrastructure in Russia.

1476
01:41:28.937 --> 01:41:34.898
There's a video that I actually have here of him describing this, which a lot of people have now seen.

1477
01:41:34.918 --> 01:41:35.718
I'll play it.

1478
01:41:36.195 --> 01:41:37.478
Well, I look at it differently.

1479
01:41:37.538 --> 01:41:39.963
Zelensky could have settled this war many times.

1480
01:41:40.324 --> 01:41:41.447
He chooses not to.

1481
01:41:42.375 --> 01:41:43.156
Very difficult.

1482
01:41:43.996 --> 01:41:45.918
It's a war that should have never been started.

1483
01:41:45.958 --> 01:41:49.380
If I were president, if the election weren't rigged, I would have been president.

1484
01:41:49.780 --> 01:41:51.302
And that war would have never started.

1485
01:41:51.682 --> 01:41:53.683
We said you can do whatever you want to Russia.

1486
01:41:53.723 --> 01:41:57.566
Don't hit the refineries because that's a world problem that's caused.

1487
01:41:58.267 --> 01:42:00.308
And he wants to make problems for the world.

1488
01:42:00.728 --> 01:42:05.452
He wants to make problems for our farmers, our ranchers with diesel fuel.

1489
01:42:05.612 --> 01:42:10.416
Because Russia supplies a large portion of the diesel fuel throughout the world.

1490
01:42:11.156 --> 01:42:16.681
And we told him, do whatever you want, but don't hit the diesel fuel because there's a big problem.

1491
01:42:17.101 --> 01:42:17.802
And what does he do?

1492
01:42:17.822 --> 01:42:19.463
He goes and hits the diesel fuel.

1493
01:42:19.643 --> 01:42:20.324
Do what you want.

1494
01:42:20.344 --> 01:42:21.344
Don't hit refineries.

1495
01:42:21.745 --> 01:42:22.806
There's plenty of target.

1496
01:42:22.886 --> 01:42:23.947
And he went out and he hit.

1497
01:42:24.247 --> 01:42:26.088
And he's not going to affect our farmers.

1498
01:42:26.669 --> 01:42:28.390
And he's not going to affect our ranchers.

1499
01:42:28.891 --> 01:42:30.932
And he's not going to affect the rest of the world.

1500
01:42:30.992 --> 01:42:34.155
So he's better damn well stopped.

1501
01:42:35.177 --> 01:42:38.580
And in that, he says that he thinks the Ukraine needs a new president.

1502
01:42:39.000 --> 01:42:39.981
Yeah.

1503
01:42:40.641 --> 01:42:44.504
First of all, diesel exports have no impact.

1504
01:42:44.544 --> 01:42:53.852
The volume of diesel exports is so negligible from Russia that it has zero impact on prices in the United States of America.

1505
01:42:54.836 --> 01:42:57.397
That is totally false information.

1506
01:42:57.857 --> 01:42:58.317
That's first.

1507
01:42:58.557 --> 01:43:03.158
Second, it makes no sense for us to strike Russia's energy infrastructure.

1508
01:43:03.198 --> 01:43:05.619
We retaliate because they strike our energy infrastructure.

1509
01:43:06.239 --> 01:43:07.460
We've spoken a lot about this.

1510
01:43:08.240 --> 01:43:09.800
The Russians hit our energy grid.

1511
01:43:10.020 --> 01:43:11.361
Our people live without power.

1512
01:43:12.558 --> 01:43:16.202
We don't have oil, gas, diesel, and so on.

1513
01:43:16.262 --> 01:43:17.022
That hurts them.

1514
01:43:17.603 --> 01:43:19.044
What hurts us is electricity.

1515
01:43:19.204 --> 01:43:20.385
They hit our electricity.

1516
01:43:21.006 --> 01:43:23.088
We strike back at their diesel.

1517
01:43:23.669 --> 01:43:26.431
They make money on diesel and spend it on weapons.

1518
01:43:27.012 --> 01:43:27.712
My offer...

1519
01:43:28.353 --> 01:43:30.535
Excuse me, but I don't need this.

1520
01:43:30.695 --> 01:43:36.241
I've always told President Trump, broker an energy ceasefire, at least on energy.

1521
01:43:36.602 --> 01:43:40.225
At least let's give people light and good for the Russians.

1522
01:43:40.446 --> 01:43:43.329
They'll sell their oil if they want to, if that's what you need.

1523
01:43:44.190 --> 01:43:46.952
But President Trump can't reach an agreement with Putin on this.

1524
01:43:47.652 --> 01:43:50.533
Putin refuses him an energy ceasefire.

1525
01:43:50.973 --> 01:44:02.538
And so the president decided to pin this problem, not on Putin, but on me, explaining to his people that because of this, diesel prices in America are going up.

1526
01:44:02.598 --> 01:44:03.859
That is completely untrue.

1527
01:44:04.648 --> 01:44:05.708
And I don't understand.

1528
01:44:05.768 --> 01:44:07.789
I have a good relationship with him, with Trump.

