WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.840 Most of the nation, I was just on the co-creators of 2 00:00:02.840 --> 00:00:05.040 Christmas on commands podcast. 3 00:00:05.040 --> 00:00:06.600 They've over five million subscribers, 4 00:00:06.600 --> 00:00:08.640 and they had some very non-business, 5 00:00:08.640 --> 00:00:11.760 but business and money mindset questions specifically 6 00:00:11.760 --> 00:00:13.680 for me, those guys are doing a few million bucks here 7 00:00:13.680 --> 00:00:14.760 and felt very bored. 8 00:00:14.760 --> 00:00:18.440 And so it was a half coaching, half consulting call, 9 00:00:18.440 --> 00:00:19.800 and we talked about some really cool stuff. 10 00:00:19.800 --> 00:00:21.520 One, mindset's around money. 11 00:00:21.520 --> 00:00:23.080 Two, the difference between millionaires and billionaires 12 00:00:23.080 --> 00:00:24.040 and how they think about it. 13 00:00:24.040 --> 00:00:27.040 How to use money as a measuring stick the right way, 14 00:00:27.120 --> 00:00:30.680 and ultimately how to turn insecurity into motivation 15 00:00:30.680 --> 00:00:33.240 as fuel for the pursuits that you have, 16 00:00:33.240 --> 00:00:36.120 both happiness-wise and also wealth-wise. 17 00:00:36.120 --> 00:00:36.800 Enjoy. 18 00:00:36.800 --> 00:00:38.240 This is also part one. 19 00:00:39.120 --> 00:00:41.040 What I had done up to that point, 20 00:00:41.040 --> 00:00:43.480 and up and so maybe a couple of years ago was, 21 00:00:43.480 --> 00:00:47.920 I wanted to beat my father so badly at his game 22 00:00:47.920 --> 00:00:50.160 that he could not claim that I had not won. 23 00:00:50.160 --> 00:00:52.200 And so every aspect of my life 24 00:00:52.200 --> 00:00:55.360 has been built to be impenetrable. 25 00:00:55.360 --> 00:00:56.960 Welcome to the game where we talk about how to get 26 00:00:56.960 --> 00:00:58.720 more customers, how to make more customers, 27 00:00:58.720 --> 00:00:59.600 how to keep them longer, 28 00:00:59.600 --> 00:01:01.400 and the many failures and lessons we have learned 29 00:01:01.400 --> 00:01:02.240 along the way. 30 00:01:02.240 --> 00:01:04.640 I hope you enjoy and subscribe. 31 00:01:04.640 --> 00:01:05.960 I want to get to the life stuff. 32 00:01:05.960 --> 00:01:08.440 I definitely have a lot of questions, just personally, 33 00:01:08.440 --> 00:01:10.400 about what, you know, I'm confused 34 00:01:10.400 --> 00:01:11.960 if we should start with business or not. 35 00:01:11.960 --> 00:01:13.600 You can do it, you can do it, you can do it. 36 00:01:13.600 --> 00:01:14.600 All right, well, let's do it here, 37 00:01:14.600 --> 00:01:17.080 because this is the burning question that I have. 38 00:01:17.080 --> 00:01:19.520 I make, you know, a fraction, an order of magnitude 39 00:01:19.520 --> 00:01:20.800 less than what you make. 40 00:01:20.800 --> 00:01:24.040 But I really feel that I've solved my money problems 41 00:01:24.040 --> 00:01:26.640 with rare, rare exception. 42 00:01:26.640 --> 00:01:29.720 And so I am curious when I hear you talk, 43 00:01:29.720 --> 00:01:32.040 because you say all these things, 44 00:01:32.040 --> 00:01:33.040 and I have the same experiences, 45 00:01:33.040 --> 00:01:35.320 like I've given a lot of money for me to charity, 46 00:01:35.320 --> 00:01:37.280 and it has felt morally right, 47 00:01:37.280 --> 00:01:40.480 but I don't feel it in the same way. 48 00:01:40.480 --> 00:01:42.040 Like I know it's the right thing to do, 49 00:01:42.040 --> 00:01:43.200 but I'm not feeling it. 50 00:01:43.200 --> 00:01:45.840 So my question for you is, I guess there's two big ones. 51 00:01:45.840 --> 00:01:49.440 One, why continue to use money as a measuring stick? 