WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:04.640 This may be the most meaningful thing that you listen to this week or this month for your 2 00:00:04.640 --> 00:00:08.560 organization or for yourself. Understanding the dynamic between the two types of work and how you 3 00:00:08.560 --> 00:00:13.760 get the highest returns on time to make more money has been the greatest unlock I've had in my life 4 00:00:13.760 --> 00:00:19.200 and being able to finally put words to a system that I've been improving for the last 13 years, 5 00:00:19.200 --> 00:00:23.040 I finally put it into this format. If it changes your life as much as it changed mine, 6 00:00:23.680 --> 00:00:28.160 enjoy it, use it, spread it. If you've ever had someone reach out to you and say, 7 00:00:28.240 --> 00:00:34.240 hey, God minute, hey, got 10? Hey, let me introduce you to Sohn so they're going to be in town. 8 00:00:34.240 --> 00:00:38.480 How does 10 AM work? A normal exchange like that, you might say, yeah, I've got five minutes or 9 00:00:38.480 --> 00:00:43.520 sure I can meet Sohn so for coffee. The problem is that for one specific type of worker, 10 00:00:43.520 --> 00:00:48.080 that five minute meeting blows their entire morning because they can't do the development work 11 00:00:48.080 --> 00:00:52.400 they need. They can't edit the video. They can't write the book chapter because it disrupts 12 00:00:52.400 --> 00:00:57.200 their workflow. On the other hand, there's another type of worker where for them, it's actually very 13 00:00:57.200 --> 00:01:02.880 optimal for them to take that meeting. The question is, which one are you and at what times? Also, 14 00:01:02.880 --> 00:01:06.960 special shout out to Paul Graham who wrote a tiny blog on this 14 years ago. So if time is what 15 00:01:06.960 --> 00:01:12.080 we invest and money is what we make from that investment, then the people who are the best investors 16 00:01:12.080 --> 00:01:17.680 of time are the ones who make the most money. And so it turns out there are two specific types of 17 00:01:17.680 --> 00:01:22.880 entrepreneurs and you'll switch hats throughout your day or throughout your week. The first and most 18 00:01:22.880 --> 00:01:29.520 common investor of time that people are familiar with is the manager's schedule. And these people 19 00:01:29.520 --> 00:01:33.680 have a very specific way of investing time and getting returns on it so they can make the most 20 00:01:33.680 --> 00:01:39.920 money. So let's talk about that. Managers divide their time into the smallest chunk possible. 21 00:01:39.920 --> 00:01:45.600 They often have 20 plus chunks per day from 15 minutes, sometimes five minutes, all the way to an 22 00:01:45.600 --> 00:01:52.720 hour or 90 minutes. And for managers, an empty time slot is a lost opportunity. That's time that 23 00:01:52.720 --> 00:01:58.560 did not get a return on investment for them. And for that reason, they treat time like currency. 24 00:01:58.560 --> 00:02:03.200 And the only real cost for them to fill is just the cost of coordinating with somebody else's 25 00:02:03.200 --> 00:02:09.600 calendar to find a mutually empty slot so that they can work together. Now, on paper, since work 26 00:02:09.600 --> 00:02:15.200 on meetings is a mutually filled slot, it makes both people more productive. And so when a manager 27 00:02:15.200 --> 00:02:20.720 interacts with another manager and they mutually fill a slot, both of them make more money. Now, 28 00:02:21.280 --> 00:02:26.160 they talk to lots of different people and do many different kinds of tasks all day long. This is 29 00:02:26.160 --> 00:02:32.240 the nature of the manager. They collect data, they report data to persuade, to lead, to train, 30 00:02:32.240 --> 00:02:37.920 and encourage and make other decisions one-on-one and sometimes in groups of people. For them, 31 00:02:37.920 --> 00:02:42.320 they have a pretty clear beginning of the day and a pretty clear end of the day. The day begins when 32 00:02:42.320 --> 00:02:47.520 they start preparing for their meetings, maybe 30 minutes or an hour beforehand. And it ends at the 33 00:02:47.520 --> 00:02:51.440 end of their last meeting. Now, if they prep for the next day, then they could add that on top. But 34 00:02:51.440 --> 00:02:55.840 more or less, the duration of their day is directly proportional to the duration of the meetings they 35 00:02:55.840 --> 00:03:00.320 have. They basically work until their last calendar slot. And that's how their day works. And this 36 00:03:00.320 --> 00:03:05.280 is the key point here. The main objective of the manager is to use up all their chunks in the day 37 00:03:05.280 --> 00:03:11.600 so that they maximize their time. A fully booked day is a maximally invested manager. They've 38 00:03:11.600 --> 00:03:19.040 used up all of their time slots and so they are productive. Now, the second type of time schedule 39 00:03:19.040 --> 00:03:25.440 management is something called the maker. And this is one that the vast majority of people do not know. 40 00:03:25.440 --> 00:03:30.880 This is where the creators, this is where the entrepreneurs, this is where people who have to 41 00:03:30.960 --> 00:03:36.400 make big things who build stuff get the highest returns on their time. The vast majority of 42 00:03:36.400 --> 00:03:42.080 entrepreneurs at some point have some or all of their time that's dedicated to making stuff. 43 00:03:42.080 --> 00:03:46.720 This is the deep work. This is the stuff that moved the big ball forward. There are often tasks 44 00:03:46.720 --> 00:03:51.760 that are not urgent but incredibly important. And when you look back on your month or your quarter 45 00:03:51.760 --> 00:03:55.840 or your year, the few things that you remember that actually moved the ball forward that actually 46 00:03:55.840 --> 00:04:02.480 moved your business forward in the long term were these chunks of work. Now, the problem is 47 00:04:03.200 --> 00:04:08.480 most entrepreneurs do not have the time and do not have the system for maximizing that time 48 00:04:08.480 --> 00:04:14.000 of important work. Because fundamentally, if those are the footholds that allow you to push 49 00:04:14.000 --> 00:04:18.160 yourself forward towards your goal, then you want as many of those as possible. The difficulty is 50 00:04:18.160 --> 00:04:22.720 that it's never urgent. This is like if you're a coder and you need to develop software. Obviously, 51 00:04:22.720 --> 00:04:26.000 if that software is developed, that's the most valuable thing you can do. If you're an editor and 52 00:04:26.000 --> 00:04:30.800 you make videos, then actually adding the video so that it can get out in media is the most important 53 00:04:30.800 --> 00:04:35.280 thing that you can do. If you write copy for emails or you're an author and you write books, 54 00:04:35.280 --> 00:04:38.400 you actually writing the book and actually doing the work of the book is the most important 55 00:04:38.400 --> 00:04:43.520 thing that you can do. All of those things are maker work. You create something that before this 56 00:04:43.520 --> 00:04:49.120 did not exist. Although this work is important, it's incredibly expensive in terms of time. And the 57 00:04:49.120 --> 00:04:54.240 problem is the vast majority of the world works on manager time, not on maker time. So let me explain 58 00:04:54.240 --> 00:04:59.680 the difference. So for the maker, when you get into maker mode, instead of many small slippers, 59 00:04:59.680 --> 00:05:05.840 like the manager has, you have only a few large chunks. And the reason for that is because if you put 60 00:05:05.840 --> 00:05:12.320 a meeting or you interrupt a four hour long block, then you often can't get back to the work that 61 00:05:12.320 --> 00:05:16.800 you were doing before. Also, if you know that you have a block that's coming, you can't 62 00:05:17.440 --> 00:05:20.640 get into the flow because you know that you're going to have to get out of the flow. 63 00:05:20.640 --> 00:05:24.880 And so this is like the end of day meeting that kills you. This is called the Zegornik effect. 