WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.171 --> 00:00:04.975 We haven't been prepared for the demand for people or for power. 2 00:00:05.155 --> 00:00:08.718 I didn't realize that the tech industry was seen as such a huge source of competition. 3 00:00:08.878 --> 00:00:14.842 You don't necessarily need a four year engineering degree to have a really meaningful career in this space. 4 00:00:15.223 --> 00:00:17.204 Things are just moving too quickly for everyone. 5 00:00:17.364 --> 00:00:22.528 We're asking them to also do a job that's just changing underneath them every day. 6 00:00:22.749 --> 00:00:26.852 Let's treat today's employees like the distributed energy resources that they are. 7 00:00:31.509 --> 00:00:35.371 Grid demand continues to climb, but so do energy industry retirements. 8 00:00:35.611 --> 00:00:39.093 Can companies keep up and beat big tech to attract new talent? 9 00:00:39.213 --> 00:00:49.479 We asked our audience to weigh in on the future of the energy workforce, how they're feeling about today's hurdles, and their tips to attract and retain the young workforce needed to build tomorrow's grid. 10 00:00:49.659 --> 00:00:59.321 To dig into the insights from our State of the Utility Workforce survey, we're joined by one of the respondents, Paige Knudson, Executive Director of the Midwest Energy Efficiency Alliance. 11 00:00:59.621 --> 00:01:08.283 Paige previously served as Regional Vice President at Franklin Energy, where she coordinated utility energy efficiency and demand response programs throughout the Midwest. 12 00:01:08.623 --> 00:01:13.104 Make sure to subscribe to our channel and like this video for more content from Energy Central. 13 00:01:13.524 --> 00:01:14.764 Now, let's get into it. 14 00:01:14.804 --> 00:01:21.847 So, of course, we had to kick off our survey asking participants which word best describes how they're feeling about the energy workforce of the coming years. 15 00:01:22.468 --> 00:01:24.709 And 37% said they're uncertain. 16 00:01:24.989 --> 00:01:27.490 25% said they're optimistic. 17 00:01:27.590 --> 00:01:29.671 17% said they're feeling cautious. 18 00:01:29.851 --> 00:01:30.812 16% said energized. 19 00:01:30.992 --> 00:01:32.792 And just 5% said they're anxious. 20 00:01:33.173 --> 00:01:35.154 So, Paige, you said you're feeling optimistic. 21 00:01:35.194 --> 00:01:35.874 That's great to hear. 22 00:01:35.914 --> 00:01:38.315 Can you explain why you had that response? 23 00:01:38.335 --> 00:01:40.196 You know, what in your work makes you feel that way? 24 00:01:40.436 --> 00:01:40.716 Sure. 25 00:01:40.756 --> 00:01:47.103 Well, part of my optimism comes from watching how much the industry has evolved over the past 20 years. 26 00:01:48.144 --> 00:01:50.386 I think the challenges are new and exciting. 27 00:01:50.546 --> 00:01:57.432 So energy efficiency used to be a relatively narrow conversation, really just focused on reducing consumption. 28 00:01:58.133 --> 00:02:13.525 Given the opportunity, I always like to underscore how the energy efficiency industry has been responsible for 30 years of flat demand, and those have come through education and behavior change and improved technologies like lighting. 29 00:02:14.266 --> 00:02:20.051 And today, we're talking about so much more, how buildings interact with the grid. 30 00:02:20.071 --> 00:02:26.296 We're talking about demand flexibility, affordability, reliability, and significant new load growth. 31 00:02:27.076 --> 00:02:35.682 And that opens up an enormous range of opportunities to identify and solution also while developing new skills. 32 00:02:35.702 --> 00:02:43.868 So I recognize that the employment picture is really complicated, particularly with funding and policy uncertainty. 33 00:02:44.608 --> 00:02:57.093 So I'm not saying everything is totally rosy, but I am really optimistic because the need for people who understand and can improve our energy systems is substantial. 