1529
01:44:08.130 --> 01:44:14.752
And I think it's wrong and unacceptable that he pins Russia's aggression and Russia's killings on me.

1530
01:44:15.032 --> 01:44:17.113
He is shifting the context.

1531
01:44:17.393 --> 01:44:18.254
And that's not fair.

1532
01:44:18.674 --> 01:44:20.915
And that's why I honestly said, that's unfair.

1533
01:44:21.555 --> 01:44:22.175
Cease fire.

1534
01:44:22.436 --> 01:44:22.756
He says,

1535
01:44:23.436 --> 01:44:24.677
It's not, they can't work it out.

1536
01:44:24.697 --> 01:44:34.145
Well, if you can't work it out, but you need diesel, though again, I think this is just deflecting the focus away from Iran, from what's happening in the Middle East.

1537
01:44:34.185 --> 01:44:36.007
The entire volume is blocked over there.

1538
01:44:36.467 --> 01:44:38.849
That's exactly where nothing is working out.

1539
01:44:39.009 --> 01:44:41.552
Energy, the Strait of Hormuz is blocked.

1540
01:44:42.152 --> 01:44:43.473
That's the root of the problem.

1541
01:44:43.914 --> 01:44:49.498
But everything gets shifted onto us and I made the target as the leader of our country.

1542
01:44:50.019 --> 01:44:50.960
So I said, okay,

1543
01:44:51.680 --> 01:44:56.583
You can't force Putin to stop the war and make an energy truce.

1544
01:44:57.223 --> 01:45:00.565
Give me air defense missiles.

1545
01:45:01.745 --> 01:45:02.946
I won't fire at anyone.

1546
01:45:03.006 --> 01:45:04.507
I'll protect our energy sector.

1547
01:45:04.967 --> 01:45:06.348
So where am I being unfair?

1548
01:45:06.628 --> 01:45:07.108
In what way?

1549
01:45:07.188 --> 01:45:08.389
I asked him, give us missiles.

1550
01:45:08.909 --> 01:45:09.650
Not for free.

1551
01:45:10.230 --> 01:45:12.291
Again, not even for free.

1552
01:45:12.731 --> 01:45:16.113
Europeans are funding this, funding all of it.

1553
01:45:16.473 --> 01:45:17.314
There's an agreement.

1554
01:45:17.334 --> 01:45:18.014
There's an agreement.

1555
01:45:18.169 --> 01:45:19.690
But they won't give them to us.

1556
01:45:19.730 --> 01:45:20.490
They say we can't.

1557
01:45:20.930 --> 01:45:23.691
They give and have given everything to the Middle East.

1558
01:45:25.172 --> 01:45:29.854
Look, it's just kind of, well, it's just like, well, it's unfair.

1559
01:45:31.154 --> 01:45:36.937
To the Middle East, Patriot missiles with Putin, a diesel deal.

1560
01:45:37.855 --> 01:45:42.299
I'm expected not to respond to an energy attack inside Ukraine.

1561
01:45:42.559 --> 01:45:45.701
And diesel prices are rising in America because of that.

1562
01:45:45.902 --> 01:45:46.422
It's unfair.

1563
01:45:46.662 --> 01:45:48.203
And you need a different president.

1564
01:45:49.184 --> 01:45:58.272
Well, diesel prices, I guarantee you 100%, diesel prices don't depend on the volume that Russia sells.

1565
01:45:59.132 --> 01:45:59.893
They just don't.

1566
01:46:01.085 --> 01:46:05.808
And about 76% of Ukrainians say they wouldn't want an election now, according to some recent surveys as well.

1567
01:46:06.149 --> 01:46:12.433
My last question to you, Mr. President, is, is there a realistic path to the end of this war?

1568
01:46:13.554 --> 01:46:14.554
And what does that look like?

1569
01:46:16.476 --> 01:46:17.416
A realistic path.

1570
01:46:18.717 --> 01:46:24.541
Trump can bring Putin to the negotiating table very easily.

1571
01:46:27.103 --> 01:46:29.645
Because he needs to, the way he talks about me,

1572
01:46:30.951 --> 01:46:34.914
President Trump, he needs to adopt that kind of rhetoric about Putin.

1573
01:46:36.415 --> 01:46:37.296
Why do you think he's not?

1574
01:46:37.736 --> 01:46:38.256
I don't know.

1575
01:46:38.657 --> 01:46:39.577
Honestly, I don't know.

1576
01:46:39.918 --> 01:46:41.339
He's got sanctions on his desk.

1577
01:46:41.399 --> 01:46:42.259
It wasn't him voting.

1578
01:46:42.580 --> 01:46:44.341
Congress voted for strong sanctions.

1579
01:46:44.841 --> 01:46:45.582
He can do it.

1580
01:46:47.151 --> 01:46:47.992
I don't know why.

1581
01:46:48.192 --> 01:46:49.693
Maybe they have a special relationship.

1582
01:46:50.273 --> 01:46:51.114
Maybe something else.

1583
01:46:51.214 --> 01:46:51.934
I can't tell you.