64 00:05:24.880 --> 00:05:29.280 It's that we tend to remember open loops and meetings are open loops because you have to 65 00:05:29.280 --> 00:05:33.440 sit timer so you don't forget it. You have to start setting a timer before the timer to start 66 00:05:33.440 --> 00:05:37.200 wrapping up. Even if you're cruising right now, then you start thinking about the meeting and what 67 00:05:37.200 --> 00:05:40.720 you have to prepare for that meeting. And now you're not thinking about your own work. And this 68 00:05:40.720 --> 00:05:46.720 eats up your brain power and saps your ability to make, unlike the manager where the decisions, 69 00:05:46.720 --> 00:05:51.920 the direction and the coordination is the output of their work, for the maker, the stuff, 70 00:05:51.920 --> 00:05:58.320 the things they build, the things they make is the output of their time. And so instead of working 71 00:05:58.320 --> 00:06:05.280 on meetings, they work off meetings. They work on projects that can't get done in 30 minutes. 72 00:06:05.280 --> 00:06:10.480 Sometimes those projects last weeks, months, quarters until they're done. And so the way that 73 00:06:10.480 --> 00:06:15.920 that work actually looks is that most makers have a set start time, but variable end times. So 74 00:06:15.920 --> 00:06:20.720 unlike the manager where they know when they start and they know when they finish, most makers work 75 00:06:20.720 --> 00:06:24.720 open to goal. If you've ever lost yourself in your work and you're like, man, I just want to keep 76 00:06:24.720 --> 00:06:30.320 riding this high. I want to keep riding this flow. That's what it feels like to make. You want to 77 00:06:30.400 --> 00:06:35.520 stay in there as long as you possibly can. And that's why having no cap on the day allows you to 78 00:06:35.520 --> 00:06:41.280 get lost in the work and produce more than you ever could. So if you have only large time chunks, 79 00:06:41.280 --> 00:06:47.280 that means that you only have one or two per day. Sometimes three if you're working 18 hours. 80 00:06:47.280 --> 00:06:51.280 And so that means you usually have a morning block and a post lunch block. Now if you're somebody 81 00:06:51.280 --> 00:06:55.920 who likes to also work after dinner, then you have a post dinner block. So you basically have three, 82 00:06:55.920 --> 00:07:01.520 four to six hour chunks per day. That's it. And on a sustainable basis, most people just have two 83 00:07:01.520 --> 00:07:08.560 per day. And so if someone takes one meeting in the morning, they blew one of your 10 work blocks per 84 00:07:08.560 --> 00:07:14.400 week, if you only work five days a week. And so someone's taking 10% of your total output by having 85 00:07:14.400 --> 00:07:20.160 one meeting. The issue is that that manager who's working on manager time puts that thing in and 86 00:07:20.160 --> 00:07:24.800 for them, they're becoming more productive, but they're destroying your productivity. When this 87 00:07:24.880 --> 00:07:30.960 happens is when you finish your day, feel like you look back and know that all your time was spent, 88 00:07:30.960 --> 00:07:35.120 but you got no return on it. You have nothing to show for it. And if you feel like you have that 89 00:07:35.120 --> 00:07:40.560 happen again, and again, and again, this is how businesses stay small. This is how entrepreneurs 90 00:07:40.560 --> 00:07:46.160 fail to grow. This is how they relive the same six months, same 12 months, same two years over and 91 00:07:46.160 --> 00:07:51.760 over and over again, because they do not know how to invest their time for the maker. An 92 00:07:51.760 --> 00:07:58.640 empty time slot is not a lost opportunity. The empty time block is the opportunity to get the 93 00:07:58.640 --> 00:08:03.520 return. If you're a maker, you understand I'm about to share with you. If you look at your calendar 94 00:08:03.520 --> 00:08:08.080 and see that you have literally nothing on there, you have no meetings, you have no nothing, it's just 95 00:08:08.080 --> 00:08:12.080 empty until the end of the day. How much energy are you filled with? You're like, oh my god, I'm going 96 00:08:12.080 --> 00:08:16.000 to crush this day. There's all this this big project. I want to sink my teeth into it. I'm going to 97 00:08:16.000 --> 00:08:20.880 be able to take a huge chunk out of it. That energy that you get is because that is a maximally 98 00:08:20.880 --> 00:08:26.640 productive day is an empty calendar rather than a filled calendar. For context, when I was writing my 99 00:08:26.640 --> 00:08:34.000 book, my days every day were just writing the book. I told my team that that's all I was going to 100 00:08:34.000 --> 00:08:37.440 be doing. Now you're like, but don't you run this portfolio of all these companies and there's all 101 00:08:37.440 --> 00:08:41.120 this money and these deals and decisions that have to happen. The answer is yes. When I show you my 102 00:08:41.120 --> 00:08:49.040 calendar, it all makes sense. Literally, diametrically opposed calendars are both maximally allocated 103 00:08:49.040 --> 00:08:53.920 to invest time to get the highest returns on it in terms of money. The big problem is when 104 00:08:53.920 --> 00:08:58.640 the two need to interact because if you just had makers making and you just had managers managing 105 00:08:58.640 --> 00:09:04.080 everyone to be happy, the problem is when managers manage makers and they have to meet. 106 00:09:05.440 --> 00:09:10.160 So when a manager doesn't know how makers work, they kill the productivity of their team. Managers 107 00:09:10.160 --> 00:09:16.080 often assume that makers can work like they do on demand. They think it's hey, it's just 30 minutes 108 00:09:16.080 --> 00:09:19.680 and you've got free time. What's the big deal? I looked at your calendar. You have nothing all day. 109 00:09:19.680 --> 00:09:24.560 You're barely even working because they're using their measuring stick of work, their way a calendar 110 00:09:24.560 --> 00:09:29.920 looks when they're maximally effective and then transposing that on top of the makers calendar and 111 00:09:29.920 --> 00:09:34.560 thinking these two are the same when they couldn't be more different. For a manager, a short meeting 112 00:09:34.560 --> 00:09:40.080 costs one work unit, which is maybe 15 minutes and for them, they've got 20 plus per day so they can 113 00:09:40.080 --> 00:09:45.760 easily spare one. Whereas if they take one from a maker, they take one of the two time slots you 114 00:09:45.760 --> 00:09:50.480 have per day and sometimes you take both based on what the topic of the meeting is. If