34 00:02:57.933 --> 00:03:08.797 And to your question about what I'm seeing today, just this morning, I checked our website and we have 57 jobs posted on Mia's career page alone. 35 00:03:09.017 --> 00:03:11.278 And those are jobs from... 36 00:03:12.238 --> 00:03:27.546 are member organizations, and they range from executive level positions like vice presidents to HVAC technicians, to IT to program managers with skills across sales, stakeholder engagement, project management. 37 00:03:28.246 --> 00:03:31.789 I also checked our local electric utilities website, ComEd. 38 00:03:31.809 --> 00:03:33.691 They have 52 postings. 39 00:03:34.211 --> 00:03:36.953 DTE in Michigan has 79. 40 00:03:37.173 --> 00:03:40.556 MISO, our independent system operator, has 107. 41 00:03:40.656 --> 00:03:43.078 And so the opportunities in need are real. 42 00:03:45.740 --> 00:03:54.966 And it's bringing together a thousand people to talk about the future of the industry, but also it's really where people make career connections. 43 00:03:55.106 --> 00:04:01.110 We post jobs on our website and it's amazing to see how much is out there, just the diversity of things that are out there. 44 00:04:01.270 --> 00:04:07.033 So we were also asking about respondents about their top concerns about the future of the energy workforce. 45 00:04:07.373 --> 00:04:13.097 And most people around a third said that their top concerns were retirements in an aging workforce. 46 00:04:13.657 --> 00:04:16.479 You pointed to training and retention challenges. 47 00:04:16.619 --> 00:04:20.842 I'm curious why that was your top concern in our responses. 48 00:04:21.042 --> 00:04:21.323 Yeah. 49 00:04:21.403 --> 00:04:27.887 So I've always worked in areas adjacent to or in support of utilities specifically. 50 00:04:28.348 --> 00:04:32.331 And I think the challenges that we see in our field are a little bit different. 51 00:04:32.491 --> 00:04:38.235 I absolutely agree that retirements are a major concern within the utility space in particular, but. 52 00:04:39.175 --> 00:04:44.719 But I do also see them as a reason to get more serious about training and retention. 53 00:04:45.119 --> 00:04:48.461 I always used to say that I was looking to hire the best people. 54 00:04:48.541 --> 00:04:53.143 So the skills are far more specific and yet they're still unknown. 55 00:04:53.684 --> 00:04:59.027 And so we're not just asking the next generation to replace the people that are retiring. 56 00:04:59.467 --> 00:05:04.510 We're asking them to also do a job that's just changing underneath them every day. 57 00:05:05.290 --> 00:05:10.491 So if experienced employees are leaving, how do we transfer their knowledge? 58 00:05:10.551 --> 00:05:14.732 How do we prepare those people that are stepping into those new roles? 59 00:05:15.732 --> 00:05:23.473 I think we sometimes treat workforce development as recruitment, just bringing someone in the door, but it doesn't end there. 60 00:05:23.553 --> 00:05:33.035 It's about showing people pathways, giving them the opportunities to grow and seeing those ways to advance and build your career. 61 00:05:33.775 --> 00:05:41.947 Retirements are a demographic challenge, and the training and retention are among the things that we can actually do something about. 62 00:05:42.592 --> 00:05:44.774 So, you know, that's a point I really want to go into more later. 63 00:05:44.814 --> 00:05:50.239 But the survey also pointed to a whole mix of trends impacting the energy workforce right now. 64 00:05:50.379 --> 00:05:55.945 Everything from climate change to increasing grid complexity to the loss of institutional knowledge, as you mentioned. 65 00:05:56.265 --> 00:06:04.012 So which other specific trends jump out to you in your energy efficiency niche as really important things affecting the workforce? 66 00:06:04.332 --> 00:06:05.994 And are enough people talking about it? 67 00:06:06.194 --> 00:06:14.900 Yeah, so I think within the energy efficiency space, it's the increasing building and grid complexity. 68 00:06:15.060 --> 00:06:22.165 So building operators increasingly need to know controls, automation, data, demand flexibility. 