52 00:01:49.440 --> 00:01:50.640 Is it like I, you're like, 53 00:01:50.640 --> 00:01:52.120 I'm gonna have a billion dollars or this, 54 00:01:52.120 --> 00:01:54.320 and the other thing, why has that remained? 55 00:01:54.320 --> 00:01:57.760 And then two, what are the milestones of money 56 00:01:57.760 --> 00:01:59.320 or things that you've been able to spend money on 57 00:01:59.320 --> 00:02:02.360 that have really increased the quality of your life 58 00:02:02.360 --> 00:02:03.400 and some that haven't? 59 00:02:03.400 --> 00:02:06.080 Because I'm seeing increasingly that it seems 60 00:02:06.080 --> 00:02:07.440 like there's fewer and fewer things 61 00:02:07.440 --> 00:02:09.160 that I can spend money on that increase the quality 62 00:02:09.160 --> 00:02:10.000 of my life. 63 00:02:10.000 --> 00:02:11.240 So then I go, well, what am I doing? 64 00:02:11.240 --> 00:02:13.840 You know, I'm just gonna play video games with my friends, 65 00:02:13.840 --> 00:02:15.960 which is complete waste of time 66 00:02:15.960 --> 00:02:16.760 if I'm trying to make money, 67 00:02:16.760 --> 00:02:18.920 but it's fun while I'm doing it, so. 68 00:02:18.920 --> 00:02:20.240 Which we want to make money to go have fun, 69 00:02:20.240 --> 00:02:21.080 so then we'll wait. 70 00:02:21.080 --> 00:02:22.240 What is, right? 71 00:02:22.240 --> 00:02:23.080 Yeah. 72 00:02:23.080 --> 00:02:23.920 Yes. 73 00:02:23.920 --> 00:02:27.040 So let me see if I can answer the second question first 74 00:02:27.040 --> 00:02:28.680 because it was the one you just asked. 75 00:02:28.680 --> 00:02:31.440 The marginal utility of money decreases massively over time. 76 00:02:31.440 --> 00:02:33.400 So the additional, your next million dollars 77 00:02:33.400 --> 00:02:36.400 makes a significantly less impact on your life 78 00:02:36.400 --> 00:02:37.840 than your first million dollars, right? 79 00:02:37.840 --> 00:02:39.920 And the first $100,000 in my opinion has, 80 00:02:39.920 --> 00:02:42.840 but you know, 80 to 90% of the utility 81 00:02:42.840 --> 00:02:45.040 you would get for months in the first hundred grant, right? 82 00:02:45.040 --> 00:02:46.080 And then everything after that 83 00:02:46.080 --> 00:02:48.480 is really, really diminishing in terms of its return. 84 00:02:48.720 --> 00:02:52.200 There are two things that I get that I get value from. 85 00:02:52.200 --> 00:02:54.640 One is I like flying private. 86 00:02:54.640 --> 00:02:58.280 It's, that's totally, it's not private. 87 00:02:58.280 --> 00:03:00.480 I was gonna say first class, that's what I get. 88 00:03:00.480 --> 00:03:01.320 That's what I get. 89 00:03:01.320 --> 00:03:02.320 Private is way better. 90 00:03:02.320 --> 00:03:04.640 It's not even close, it's way better. 91 00:03:04.640 --> 00:03:07.800 That's about $49,000 more per flight, so. 92 00:03:07.800 --> 00:03:09.320 Well, you know, you can get it there. 93 00:03:09.320 --> 00:03:10.320 We're not at that level yet. 94 00:03:10.320 --> 00:03:11.320 It's about, so I'll tell you, 95 00:03:11.320 --> 00:03:14.840 so you can do it for, it's about four to five thousand an hour. 96 00:03:14.840 --> 00:03:16.600 So if you have a three hour flight, 97 00:03:16.600 --> 00:03:18.360 you're looking at 12 to 15 grand. 98 00:03:18.360 --> 00:03:20.680 And if you got six to eight seats on the plane, 99 00:03:20.680 --> 00:03:21.520 you know, if you're taking, 100 00:03:21.520 --> 00:03:23.000 if it's you and two or three other people, 101 00:03:23.000 --> 00:03:24.360 all of a sudden it's like two or three thousand, 102 00:03:24.360 --> 00:03:26.720 it's take it like it can be, I'm not, 103 00:03:26.720 --> 00:03:28.700 by no means am I saying it's like, you know, 104 00:03:28.700 --> 00:03:31.560 I'm just saying that like, I like it. 105 00:03:31.560 --> 00:03:33.440 I do think it, to use Warren Buffett's word, 106 00:03:33.440 --> 00:03:35.000 I do think it's indefensible, 107 00:03:35.000 --> 00:03:37.360 but at some point I'm like, well, why even, 108 00:03:37.360 --> 00:03:40.200 what am I accumulating more money to do? 109 00:03:40.200 --> 00:03:41.040 Right, there's, right. 