you say, 115 00:09:50.480 --> 00:09:54.880 hey, we're going to do your quarterly performance as an employee at two o'clock in the afternoon, 116 00:09:54.880 --> 00:09:58.400 the likelihood that the employee leading up to that is going to be able to think about the work 117 00:09:58.400 --> 00:10:01.040 that they're going to do when they're worried about their job or they're worried about their 118 00:10:01.040 --> 00:10:04.480 performance all day long. And then afterwards, the thinking about what they said and what they 119 00:10:04.480 --> 00:10:09.360 could have said differently, that day's shot to make matters worse. If a maker is falling behind, 120 00:10:09.360 --> 00:10:14.000 the manager's solution is to interrupt them more, which creates a vicious cycle. This means 121 00:10:14.000 --> 00:10:18.720 managers prevent the work that they check in on. So by checking in on them, they disrupt the maker's 122 00:10:18.720 --> 00:10:23.040 work so that they can't actually make during the time slot to check in if they're actually working 123 00:10:23.040 --> 00:10:27.600 because the manager works while on meetings where the maker works when they're off meetings. 124 00:10:27.600 --> 00:10:32.080 And when this happens and it happens often, both parties lose and this is the main point. 125 00:10:32.080 --> 00:10:36.480 The manager loses because the maker is not making what they need to be making and the manager's 126 00:10:36.480 --> 00:10:41.760 responsible for some level of output. So both people aren't making the best returns on their time. 127 00:10:41.760 --> 00:10:46.160 This is why this is important for managers and important for makers. So if you are on a team, 128 00:10:46.160 --> 00:10:50.960 share this with your boss, share this with your teammates so that this can become more common 129 00:10:50.960 --> 00:10:57.120 in the lexicon. All my companies understand and use this language. If you ask as a manager for 130 00:10:57.120 --> 00:11:04.400 a maker to make time for you, they either want to offend the manager by saying, no, I can't do 131 00:11:04.480 --> 00:11:09.360 that because I'm working and the managers like, well, I see that you have an empty time lock and 132 00:11:09.360 --> 00:11:13.280 I outrank you or even if you're peers, it's like, what do you mean you're not going to give me that 133 00:11:13.280 --> 00:11:18.800 time? I see that it's empty. By refusing them, they offend and they can incur other risks by making 134 00:11:18.800 --> 00:11:24.000 that, you know, offense and declining the invitation. This oftentimes damages the relationship and 135 00:11:24.000 --> 00:11:28.720 decreases the likelihood of collaboration in the future, which they might need. You as a maker 136 00:11:28.720 --> 00:11:33.680 might need the buying of that manager. And so you risk losing that goodwill by declining the 137 00:11:33.680 --> 00:11:38.640 invitation. But by doing so, if you accept the invitation to destroy the morning, right? And so 138 00:11:39.280 --> 00:11:45.760 option one, piss someone off, option two, destroy half your day, a very terrible proposition. 139 00:11:45.760 --> 00:11:51.120 And the crazy part is that even if you accept that meeting, oftentimes the yield from that meeting 140 00:11:51.120 --> 00:11:56.400 is nothing because the person you had the, do you have five minutes, didn't really have an agenda, 141 00:11:56.400 --> 00:12:00.720 didn't really have a plan and just basically said, I'm just going to steal your morning from you 142 00:12:00.720 --> 00:12:04.560 and give you nothing back. By the way, this totally applies to the networking stuff too. If you're like, 143 00:12:04.560 --> 00:12:09.760 hey, let me introduce you to John. He's in the area. You guys should meet for coffee. Does 10 AM work? 144 00:12:09.760 --> 00:12:14.960 I'm like, yeah, let's just destroy everything, right? Let's just light my whole day on fire so that 145 00:12:14.960 --> 00:12:19.920 I can meet John, who you think I have synergies with. Maybe there's potential for collaboration. 146 00:12:19.920 --> 00:12:24.560 Let's explore opportunities together. You know what's crazy? I know what I need to do to make more 147 00:12:24.560 --> 00:12:32.080 money and I just need to do that. I get asked all the time about what's the one habit that you have 148 00:12:32.080 --> 00:12:40.480 that has been the highest, you know, predictor of your success. And I really genuinely believe 149 00:12:40.480 --> 00:12:47.600 that it has been this is that I have been ruthless with my time. Everyone who knows me knows that 150 00:12:47.600 --> 00:12:53.520 I am a dick with my time. And the thing is is that I've been able to maintain relationships because 151 00:12:53.520 --> 00:12:59.200 during that maker time where I say no to everyone else, I keep moving shit forward because I have a 152 00:12:59.200 --> 00:13:03.520 fundamental belief that as long as I continue to achieve and I continue to make things that are 153 00:13:03.520 --> 00:13:09.600 valuable for the world, those meetings, those connections, those synergies, that friend dinner will 154 00:13:09.600 --> 00:13:14.800 always be there. And that has proven right in my life. And in the beginning, it was the hardest 155 00:13:14.800 --> 00:13:19.280 because I didn't have the accomplishments to show for it, but I truly believed. I was like, I know 156 00:13:19.360 --> 00:13:24.320 that if I can get this stuff done and I do it every single day for a year, two years, three years, 157 00:13:24.320 --> 00:13:29.200 five years, if every day I move the ball forward, that's the thing at the end of the month when I 158 00:13:29.200 --> 00:13:32.960 look back on what I actually accomplished. A hundred percent of it is stuff that I accomplished during 159 00:13:32.960 --> 00:13:38.240 maker time, not manager time. And so once I realized that the maker time was where everything, 160 00:13:38.240 --> 00:13:43.440 all the speed of me moving towards my goal was getting accomplished, then I spent the rest of my time 161 00:13:43.440 --> 00:13:48.320 trying to optimize my life and create a system around this that allowed me to do as much of that as 162 00:13:48.320 --> 00:13:55.840 I possibly could. And to be clear, there are roles in the business like if you're CEO or COO from 163 00:13:55.840 --> 00:13:59.840 an operator perspective, you're going to have more one-on-ones. You're going to have more team 164 00:13:59.840 --> 00:14:04.480 trainings. You're going to have more coordination and decision making. That's required. But you just 165 00:14:04.480 --> 00:14:08.960 have to be clear that you're not not doing your job by not having maker time. It's just that your 166 00:14:08.960 --> 00:14:13.760 job is the manager stuff. And then the maker time you have is to get more leverage on the 167 00:14:13.760 --> 00:14:19.520 remainder of your manager time. And so Layla has a different schedule than I do. She still has 168 00:14:19.520 --> 00:14:24.240 maker time, but it's probably inverted in terms of her schedule. For her, she has probably one 169 00:14:24.240 --> 00:14:30.720 maker day per week and four manager days where I have four maker days per week and one manager day. 170 00:14:30.720 --> 00:14:36.080 And so you can have an inverted schedule. But the important thing is that she has to have that 171 00:14:36.080 --> 00:14:40.560 maker day because it's what gets her leverage, gets her higher returns on the other four days of the 172 00:14:40.640 --> 00:14:46.400 week. And then for me, I have to still do that manager day because it gives me leverage on all the 173 00:14:46.400 --> 00:14:50.640 organizational decisions that have to happen throughout the whole portfolio. You have to get out 174 00:14:50.640 --> 00:14:56.480 of the either or thinking and think which of these styles is best for me in this particular moment. 