69 00:06:22.765 --> 00:06:25.866 alongside traditional mechanical knowledge. 70 00:06:27.047 --> 00:06:41.433 On the load growth and affordability side, we need people who can make existing buildings and infrastructure more productive, so efficient within buildings, but also the energy system, which I know we'll talk about here in a minute, I think. 71 00:06:41.713 --> 00:06:45.035 So it's not only the people who can build the new capacity. 72 00:06:45.695 --> 00:06:50.237 And then I do think that the loss of institutional knowledge is one of those pieces. 73 00:06:50.937 --> 00:06:53.580 But are people talking about them enough? 74 00:06:54.160 --> 00:07:00.306 I think there's a lot of discussion on the demand growth side, a lot of discussion on affordability. 75 00:07:01.046 --> 00:07:09.774 But, you know, one of the things that I say regularly is that if you do not have workforce as a part of your core strategy, you're missing out. 76 00:07:09.954 --> 00:07:11.996 You have to be ready with the people. 77 00:07:12.016 --> 00:07:12.116 Okay. 78 00:07:14.258 --> 00:07:21.882 One of the things that was in your survey as well was, you know, displacement by AI and competition with tech firms. 79 00:07:22.562 --> 00:07:37.710 And so I can't really speak to AI displacing humans in the field, but I do see a lot of opportunity for something that's called collaborative robotics or co-botics in the utility space. 80 00:07:38.770 --> 00:07:57.314 I know National Grid is deploying robots to use visual and thermal imaging to identify hazardous areas where their own operators don't have to go into the hazardous areas, but they can identify where there needs to be issues addressed. 81 00:08:08.558 --> 00:08:16.730 which combines thermal imaging and robotic tools to get into attics, crawl spaces, hard to reach areas. 82 00:08:17.591 --> 00:08:22.859 And those are difficult for people to access and can be dirty and hazardous. 83 00:08:23.279 --> 00:08:43.856 and having tech tools that are enabled through humans interaction, it could be a huge opportunity for the utility efficiency and weatherization programs to be more efficient from a time and cost perspective, but also quality of installation and the real energy savings that come from that. 84 00:08:44.396 --> 00:08:55.519 So tech is seen as a threat, but there's also, you know, a way to weave that in together to make the space more compelling when we're trying to recruit. 85 00:08:55.659 --> 00:08:56.599 Yeah, absolutely. 86 00:08:57.219 --> 00:09:04.921 I'm seeing all kinds of cool tech applications every day, whether it's an attic crawling robot, as you mentioned, or something like... 87 00:09:05.301 --> 00:09:29.617 lidar being applied on a plane to do vegetation management and cut down on the time it takes for workers out in the field and their risks of snake bites so all of that technology is really cool and yeah that brings me to my next point you know we we talked about all the different industries that the utility industry is competing with and it was very interesting to hear that so many respondents pointed to the tech world how big tech 88 00:09:30.237 --> 00:09:32.117 is drawing from a similar talent pool. 89 00:09:32.517 --> 00:09:39.799 So we asked respondents like yourself how companies can appeal to these young applicants who might want to work at a tech firm. 90 00:09:39.919 --> 00:09:41.219 And you had some really great advice. 91 00:09:41.299 --> 00:09:43.279 I'm just gonna read your quote from the survey. 92 00:09:43.819 --> 00:09:46.360 There are so many different ways to find your own niche and energy. 93 00:09:46.440 --> 00:09:49.640 Get people excited by showing them all the different pieces that are out there. 94 00:09:50.120 --> 00:09:58.742 So what kind of pieces, as you say, would you advise highlighting for energy organizations when they're recruiting to get this really great next generation talent? 