1584
01:46:52.495 --> 01:46:53.315
I don't know everything.

1585
01:46:54.076 --> 01:46:58.298
I can only guess some economic deals and so on.

1586
01:46:58.939 --> 01:46:59.919
An old rely.

1587
01:46:59.979 --> 01:47:00.439
I don't know.

1588
01:47:00.560 --> 01:47:00.940
I don't want to.

1589
01:47:01.060 --> 01:47:07.844
The midterms are coming up and I think he might be a little bit concerned about energy prices in America, more so than maybe Ukraine.

1590
01:47:12.260 --> 01:47:17.784
Yeah, well, look, diesel prices, I give you a 100%.

1591
01:47:17.904 --> 01:47:23.587
Diesel prices don't depend on the volume Russia sells.

1592
01:47:23.968 --> 01:47:24.488
They don't.

1593
01:47:25.429 --> 01:47:28.431
Americans export energy resources.

1594
01:47:29.952 --> 01:47:34.034
Americans' energy exports aren't banned for Americans.

1595
01:47:34.815 --> 01:47:36.456
American companies export.

1596
01:47:37.593 --> 01:47:38.213
It's interesting.

1597
01:47:38.333 --> 01:47:40.674
Why do American companies export energy?

1598
01:47:40.974 --> 01:47:45.535
Well, because how can the president of the United States ban private sector exports?

1599
01:47:46.255 --> 01:47:47.275
Well, I don't think he can.

1600
01:47:47.836 --> 01:47:48.456
And why would he?

1601
01:47:48.836 --> 01:47:50.716
It sells and money comes in.

1602
01:47:51.416 --> 01:48:05.340
Well, just, well, you know how... Life, time, you know, all secrets, all mysteries always come to light.

1603
01:48:06.368 --> 01:48:07.189
It just takes time.

1604
01:48:08.210 --> 01:48:16.418
Time is definitely on the side of those who are open and ready for honest dialogue and fight.

1605
01:48:17.099 --> 01:48:20.402
Yes, which means time will be on our side.

1606
01:48:20.883 --> 01:48:21.724
What are your last words?

1607
01:48:23.550 --> 01:48:24.531
to our audience.

1608
01:48:24.631 --> 01:48:26.172
I hope that it's not last words.

1609
01:48:27.632 --> 01:48:28.433
Last words for today.

1610
01:48:28.493 --> 01:48:31.615
I have some time in my life.

1611
01:48:31.635 --> 01:48:32.595
Last words today.

1612
01:48:32.635 --> 01:48:33.916
Half of our audience are in America.

1613
01:48:34.316 --> 01:48:43.642
I wish America, which finds itself in a very tough situation, I believe because the world

1614
01:48:44.462 --> 01:48:45.663
has gone crazy.

1615
01:48:46.124 --> 01:48:53.211
What's happening with the Russians, with Iran, the fact that people want blood, people want wars.

1616
01:48:53.311 --> 01:49:00.678
I wish America would stay a great nation, be strong, be peaceful, have the chance.

1617
01:49:01.499 --> 01:49:08.465
Someone works, someone wants to be home with the kids, pray, have a family, a

1618
01:49:09.446 --> 01:49:10.226
family dinner.

1619
01:49:10.286 --> 01:49:17.529
I wish America tranquility, peace, and we're grateful for everything America has done for Ukraine.

1620
01:49:17.769 --> 01:49:18.689
We won't forget this.

1621
01:49:23.151 --> 01:49:24.111
President, thank you so much.

1622
01:49:25.112 --> 01:49:25.972
Thank you so much.

1623
01:49:26.132 --> 01:49:27.852
I know you've had a really rough week and it's been very tough.

1624
01:49:27.872 --> 01:49:29.693
So I really appreciate you taking the time.

1625
01:49:29.713 --> 01:49:33.975
I've had everything going on with Starlink and the internet and all the challenges.

1626
01:49:34.255 --> 01:49:34.655
Normal.

1627
01:49:35.708 --> 01:49:36.429
Thank you so much.

1628
01:49:36.649 --> 01:49:38.011
And we really do wish you the best.

1629
01:49:38.572 --> 01:49:39.333
We really wish you the best.

1630
01:49:39.353 --> 01:49:39.834
Thank you so much.

1631
01:49:39.854 --> 01:49:40.014
Yes.

1632
01:49:40.054 --> 01:49:43.379
And I was happy to hear, to see you and to have a dialogue.

1633
01:49:43.399 --> 01:49:45.342
We had good dialogue.

1634
01:49:45.422 --> 01:49:47.565
I think we spoke very good.

1635
01:49:47.986 --> 01:49:48.747
So thanks so much.

1636
01:49:48.927 --> 01:49:49.448
Thank you so much.

1637
01:49:49.508 --> 01:49:50.129
All the best.

1638
01:49:50.169 --> 01:49:51.250
Thank you so much.

1639
01:49:51.310 --> 01:49:51.611
Thank you.

1640
01:49:51.771 --> 01:49:52.272
Thank you so much.