175 00:14:56.480 --> 00:15:01.280 But I can promise you that you do have elements of both when most people have elements of neither, 176 00:15:01.280 --> 00:15:05.760 which is why they never move forward. So I think I've accurately described the problem here. 177 00:15:05.760 --> 00:15:09.520 Makers and managers work differently. These guys want empty calendars. These guys want filled 178 00:15:09.520 --> 00:15:13.520 calendars when they interact. One person destroys the other person time and it's a disproportionate 179 00:15:13.520 --> 00:15:18.400 trade. And when things get bad, they get even worse because the managers interrupt the makers even 180 00:15:18.400 --> 00:15:22.800 more and the makers trying to be polite because they don't want to turn down invitations. Just make 181 00:15:22.800 --> 00:15:27.120 their lives worse and worse and they have to work longer and longer hours, lose sleep, lose family 182 00:15:27.120 --> 00:15:31.680 time, lose their weekends so that they can just keep up with their work without pissing anyone off. 183 00:15:31.680 --> 00:15:36.720 And so let's talk about a different way to do this. Hey guys, real quick, if you want to sponsor 184 00:15:36.720 --> 00:15:42.480 this podcast, all you have to do is share it. All right. So if you can share this by sending it 185 00:15:42.480 --> 00:15:48.240 to someone via text or DMing it to somebody or posting on your stories and you can say maker or 186 00:15:48.240 --> 00:15:52.560 manager, I will share it onto my story. I share as many of them as I can. You guys have probably seen 187 00:15:52.560 --> 00:15:57.040 it on Instagram. But I think that the one that's really meaningful is share it in Slack with your 188 00:15:57.040 --> 00:16:01.520 company and have people listen to it. You know, DM it to your managers, DM it to your makers because 189 00:16:01.520 --> 00:16:08.000 I think I think this could actually nudge the world of work one inch over. And if we did that, 190 00:16:08.000 --> 00:16:11.840 I think that could make a lot of people's lives better and make a lot of entrepreneurs more money. 191 00:16:12.640 --> 00:16:17.840 So I use something called a three pronged approach for the solutions. And that's because you have 192 00:16:17.840 --> 00:16:23.200 to address it from all angles. It's not just saying, hey, makers deal with it. Hey, managers do 193 00:16:23.200 --> 00:16:28.240 something different. Hey, organizations, you have to attack it from all three directions. 194 00:16:28.240 --> 00:16:31.920 You've got the managers, you've got what the makers should do differently and then you've got 195 00:16:31.920 --> 00:16:37.280 the organization overall. So you've got all three of these parties that you have to accommodate. 196 00:16:38.960 --> 00:16:45.840 To the managers, step one, understand both the costs that you put on the maker. The first cost 197 00:16:45.840 --> 00:16:51.360 is the cost of coordinating times while they work. So they're trying to work right now before you 198 00:16:51.360 --> 00:16:55.280 coordinate the time that you're also going to disrupt them. So you disrupt them while they're 199 00:16:55.280 --> 00:16:59.840 working and then you disrupt them at the meeting that you're trying to plan. So you disrupt them 200 00:16:59.840 --> 00:17:05.120 twice. Secondly, and once you have that time set aside, understand that the time itself eats an 201 00:17:05.120 --> 00:17:10.240 entire work block itself and you have to know the difference between your work and the maker's work. 202 00:17:10.240 --> 00:17:16.080 And when you ask for a meeting, it costs them 10 times more. You use up one of their 10 time slots 203 00:17:16.080 --> 00:17:22.240 per week, whereas you use up only one of your hundred or more time slots. So when you choose to make 204 00:17:22.240 --> 00:17:27.680 an appointment or choose to make a meeting, be sure that it's worth it, especially if it's an 205 00:17:27.680 --> 00:17:33.200 ad hoc or impromptu. If you have a set cadence of communication, if it can wait until that time and 206 00:17:33.200 --> 00:17:37.840 you got to be really real with yourself, can it wait? Is this just a convenience thing for me or a 207 00:17:37.840 --> 00:17:43.920 preference? If it is, then don't destroy the poor man or poor woman's time. Step two, understand 208 00:17:43.920 --> 00:17:48.560 the value of the makers know. And this is something that I hopefully becomes incorporated in your 209 00:17:48.560 --> 00:17:53.680 lexicon at your business is that this is a makers know, not a not a real world know. It's a makers 210 00:17:53.680 --> 00:17:59.360 know is that if a maker declines a meeting, don't take offense. See, does them actually trying to 211 00:17:59.360 --> 00:18:04.240 keep their larger commitment to you, the company and other people to get the meaningful work they 212 00:18:04.240 --> 00:18:08.800 need to get done done? And so this means you don't get offended. This means you don't, you know, 213 00:18:08.800 --> 00:18:13.680 hold back the promotion or say that they're not being productive because they keep turning down 214 00:18:13.680 --> 00:18:17.360 meetings. If someone turns down the meeting, it's because they're doing something that they can 215 00:18:17.360 --> 00:18:21.840 accurately say this is more important than that. Now, if you as a manager say, I know that you 216 00:18:21.840 --> 00:18:26.320 have this is going to destroy the morning in terms of your productivity, but I think it is worth 217 00:18:26.320 --> 00:18:30.800 your time to be on this because we need your insight, then you can frame it that way and then you 218 00:18:30.800 --> 00:18:34.640 can give the maker the time to prep for that meeting if it is literally of that importance. 219 00:18:34.640 --> 00:18:39.520 Step three for managers is actually ask your team what an ideal day would look like for them. 220 00:18:39.520 --> 00:18:44.160 Like what's a maximum productive day look like and allow them the time to give you the response. 221 00:18:44.240 --> 00:18:48.640 And I suggest following that to the greatest degree possible so that you can actually help them be 222 00:18:48.640 --> 00:18:56.160 the most productive. And so for example, for us, our media team leaders asked the editing team 223 00:18:56.160 --> 00:19:00.480 underneath of them, hey, what's the perfect day for you guys? What's a perfect weekly calendar look 224 00:19:00.480 --> 00:19:04.240 like? And as a team, they were like, well, if we could just bunch all the meetings here and we 225 00:19:04.240 --> 00:19:08.080 could have all the rest of the days free, that'd be awesome. And then if we had, it was like, okay, 226 00:19:08.080 --> 00:19:12.320 what about when we coordinate? It's okay. Well, we'll have specific coordination times that we keep 227 00:19:12.400 --> 00:19:17.280 for brainstorming sessions and things like that. But beyond that, we keep everyone's calendars empty. 