95 00:09:59.066 --> 00:10:03.848 Well, one of the things that I love about energy is that there isn't just a single pathway into it. 96 00:10:04.348 --> 00:10:11.690 So if you love technology, there's building automation, there's energy analytics, grid modernization. 97 00:10:11.790 --> 00:10:18.052 If you like hands-on work, there is careers in HVAC or electrical systems or in direct construction. 98 00:10:18.853 --> 00:10:25.015 And if you're looking more for the people side, there's tremendous opportunities within the policy space. 99 00:10:25.535 --> 00:10:28.957 working in community engagement, program design. 100 00:10:28.997 --> 00:10:41.525 So there's some entry point for anyone anywhere on their career spectrum, right, from entry level all the way up again into executive careers. 101 00:10:43.245 --> 00:10:51.448 I think we do ourselves a disservice when we talk about the energy workforce as though it's one kind of job. 102 00:10:51.728 --> 00:11:00.110 And so you don't necessarily need a four-year engineering degree to build a meaningful career within the utility space. 103 00:11:00.350 --> 00:11:10.853 I think we can really help young people see the opportunities for a long-term and stable career within the energy space. 104 00:11:11.833 --> 00:11:20.019 I think two employers, and this is likely generally known, but need to pair mission, right? 105 00:11:20.059 --> 00:11:35.430 That's really important to so many people looking for opportunities in the energy space with specifics, pay, health care, the opportunities for additional advancement, what type of work schedule you're looking at. 106 00:11:36.391 --> 00:11:38.592 They need to see that there's a pathway. 107 00:11:39.673 --> 00:11:48.015 with a good job and not just, you know, a catchy immediate position. 108 00:11:48.255 --> 00:11:53.836 Our listeners are probably wondering what the first steps they can take are to tackle these hiring challenges. 109 00:11:54.256 --> 00:11:56.417 And Paige had a really interesting perspective on this. 110 00:11:56.517 --> 00:11:58.877 I liked the metaphor she used in our past call. 111 00:11:59.298 --> 00:12:05.059 She was saying that the near-term solution for hiring really resembles the near-term solution for building out the grid. 112 00:12:05.779 --> 00:12:07.521 you know, utilizing what we already have. 113 00:12:07.561 --> 00:12:10.285 Can you expand on that and how you came to that conclusion? 114 00:12:10.465 --> 00:12:16.553 Yeah, I think this is one of my favorite questions because it's focused around efficiency. 115 00:12:17.654 --> 00:12:20.298 So just like we need to get more out of 116 00:12:20.738 --> 00:12:26.360 the energy infrastructure that we currently have, we also need to do the same with our workforce. 117 00:12:26.960 --> 00:12:34.203 And so we talk about expanding energy infrastructure to meet future demand, but building it takes time, right? 118 00:12:34.243 --> 00:12:38.825 You keep hearing people say, we can't build our way out of it fast enough. 119 00:12:39.345 --> 00:12:44.467 And so we have to be smarter about how we use what we already have. 120 00:12:45.207 --> 00:12:48.911 And I think that same thing applies to workforce development. 121 00:12:49.011 --> 00:12:54.337 We absolutely need new people, but that pipeline is going to take time to build. 122 00:12:54.577 --> 00:13:01.765 And so we can't wait years for it to mature before we have to meet what's in front of us. 123 00:13:02.085 --> 00:13:02.505 Absolutely. 124 00:13:02.525 --> 00:13:16.890 I think it makes so much sense that we have these parallel approaches here and it's going to help so much in the near future to tackle that major challenge and fill the gap both in capacity, energy capacity and employee capacity. 125 00:13:17.670 --> 00:13:23.912 So the bottom line, Paige, what do you think our listeners should get out of this survey and why do these results matter? 126 00:13:24.387 --> 00:13:32.611 For me, workforce development has to be a component of energy strategy, and it's not just a hiring function. 