110 00:03:41.040 --> 00:03:43.520 And so it is a hundred percent of comfort thing, 111 00:03:43.520 --> 00:03:46.880 but what, and Layla consolidated this statement, 112 00:03:46.880 --> 00:03:48.520 well, I won't talk more about private flying, 113 00:03:48.520 --> 00:03:50.720 but she said what it did was it transformed travel 114 00:03:50.720 --> 00:03:54.160 from a nuisance into a positive experience. 115 00:03:54.160 --> 00:03:57.920 And so going from economy to first class, 116 00:03:57.920 --> 00:04:00.280 it's still a nuisance, it's still a pain, right? 117 00:04:00.280 --> 00:04:01.680 It's just a little less of a pain, 118 00:04:01.680 --> 00:04:03.880 but it's still a net negative in my opinion. 119 00:04:03.880 --> 00:04:06.360 Flying private, I would say borders on 120 00:04:06.360 --> 00:04:08.280 and may actually be a positive experience, 121 00:04:08.280 --> 00:04:10.360 because you literally just drive your car to the plane, 122 00:04:10.360 --> 00:04:12.600 you walk on the plane, you've got 123 00:04:12.600 --> 00:04:15.480 play and lobster, and then you get off the plane 124 00:04:15.480 --> 00:04:17.400 into your car and you drive to where you're going, 125 00:04:17.400 --> 00:04:19.400 and there's no security, there's no, 126 00:04:19.400 --> 00:04:21.360 there's no, there's no babies, there's no, 127 00:04:21.360 --> 00:04:23.040 like it's just, it's nice. 128 00:04:23.040 --> 00:04:24.760 So that's the one thing that I would say, 129 00:04:24.760 --> 00:04:27.640 and the other one is I like buying places with views, 130 00:04:27.640 --> 00:04:31.840 so we're in a Las Vegas penthouse right now, 131 00:04:31.840 --> 00:04:33.280 and it's beautiful. 132 00:04:33.280 --> 00:04:34.640 You know what I mean, like I look outside 133 00:04:34.640 --> 00:04:36.640 and I feel like I genuinely gain perspective, 134 00:04:36.640 --> 00:04:39.040 because I see everything, and I see the amount of wealth 135 00:04:39.040 --> 00:04:40.160 that exists in the world, 136 00:04:40.160 --> 00:04:42.040 and I think it helps, it only helps me 137 00:04:42.040 --> 00:04:43.600 from a perspective standpoint. 138 00:04:43.600 --> 00:04:45.080 So there's the two things that I think 139 00:04:45.080 --> 00:04:47.360 that have been, I would say, very expensive, 140 00:04:47.360 --> 00:04:49.560 that I have gotten actual value from, 141 00:04:49.560 --> 00:04:51.800 but beyond that, very, very, very little 142 00:04:51.800 --> 00:04:53.840 marginal utility of extra money. 143 00:04:53.840 --> 00:04:55.920 The first question I think you asked was, 144 00:04:55.920 --> 00:04:57.360 why use money as a measuring stick, 145 00:04:57.360 --> 00:04:59.520 and why do I say the billion thing? 146 00:04:59.520 --> 00:05:02.200 So I have absolute commitment to getting there, 147 00:05:02.200 --> 00:05:05.280 and I have no emotional investment towards its achievement. 148 00:05:05.280 --> 00:05:06.560 I don't care. 149 00:05:06.560 --> 00:05:08.400 It's more that, it's kind of like Gary Vee's 150 00:05:08.400 --> 00:05:09.760 like I'm going to try and buy the jets. 151 00:05:09.760 --> 00:05:12.640 It doesn't really matter, it's more just about the game, 152 00:05:12.640 --> 00:05:15.880 and I think that, and it might be self-aggrandizing for me 153 00:05:15.880 --> 00:05:16.880 to even think this way, 154 00:05:16.880 --> 00:05:19.160 but I think it's probably true because I'm human. 