228 00:19:17.280 --> 00:19:22.880 And so that way, as a team, you as a manager also can have fewer meetings so that you can 229 00:19:22.880 --> 00:19:26.720 fill out with other meetings that aren't makers, right? So you can do more leading, more directing, 230 00:19:26.720 --> 00:19:31.360 more encouraging, more persuading, more training, and then let the makers make. And we've also 231 00:19:31.360 --> 00:19:35.120 realized, and I think you will break your own belief around this as soon as you start doing this, 232 00:19:35.120 --> 00:19:39.040 that a lot of work doesn't have to be done at the same time. Everyone doesn't need to work on 233 00:19:39.040 --> 00:19:43.360 the same thing at the same moment to get the most done as long as everything gets done by this 234 00:19:43.360 --> 00:19:49.440 period of time. Now, this video isn't the protect the makers video. This is for all businesses and 235 00:19:49.440 --> 00:19:57.440 all business owners. So let's talk to the makers now. Step one, good managers want to help you. 236 00:19:57.440 --> 00:20:03.360 So let them tell them how you work. This is you communicating to them. Send this piece of content 237 00:20:03.360 --> 00:20:09.120 to them to help them help you. And yes, you will have to take meetings that eat your entire day 238 00:20:09.120 --> 00:20:13.680 sometimes. It's part of the job. You have to work with other people because your project would never 239 00:20:13.680 --> 00:20:18.400 see the light of day without marketing, marketing it, sales selling it, product delivering it, 240 00:20:18.400 --> 00:20:23.840 and everything else that happens in between. It's a team. And so if your manager is going to choose 241 00:20:23.840 --> 00:20:28.480 to put a time block in the middle of your morning or the middle of your afternoon, then switch that 242 00:20:28.480 --> 00:20:34.000 whole block into a manager schedule. Fight fire with fire. And try to knock out as many meetings as 243 00:20:34.000 --> 00:20:39.520 you can in that formerly free time. So that means that, okay, if I know that I'm going to have this 244 00:20:39.520 --> 00:20:44.080 one time slot that's killed my big chunk, well, then let's slice that baby into as many chunks as I 245 00:20:44.080 --> 00:20:49.040 can and get all the other ad hoc and prompt meetings done that morning so that I now switch to a 246 00:20:49.040 --> 00:20:53.680 maxly productive manager. And so the thing is, is that you don't want to identify as one or the 247 00:20:53.680 --> 00:20:59.440 other, you just want your calendar to reflect the nature of the work. And so the point here isn't 248 00:20:59.440 --> 00:21:04.800 to have two camps of makers and managers is to understand what type of productivity system you're 249 00:21:04.800 --> 00:21:09.040 installing for that period of time on your calendar. Because especially if you're an entrepreneur, 250 00:21:09.040 --> 00:21:15.360 you've got to wear both. Step two for makers. Have standard meeting times where you accept meetings. 251 00:21:15.360 --> 00:21:22.240 So you say, hey, you know, Monday and Thursday afternoons is when I have all of my meetings 252 00:21:22.240 --> 00:21:26.880 times open. So whenever someone requests a meeting, ask them if they can make it in those times. 253 00:21:26.880 --> 00:21:30.800 And this is where when you get into the organization, if everyone has those times, then everyone's 254 00:21:30.800 --> 00:21:34.160 on maker schedules for those time blocks. And then it becomes more efficient at an organizational 255 00:21:34.160 --> 00:21:39.200 level, which I'll get to in a second. It's rare that a meeting is truly urgent. So if you can push 256 00:21:39.200 --> 00:21:43.360 them off to this designated blocks that you said ahead of time, you will make a lot more money 257 00:21:43.360 --> 00:21:47.760 with the time that you have remaining. And you want to make this time available to anyone who meets 258 00:21:47.760 --> 00:21:52.960 with you on a regular basis and add some empty time slots or leave some empty time slots in that 259 00:21:52.960 --> 00:21:56.880 maker meetings for the ad hoc meetings that inevitably come up. I would say I've gone through 260 00:21:56.880 --> 00:22:03.360 three distinct periods of understanding this maker manager concept and using it to great success. 261 00:22:03.360 --> 00:22:08.000 The first one is you basically have to do nights and weekends in early mornings in order to get 262 00:22:08.000 --> 00:22:12.800 your maker time in, but you have to do it. And so when I was doing this as a gym owner, so a small 263 00:22:12.880 --> 00:22:17.520 business owner, I would wake up and I would like work on ad copy and work on ads, which is like 264 00:22:17.520 --> 00:22:24.240 deep work that I'd have to do. And then I'd step into the gym at 9 a.m. and start taking sales calls 265 00:22:24.240 --> 00:22:29.440 or take training sessions or have to have one on ones with my trainers. Like I worked like a regular 266 00:22:29.440 --> 00:22:33.440 person with fires and people interrupting me all day because I was running a small business. 267 00:22:33.440 --> 00:22:38.800 And so if you need to make sure that that maker work gets done, then you need to find one block 268 00:22:38.800 --> 00:22:42.880 that's usually at the very beginning of the day or the very end of the day if you're the entrepreneur 269 00:22:42.880 --> 00:22:46.640 and no one cares about your time in the beginning. If I had not done that, I don't think I ever would 270 00:22:46.640 --> 00:22:50.880 have gotten out of one location. I would never have been able to build the systems that it takes. 271 00:22:50.880 --> 00:22:54.560 Like how do you build the training system to get trainers on? You do it in maker time. How do you 272 00:22:54.560 --> 00:22:58.080 build the nutrition system that you're going to use for your whole location? You do it during 273 00:22:58.080 --> 00:23:01.840 maker time. How are you going to run an advertising system for creating ads and writing copy on a 274 00:23:01.840 --> 00:23:07.040 regular basis? You do that during maker time, not during manager time. And so to build the assets 275 00:23:07.040 --> 00:23:12.000 that I could build the business on top of to build the enterprise, I had to do that in uninterrupted 276 00:23:12.000 --> 00:23:15.920 time chunks. And the problem was everybody went in trouble my time. And to be fair, they could 277 00:23:15.920 --> 00:23:20.400 because I didn't have my time wasn't super valuable in the beginning. Over time, you'll begin to 278 00:23:20.400 --> 00:23:25.440 have people who can start protecting your time for you. So for a big chunk of my career, as I started 279 00:23:25.440 --> 00:23:31.280 to make more and more money, the first half of every day until noon or 1 p.m. was always wide open 280 00:23:31.280 --> 00:23:35.280 because I do my best work in the morning. And then once I've kind of used up my creative juice, 281 00:23:35.280 --> 00:23:39.120 I can do the coordination and meetings and things like that. Now, I'll give you a second 282 00:23:39.120 --> 00:23:43.440 pro tip on this, which is if that is the way that you want to plan your calendar, let's call 283 00:23:43.440 --> 00:23:49.760 yourself an intermediate entrepreneur, start planning your day back to front. So what I mean by 284 00:23:49.760 --> 00:23:54.800 that is someone wants a meeting, you start at, it ends at five and starts at four. If someone 285 00:23:54.800 --> 00:23:59.360 else wants a meeting, then you say it ends at four and starts at three thirty. And you work your 286 00:23:59.360 --> 00:24:04.640 calendar from back to front. That way your front of the day is still the most open you possibly can 287 00:24:04.640 --> 00:24:08.800 have it. Now, you'll still suffer from the quote Zegornik effect, but you still have a very large 288 00:24:08.800 --> 00:24:14.320 chunk of uninterrupted time. And by doing it this way, you avoid those empty dead times, really 289 00:24:14.320 --> 00:24:18.400 like great, I have 45 minutes between two meetings. Like, what am I going to do now? And you're like, 290 00:24:18.400 --> 00:24:22.720 I guess I'll just have a snack. So if you have less means than you work double time, you work on 291 00:24:22.720 --> 00:24:26.960 your clients time and then you do your work in off hours. So like I was saying in my early days, 292 00:24:27.600 --> 00:24:33.280 by doing that morning, five days a week, and then I would work both shifts on the weekends, 293 00:24:33.280 --> 00:24:36.880 I would get four on the weekends, I get a morning and an afternoon on Saturday and Sunday that I could 294 00:24:36.880 --> 00:24:41.280 put makeup time in. And then I get five blocks during the week. And so this still gave me nine 295 00:24:41.280 --> 00:24:46.640 makers blocks per week to move big stuff forward. That's a full time job. But the key here if you're 296 00:24:46.640 --> 00:24:51.360 noticing is that yes, you work double because you have to work the job that you're currently doing 297 00:24:51.360 --> 00:24:56.560 to make money. And then you work the next job to get out of the job you're in. So the V1 of this 298 00:24:56.560 --> 00:25:01.920 is you have to make makeup time. The V2 of this is, I think, is the 50-50 split. The first half of 299 00:25:01.920 --> 00:25:05.680 your day is maker. The second half of your day is manager and you work it from back to front. 300 00:25:05.680 --> 00:25:10.640 That's the V2 version. The V3 version, which is what I do currently right now, is that I have entire 301 00:25:10.640 --> 00:25:15.760 maker days. So I have two, three, four days per week that are just maker days. And then I have 302 00:25:15.760 --> 00:25:21.600 a manager day where I stack that hot on my meetings, introductions, you know, coordination, 303 00:25:21.600 --> 00:25:26.080 decisions, quarterly meetings with portfolio companies, all of that type of stuff happens on those 304 00:25:26.080 --> 00:25:30.720 days back to back. So I don't feel unproductive at the end of the day because I know going into it, 305 00:25:30.720 --> 00:25:34.640 I'm not going to do any maker work. I'm just going to crush as many meetings as I can. 306 00:25:34.640 --> 00:25:39.440 Step three, communicate about how you're going to communicate. Tell people when you're going to be 307 00:25:39.440 --> 00:25:45.040 slow to respond specifically during your maker's box. So people have an amazing ability to adapt 308 00:25:45.040 --> 00:25:49.840 if you tell them ahead of time. People really only get upset when you have unmet expectations. They 309 00:25:49.840 --> 00:25:53.600 expect you to respond immediately and then you don't. And then they question if you're working when 310 00:25:53.600 --> 00:25:59.120 the reality is that's why you're working is the fact that you're not responding. So change them. 311 00:25:59.200 --> 00:26:02.480 So let everyone know that this is how you work and this is when you're going to be responsive. 312 00:26:02.480 --> 00:26:05.840 And if you do have that time period where you say you're going to be responsive, 313 00:26:05.840 --> 00:26:11.040 then be responsive, which leads to step four, actually work when you say you will. If you have 314 00:26:11.040 --> 00:26:15.440 the luxury of having people who respect your time and respect your schedule and understand this 315 00:26:15.440 --> 00:26:21.680 maker manager dynamic, then you owe it to them as a maker to not waste your time. Because if you 316 00:26:21.680 --> 00:26:26.400 don't, you will confirm their suspicions this whole time that you've been goofing off all day 317 00:26:26.400 --> 00:26:30.240 because you're not actually working. And that's what the vast majority of managers think when 318 00:26:30.240 --> 00:26:33.680 they look at your calendar and see that it's empty is that you're not actually doing anything. 319 00:26:33.680 --> 00:26:38.240 And what you don't want to do is prove them right. So I covered what you have to think about as 320 00:26:38.240 --> 00:26:42.720 a manager, right? You want to understand this lingo, you want to understand how makers work and 321 00:26:42.720 --> 00:26:46.720 you want to try and respect that and empower them to the greatest degree possible. As a maker, 322 00:26:46.720 --> 00:26:49.840 you also want to understand that you work within an organization. There are times that you're 323 00:26:49.840 --> 00:26:53.760 going to have to take meetings. If you do take meetings, you want to block that time and then crush 324 00:26:53.760 --> 00:26:57.360 as many meetings as you possibly can, be responsive when you say you're going to be responsive 325 00:26:57.360 --> 00:27:01.280 and then work like a madman during the times that you actually have empty time slots on your calendar. 326 00:27:01.280 --> 00:27:05.440 Great. So we have both of those covered. But how do we install this into an organization so that we 327 00:27:05.440 --> 00:27:09.680 can make this cannon so that we can make this standard? And this is what I'm hoping across many 328 00:27:09.680 --> 00:27:15.280 organizations. So if I can use my platform to like help businesses make more money and help people 329 00:27:15.280 --> 00:27:20.080 actually enjoy their work more than like can't think of a higher return on my time than doing that 330 00:27:20.080 --> 00:27:25.920 across thousands and thousands of businesses. So as an organization, and this is if you're the 331 00:27:25.920 --> 00:27:32.400 entrepreneur who can make those decisions, step one, consider mandated quiet time on the calendar. 332 00:27:32.400 --> 00:27:38.080 So during these times entire teams can't message one another or meet. And so either make this a 333 00:27:38.800 --> 00:27:43.920 a time of day every day or make this entire days of the week. So for example, for us, 334 00:27:43.920 --> 00:27:48.240 Wednesdays are quiet days for the editing team. Like no one talks. There are no meetings. They can 335 00:27:48.240 --> 00:27:53.760 just crank on one or two big projects they want to work on throughout that day. And I want to be 336 00:27:53.760 --> 00:27:58.240 very clear on this caveat. It doesn't need to apply to the entire organization. Only the ones where 337 00:27:58.240 --> 00:28:03.520 you have makers, so think engineers, developers, copywriters, editors, builders, writers, presenters, 338 00:28:03.520 --> 00:28:09.040 media, whatever. The people who have to work on projects that require intense periods of time 339 00:28:09.040 --> 00:28:13.360 without interruption. The reason I think this is more important now than ever is because of remote 340 00:28:14.080 --> 00:28:19.040 work. Remote work has removed the transparency between someone working. And so I could walk 341 00:28:19.040 --> 00:28:24.560 I can walk around my office now and walk past the editing base and see people plugged in 342 00:28:24.560 --> 00:28:29.280 working on their computers editing. So I know they're editing even though their time block is empty 343 00:28:29.280 --> 00:28:32.960 if I just check their calendar. But in a remote setting, if I look at someone's calendar and see 344 00:28:32.960 --> 00:28:37.360 it's empty, but I have no way to check in on them or see them, then I don't know if they're 345 00:28:37.360 --> 00:28:41.760 actually working or if they're just like rock climbing. And so I have no way to know that. 346 00:28:41.760 --> 00:28:46.080 Then you think, okay, well, I'll just slack them. But by doing the slack message, you then 347 00:28:46.080 --> 00:28:50.240 disrupt them anyways. And if they're super responsive on slack, you feel like they're working. 