127 00:13:33.251 --> 00:13:40.414 We haven't been prepared for the demand for people or for power, and now we're racing to catch up. 128 00:13:40.994 --> 00:13:43.815 So we need to invest in the people that we have. 129 00:13:43.995 --> 00:13:52.458 We need to create those stronger pathways for the next generation and build the skills the energy system actually needs. 130 00:13:52.478 --> 00:13:58.941 So all the infrastructure and technology we're planning depends on having people who know how to make it work. 131 00:13:59.681 --> 00:14:03.785 And so it depends as much on the people as the infrastructure. 132 00:14:04.586 --> 00:14:16.736 And I think, you know, one of the things that I say frequently is that we have to have the capacity, the qualified capacity to deliver power and people at the same time. 133 00:14:16.916 --> 00:14:21.941 And so that is, I think, a big part of what people should take away from it. 134 00:14:22.302 --> 00:14:24.424 I agree, you can't have one without the other. 135 00:14:24.744 --> 00:14:27.287 And I think that metaphor makes a lot of sense. 136 00:14:27.467 --> 00:14:32.071 What were your thoughts on conducting the survey and what are you taking away from it? 137 00:14:32.542 --> 00:14:40.607 Yeah, it was great to hear from people in so many different niches, on the regulatory side, on the utility side, the manufacturing side, from organizations like yours. 138 00:14:41.168 --> 00:14:45.430 I think that I didn't realize that the tech industry was seen as such a huge source of competition. 139 00:14:45.951 --> 00:14:55.257 And one respondent had a very interesting answer where they mentioned that there's so much instability in the tech industry, which could actually be a boon for the energy industry. 140 00:14:55.677 --> 00:15:05.147 You know, could utilities, other energy organizations, draw from the pool of people that are let go in these massive restructurings at tech companies? 141 00:15:05.607 --> 00:15:08.470 And I think that many young people want stability right now. 142 00:15:09.051 --> 00:15:10.592 And, you know, the grid isn't going away. 143 00:15:10.692 --> 00:15:15.497 With something so complex, you're always going to need human expertise, even in the age of AI. 144 00:15:16.518 --> 00:15:20.481 And utilities, the energy industry, they're seen as very stable careers. 145 00:15:20.521 --> 00:15:26.284 So I think that that is something that companies can really use to appeal to the young talent pool. 146 00:15:26.865 --> 00:15:31.948 I also found it interesting that people pointed to specific companies doing a great job with hiring. 147 00:15:31.988 --> 00:15:35.010 So they mentioned APS, PG&E, National Grid. 148 00:15:35.570 --> 00:15:39.155 But others said that nobody is doing well with hiring, as you might have seen. 149 00:15:39.395 --> 00:15:41.177 Some respondents said we're all in the same boat. 150 00:15:41.257 --> 00:15:43.240 Things are just moving too quickly for everyone. 151 00:15:43.440 --> 00:15:48.746 And I think that that shows an important lesson that everyone in the energy space can learn from each other. 152 00:15:49.127 --> 00:15:51.790 They're facing similar challenges when it comes to 153 00:15:52.130 --> 00:15:57.074 hiring these huge growing gaps as demand continues to skyrocket. 154 00:15:57.775 --> 00:16:10.125 And, you know, as Paige noted, we have to utilize our current workforce while we bring a new talent, just as how we have to utilize current capacity and make more of that capacity on the grid before we can build new generation. 155 00:16:10.245 --> 00:16:15.727 The takeaway here is that let's treat today's employees like the distributed energy resources that they are. 156 00:16:15.927 --> 00:16:18.548 And let us know in the comments, what do you think of the survey results? 157 00:16:18.688 --> 00:16:19.829 Did they surprise you? 158 00:16:20.369 --> 00:16:25.110 And are they going to affect how you approach hiring in the coming months and years even? 159 00:16:25.651 --> 00:16:29.132 So thanks for listening and Paige, thank you for joining us today.