155 00:05:19.160 --> 00:05:21.400 I think that people will listen to me more 156 00:05:21.400 --> 00:05:25.400 if I'm a billionaire than if I'm just a hundred millionaire. 157 00:05:25.400 --> 00:05:28.640 And that's probably just my own insecurities or whatever. 158 00:05:28.640 --> 00:05:31.160 And I think that, I think that we'll get there, 159 00:05:31.160 --> 00:05:33.520 based on the math, it would be unrealistic for me 160 00:05:33.520 --> 00:05:37.320 not to get there unless I massively blow something, 161 00:05:37.320 --> 00:05:39.600 you know what I mean, somehow. 162 00:05:39.600 --> 00:05:42.880 And so just on the math, just literally the sheer cash 163 00:05:42.880 --> 00:05:44.960 we have, not even the businesses of the cash flow 164 00:05:44.960 --> 00:05:47.560 that those generate, if we just sat that in 10%, 165 00:05:47.560 --> 00:05:49.160 one of 65 of the billion dollars. 166 00:05:49.160 --> 00:05:51.520 So, mind you, a billion dollars today 167 00:05:51.520 --> 00:05:52.640 will be 10 billion dollars then. 168 00:05:52.640 --> 00:05:55.960 So, you know, you can't think about that, but anyways. 169 00:05:55.960 --> 00:05:56.800 Inflation. 170 00:05:56.800 --> 00:05:57.640 Yeah. 171 00:05:57.640 --> 00:05:58.480 Well, sorry, can I, can I? 172 00:05:58.480 --> 00:06:00.240 Because I kind of want to, I want to ask this, 173 00:06:00.240 --> 00:06:01.400 it's going to sound similar, 174 00:06:01.400 --> 00:06:03.840 but I'm going for something different, which is, 175 00:06:03.840 --> 00:06:06.400 so I don't know, and I'm not trying to say your exact 176 00:06:06.760 --> 00:06:09.360 worth, let's just say you have 40 million dollars, 177 00:06:09.360 --> 00:06:11.760 or 50 million dollars in the bank cash, right? 178 00:06:11.760 --> 00:06:14.680 Not probably, I'm probably closer to the mid 30s. 179 00:06:14.680 --> 00:06:15.520 It depends on you. 180 00:06:15.520 --> 00:06:17.120 Okay, the like, in investible assets. 181 00:06:17.120 --> 00:06:18.560 35 million dollars. 182 00:06:18.560 --> 00:06:19.400 Sure. 183 00:06:19.400 --> 00:06:23.000 What motivates you to do work you don't enjoy? 184 00:06:23.000 --> 00:06:25.440 Or do you just only do work that you enjoy? 185 00:06:25.440 --> 00:06:29.240 Because I could imagine having 35 million dollars 186 00:06:29.240 --> 00:06:32.080 in the bank and going, I'm only going to spend my time 187 00:06:32.080 --> 00:06:32.920 doing things that are fun. 188 00:06:32.920 --> 00:06:34.240 And the second something's not fun, 189 00:06:34.240 --> 00:06:35.760 but can make me more money. 190 00:06:35.760 --> 00:06:37.400 I'm just not going to do that thing, 191 00:06:37.400 --> 00:06:38.680 because I don't need more money. 192 00:06:38.680 --> 00:06:40.280 And so I'm curious, do you have that philosophy? 193 00:06:40.280 --> 00:06:43.440 And if not, what is it that gets you to do the thing 194 00:06:43.440 --> 00:06:44.280 that's? 195 00:06:44.280 --> 00:06:45.120 Yeah. 196 00:06:45.120 --> 00:06:45.960 So this is interesting. 197 00:06:45.960 --> 00:06:47.280 So this is interesting. 198 00:06:47.280 --> 00:06:51.360 I believe that humans need challenges to enjoy life. 199 00:06:51.360 --> 00:06:52.800 And so then it starts to become, 200 00:06:52.800 --> 00:06:54.760 am I living by my values? 201 00:06:54.760 --> 00:06:56.520 Because am I this type of person who, 202 00:06:56.520 --> 00:06:58.280 who, because one of my biggest fears, 203 00:06:58.280 --> 00:06:59.280 and I remember saying this over and over, 204 00:06:59.280 --> 00:07:01.360 and it was that I never want to become soft. 205 00:07:01.360 --> 00:07:04.000 I never want to feel like if everything were taken for me, 206 00:07:04.000 --> 00:07:05.280 I could not build it again. 