348 00:28:50.240 --> 00:28:54.080 When the likelihood is that if they're really responsive on slack, they're not working. 349 00:28:54.080 --> 00:28:58.800 Because they're on slack. And so the real real is that if you're remote or the teams that you 350 00:28:58.800 --> 00:29:03.840 have that are doing making a remote, you have to have an element of trust. And you still need to 351 00:29:03.840 --> 00:29:08.240 measure on output. So you can give, I would say basically extend longer periods of trust where you 352 00:29:08.240 --> 00:29:12.400 say, hey, we have this big project. This is the deadline for that project. And then you want to 353 00:29:12.400 --> 00:29:16.800 remove as many obstacles as you possibly can to allow that person to work. And let's also be real. 354 00:29:16.800 --> 00:29:20.480 There have been days where I wake up and I'm like, I don't have it in me. Like wherever the magic 355 00:29:20.480 --> 00:29:25.760 is or the mues didn't show up to work today. Sometimes if you're a maker, then maybe see if you 356 00:29:25.760 --> 00:29:28.960 can get meetings on that day because you're like, dude, my brain's dead. Like I don't think I'm 357 00:29:28.960 --> 00:29:32.880 going to create anything today. But there are some days where I wake up and I feel like the touch 358 00:29:32.880 --> 00:29:37.440 of God is upon me and I'm like, oh my God, I think I actually can cure cancer today. And when that 359 00:29:37.440 --> 00:29:41.760 happens, then sometimes it's worth changing the meetings and saying, hey, man, I'm in the middle 360 00:29:41.760 --> 00:29:45.600 of something right now and I'm crushing it. Is there any way we can just meet later? You know, 361 00:29:45.600 --> 00:29:49.600 it's crazy. Most people when they get that message are like, sure, no problem. It wasn't urgent 362 00:29:49.600 --> 00:29:53.200 anyways. And sometimes they're like, you know what? We don't even need to reschedule the meeting. 363 00:29:53.200 --> 00:29:58.080 I actually handled it already. And so I would strongly encourage you as a maker to kind of 364 00:29:58.080 --> 00:30:02.960 keep a pulse on yourself and also managers to extend the time trust where you allow 365 00:30:03.040 --> 00:30:08.480 makers to make. Now, if they do not meet the deadlines and they are not meeting the output, 366 00:30:08.480 --> 00:30:12.320 then you need to be very clear about this is the trust that I'm extending to you. So what is the 367 00:30:12.320 --> 00:30:15.920 reason that you have for not getting this done? And real real, a lot of times you actually have 368 00:30:15.920 --> 00:30:19.600 to dig into their personal lives because that's usually the most anyways. As an entrepreneur, 369 00:30:19.600 --> 00:30:23.840 you're often going to have times where you're a maker and a times where you're a manager and being 370 00:30:23.840 --> 00:30:29.680 clear to your team about which hat you're wearing. So I literally say, hey, I'm putting my maker 371 00:30:29.680 --> 00:30:34.560 hat on today. Hey, manager hat before I step into something. And that gives me and them a 372 00:30:34.560 --> 00:30:39.520 mental cue to know how I'm operating for that day and kind of the rules of engagement. And by 373 00:30:39.520 --> 00:30:44.320 doing it that way, it sets all the expectations with one thing, one change of hat rather than 374 00:30:44.320 --> 00:30:50.480 we have to re-explain the rules every time. All right, before the last and most important point 375 00:30:50.480 --> 00:30:55.520 for organizations, let me show you my calendar and walk you through it. So right now, this is 376 00:30:56.480 --> 00:31:00.640 May. And so we had Memorial Day weekend on the 27th. So Monday was, I actually just took the day 377 00:31:00.640 --> 00:31:05.120 off. So it was a short week. Tuesday became my manager day instead of Mondays, which is normally 378 00:31:05.120 --> 00:31:09.360 one of days. And so I had a team meeting with my whole company. I had a 101 with my head of 379 00:31:09.360 --> 00:31:14.640 investment. He's the one who runs our deals. I had my executive meeting, which is just all the 380 00:31:14.640 --> 00:31:21.360 leaders in my company at acquisition.com. I had a 101 with my book manager. I had meeting with 381 00:31:21.440 --> 00:31:25.680 our workshop manager was, well, we wanted to touch base. And after that meeting, I said, let's not 382 00:31:25.680 --> 00:31:30.400 have this meeting anymore immediately after the meeting. So to be clear, like, I try to always 383 00:31:30.400 --> 00:31:34.320 audit like, do I need to do this again? Or is there a process or a person who can do this instead 384 00:31:34.320 --> 00:31:39.600 of me? And most times there is a processor person. After that, I had my school games Q&A. So I had 385 00:31:39.600 --> 00:31:44.080 once a week, I take a call with the school games and notice I do these calls that I have with 386 00:31:44.080 --> 00:31:48.560 customers on my meeting day because it's still an interruption and it to me, it feels the same. 387 00:31:48.560 --> 00:31:51.440 It's like, I hop on. I'm asking questions. I mean, it's your questions. I'm directing. I'm 388 00:31:51.440 --> 00:31:55.920 doing whatever. Then I had my marketing meeting for our internal marketing stuff. And that was it. 389 00:31:55.920 --> 00:32:00.320 I had a hair trim and then I had my gym. Now the other three days of the week. So Wednesday, Thursday, 390 00:32:00.320 --> 00:32:03.840 Friday, those three days, there's literally nothing on my calendar, except for an appointment with 391 00:32:03.840 --> 00:32:08.800 myself at four o'clock to go to the gym and get swole. That is it. There's nothing on there. And 392 00:32:08.800 --> 00:32:13.120 this is not like, I say, I want to show this because I want to show that one, it's possible. And 393 00:32:13.120 --> 00:32:18.480 that I think I've done pretty decently at allocating my time. And you just have to protect this with 394 00:32:18.480 --> 00:32:24.560 your life because it is your life. Like you have like understanding the direct relationship between 395 00:32:24.560 --> 00:32:32.560 time and money is what I think has given me a disproportionate return on both. So you'll also know, 396 00:32:32.560 --> 00:32:39.200 or I'll also know that on Wednesday was my whole company taking the day off for makers. Now when 397 00:32:39.200 --> 00:32:44.000 I say day off, I mean empty calendars for them and everyone knew across the company, no meetings on 398 00:32:44.000 --> 00:32:46.960 that day for makers. Now if you're a manager, you can do whatever you want because that's not how 399 00:32:46.960 --> 00:32:51.920 your day's productive. But for makers, all the managers respect on Wednesday is not going to happen. 400 00:32:51.920 --> 00:32:57.280 And so this way, I have a maximum productive week in terms of how I organize it and then also how 401 00:32:57.280 --> 00:33:02.720 the company organizes itself overall. There is meetings that happen all the time with the leadership, 402 00:33:02.720 --> 00:33:09.200 with my team and portfolio companies, with my media buyer and their media buyer, my portfolio 403 00:33:09.200 --> 00:33:14.400 operating partner and the CEOs of the companies that we own. All of those meetings, you'll note, 404 00:33:14.400 --> 00:33:19.680 none of them were on my calendar. At some point, I see the entrepreneurial journey as a relinquishing 405 00:33:19.680 --> 00:33:24.880 of control. And at every level of entrepreneurship, you need to learn a new level of giving up control. 406 00:33:24.880 --> 00:33:28.320 And so what's interesting is that when we get into entrepreneurship, we do it because we want freedom. 407 00:33:28.320 --> 00:33:32.320 But as soon as we do it to get freedom, we actually have absolute control over everything, 408 00:33:32.320 --> 00:33:36.320 because you have control of your solar printer now. Like you have no team, it's just you. 409 00:33:36.320 --> 00:33:40.400 But when you have control over everything, you actually don't have freedom. So you cannot have both 410 00:33:40.400 --> 00:33:44.240 absolute control and absolute freedom at the same time. And so if you want freedom, you have to 411 00:33:44.240 --> 00:33:48.960 relinquish control, you have to extend trust to people. Now those trusts can have guardrails and 412 00:33:48.960 --> 00:33:52.880 you can still have outputs that you measure people on and then you basically tighten up the reins 413 00:33:52.880 --> 00:33:57.280 if things don't go to plan. But as long as people are doing their job and meeting the outputs, 414 00:33:57.280 --> 00:34:00.720 then you can continue to kind of extend the leash. I don't really like the terminology, but you get 415 00:34:00.720 --> 00:34:05.520 the idea. And so at the end of every one of these meetings, I'm telling you, like if you could just 416 00:34:05.520 --> 00:34:10.000 put a little reminder to yourself, those do I need to do this again? Like does this meeting even 417 00:34:10.160 --> 00:34:14.560 need to occur again? And secondarily, is there somebody else or a system we can put in place to 418 00:34:14.560 --> 00:34:19.520 eliminate this altogether? Layla and I, she's even better about this because she has more meetings 419 00:34:19.520 --> 00:34:25.200 as an operator than I do. Every single week, she starts her week by looking at all of her meetings 420 00:34:25.200 --> 00:34:31.040 and deletes. She deletes first. And then on a quarterly basis, she looks at all recurring meetings 421 00:34:31.040 --> 00:34:35.760 and says, how do I, how can I change the time that's being allocated across the whole company? So 422 00:34:35.760 --> 00:34:40.000 she sees everyone's calendars and everyone's meetings. She does some rainman stuff where she says, 423 00:34:40.000 --> 00:34:43.120 I don't think we need to do this anymore. I think we can combine these two. I think you don't 424 00:34:43.120 --> 00:34:46.080 need to attend the, and she tells people, I don't think you need to attend this anymore. I don't 425 00:34:46.080 --> 00:34:50.640 think you need to attend this. And I think that's where a culture of meetings don't make you productive 426 00:34:50.640 --> 00:34:56.640 is a very important subline here for organizations in general. And you'll notice this with Elon Musk and 427 00:34:56.640 --> 00:35:00.480 pesos and some of these, these great entrepreneurs, they talk about this where they want to standardize, 428 00:35:00.480 --> 00:35:03.760 like, hey, you can get up in the middle of meeting and say, hey, I've just got stuff I need to do, 429 00:35:03.760 --> 00:35:08.080 and I don't think I'm relevant here. I don't think I'm adding value. That's you returning time to 430 00:35:08.080 --> 00:35:13.520 the company because this is the thing that everyone forgets is that let's say, let's say, you make 431 00:35:13.520 --> 00:35:22.160 $50,000 a year. That means that you make around $25 per hour in general. And so if you have, and let's 432 00:35:22.160 --> 00:35:27.200 say you've got some people are making $100,000 a year on the meeting. So that's $50 per hour. That 433 00:35:27.280 --> 00:35:32.720 means that if you have 10 people on that, on a, on a, on a one hour call, it's like, that was a 434 00:35:32.720 --> 00:35:41.120 $500 call or a $400 call. Now, if we took the whole team out to Chili's and we spent $400 on 435 00:35:41.120 --> 00:35:47.600 drinks and chips and whatever, it'd be considered a major expense, right? But every day, all the time, 436 00:35:47.600 --> 00:35:52.640 you're taking the whole team out to Chili's 10 times a day. This is why people stay poor because 437 00:35:52.640 --> 00:35:58.480 they don't know how to allocate time to get the highest returns. So let's walk through the last 438 00:35:58.480 --> 00:36:06.160 step for organizations to make this real to get the most out of everyone. Spread this concept to 439 00:36:06.160 --> 00:36:11.840 makers and managers alike so that everyone can use the same language to describe this larger 440 00:36:11.840 --> 00:36:18.400 source of waste and prevent it because if you were working with a maker manager schedule or 441 00:36:18.400 --> 00:36:22.400 everyone understands where people can get the highest returns of their time and your competition 442 00:36:22.480 --> 00:36:28.560 is not working this way. You'll get higher returns on human capital on the time you invest in people 443 00:36:28.560 --> 00:36:32.480 because they will be happier, they will stay longer, they will have higher output and the quality 444 00:36:32.480 --> 00:36:38.320 of their work will go up. So you'll both get higher quantity of work and higher quality of work 445 00:36:38.320 --> 00:36:43.440 both by changing how you allocate time and trying to actively remove as many makers as possible 446 00:36:43.440 --> 00:36:49.280 from meetings and also managers don't need to be there. And my goal with this video is to increase 447 00:36:49.360 --> 00:36:53.520 the awareness of these two types of working styles and put words to something that plagued me 448 00:36:53.520 --> 00:36:57.840 for a very long time. And so if you're listening to this and you're like this is music to my ears, 449 00:36:57.840 --> 00:37:01.600 this is what I've been trying to describe for such a long time and I have been able to put words 450 00:37:01.600 --> 00:37:06.400 to it. I made this for you so that I could put words to something that hopefully everyone else 451 00:37:06.400 --> 00:37:11.520 can use and distribute at a bargain on time. It's that you don't have to worry about making this thing, 452 00:37:11.520 --> 00:37:16.160 you can just send it so that people can understand it for you. And hopefully this gives words to the 453 00:37:16.160 --> 00:37:24.240 makers whose work moves the world and helps managers understand how expensive God a minute really is.