207 00:07:05.280 --> 00:07:08.000 And so for me, I feel very shishihifufu whatever 208 00:07:08.000 --> 00:07:12.240 words you want to use for not wanting to do certain things. 209 00:07:12.240 --> 00:07:14.920 Now, that being said, to your question, 210 00:07:14.920 --> 00:07:17.600 the vast majority of my time, or 100% of my time, 211 00:07:17.600 --> 00:07:21.080 I pretty much spend doing stuff that I find enjoyable, 212 00:07:21.080 --> 00:07:22.880 or stimulating to a certain degree. 213 00:07:22.880 --> 00:07:24.920 But I won't shy away from something 214 00:07:24.920 --> 00:07:27.760 if it's to get to the thing, the next thing 215 00:07:27.760 --> 00:07:31.520 that I want to do, I have no difficulty in attacking it. 216 00:07:31.520 --> 00:07:33.880 But I think when it's up happening to the question 217 00:07:33.880 --> 00:07:36.520 that you have, and this may be interesting for you, 218 00:07:36.520 --> 00:07:38.120 I don't know what level you guys are at business-wise, 219 00:07:38.120 --> 00:07:42.280 but when I talk to seven figure entrepreneurs, right? 220 00:07:42.280 --> 00:07:43.720 They're talking about tactics. 221 00:07:43.720 --> 00:07:46.040 They're talking about, hey, we did this order of bump, 222 00:07:46.040 --> 00:07:47.400 we did this change in headline, 223 00:07:47.400 --> 00:07:50.720 or we switched it in this new platform, it's tactical. 224 00:07:50.720 --> 00:07:53.600 Eight figure guys, they're usually talking about processes 225 00:07:53.600 --> 00:07:54.960 that they're putting inside of their business. 226 00:07:54.960 --> 00:07:56.160 You know, they just hit a million a month, 227 00:07:56.160 --> 00:07:57.680 they're a million a half, too many a month more in there, 228 00:07:57.680 --> 00:08:00.360 and they're like, that's what they're thinking about. 229 00:08:00.360 --> 00:08:01.960 All the people that I know who are, 230 00:08:01.960 --> 00:08:05.400 and I think we'll hit, I think we'll cross a hundred million 231 00:08:05.400 --> 00:08:08.080 in revenue by probably end of Q1 next year, 232 00:08:08.080 --> 00:08:09.480 maybe Q2 next year. 233 00:08:09.480 --> 00:08:11.920 But the conversation that I have with all the guys 234 00:08:11.920 --> 00:08:13.800 that I know that are at that level and above, 235 00:08:13.800 --> 00:08:15.360 it's all about people. 236 00:08:15.360 --> 00:08:17.640 And so I was having this conversation with a friend of mine, 237 00:08:17.640 --> 00:08:19.760 and he was like, yeah, all the business owners 238 00:08:19.760 --> 00:08:21.960 that we serve, and they have a big platform. 239 00:08:21.960 --> 00:08:23.480 He's like, they just always, they're always like, 240 00:08:23.480 --> 00:08:25.480 how do I get more traffic, how do I get more traffic? 241 00:08:25.480 --> 00:08:28.200 And we both were laughing, and I was like, 242 00:08:28.200 --> 00:08:30.000 I would just say go hire someone, 243 00:08:30.000 --> 00:08:32.640 and he knows how to get traffic, and then do that. 244 00:08:32.640 --> 00:08:34.640 You know, and we both cracked it up, 245 00:08:34.640 --> 00:08:37.880 but that's candidly that's how I think about stuff now. 246 00:08:37.880 --> 00:08:40.040 And if I were to start a new endeavor, 247 00:08:40.040 --> 00:08:42.400 I wouldn't build a business, I would assemble a business. 248 00:08:42.400 --> 00:08:44.080 And so it's like, I know we need one of these, 249 00:08:44.080 --> 00:08:45.080 one of these, one of these. 250 00:08:45.080 --> 00:08:47.080 I'd put it together and say, go pursue it on my behalf, 251 00:08:47.080 --> 00:08:49.040 here's the incentive for everybody, 252 00:08:49.040 --> 00:08:51.000 and then that's how the business would grow. 253 00:08:51.000 --> 00:08:52.840 And if it doesn't grow, then I would swap people out 254 00:08:52.840 --> 00:08:54.720 until it was growing. 255 00:08:54.720 --> 00:08:56.320 And so the thought process changed, 256 00:08:56.320 --> 00:08:57.520 but I think you do have to go through it, 257 00:08:57.520 --> 00:08:59.200 and maybe that's a believer's story of telling myself, 258 00:08:59.200 --> 00:09:01.760 but most of the guys that I know who have achieved that 259 00:09:01.760 --> 00:09:03.160 did go through each of the steps, 260 00:09:03.160 --> 00:09:05.280 so that they could cross check and be like, 261 00:09:05.280 --> 00:09:06.720 I know this guy's full of it, 262 00:09:06.720 --> 00:09:08.400 and I know this guy knows this stuff, 263 00:09:08.400 --> 00:09:10.400 so that you can simply make better judgments 264 00:09:10.400 --> 00:09:13.400 on other human beings with decreasing error rate. 265 00:09:13.400 --> 00:09:16.400 You still have them, but just fewer errors. 266 00:09:16.400 --> 00:09:17.560 I do want to circle to this, 267 00:09:17.560 --> 00:09:21.080 because I actually really need to figure out the hiring thing. 268 00:09:21.080 --> 00:09:23.720 But I do have one question, because I agree 269 00:09:23.720 --> 00:09:25.560 that people need is a weird word, 270 00:09:25.560 --> 00:09:28.240 but I would say thrive on challenges, 271 00:09:28.240 --> 00:09:30.800 and challenges are rewarding and fulfilling. 272 00:09:30.800 --> 00:09:32.440 Do you find that you diversify them 273 00:09:32.440 --> 00:09:35.720 amongst monetizable challenges and challenges 274 00:09:35.720 --> 00:09:37.160 that don't make money, 275 00:09:37.160 --> 00:09:39.200 or do you focus mostly on challenges that make money? 276 00:09:39.200 --> 00:09:41.120 Because I could imagine, again, 35 million in the bank, 277 00:09:41.120 --> 00:09:43.480 you go, I'm gonna learn to play piano, 278 00:09:43.480 --> 00:09:45.280 I'm gonna build a homeless center 279 00:09:45.280 --> 00:09:47.720 that makes no money at all in Las Vegas, 280 00:09:47.720 --> 00:09:49.640 and I'm going to try to invent something. 281 00:09:49.640 --> 00:09:52.680 I'm going to do the challenge of inventing a new way 282 00:09:52.680 --> 00:09:54.480 to improve solar energy, 283 00:09:54.480 --> 00:09:55.680 and maybe it'll be a billion dollars, 284 00:09:55.680 --> 00:09:58.120 but maybe it'll just solve global warming, 285 00:09:58.160 --> 00:09:59.680 and I won't make any money. 286 00:09:59.680 --> 00:10:01.520 But I also know people who are serial entrepreneurs, 287 00:10:01.520 --> 00:10:04.720 and everything they do is in the pursuit of wealth. 288 00:10:04.720 --> 00:10:08.000 And so I'm curious, how do you pick your challenges, 289 00:10:08.000 --> 00:10:09.920 I guess, what drives you? 290 00:10:09.920 --> 00:10:11.840 So money is not the driver. 291 00:10:11.840 --> 00:10:14.480 I just love the game of business so much. 292 00:10:14.480 --> 00:10:15.680 I just love the game of business. 293 00:10:15.680 --> 00:10:17.200 I loved and was obsessed with fitness 294 00:10:17.200 --> 00:10:18.400 at multiple state records. 295 00:10:18.400 --> 00:10:22.520 I was in good physical competitive shape, right? 296 00:10:22.520 --> 00:10:24.200 Still are, saw the quads before we started. 297 00:10:24.200 --> 00:10:25.040 I appreciate it. 298 00:10:25.560 --> 00:10:30.160 But when, as soon as I got into business, 299 00:10:30.160 --> 00:10:33.080 the love that I have for fitness just paled in comparison 300 00:10:33.080 --> 00:10:34.720 to just how obsessed I was, 301 00:10:34.720 --> 00:10:38.360 and how much I just loved spending every hour that I could, 302 00:10:38.360 --> 00:10:39.520 and my free time now, 303 00:10:39.520 --> 00:10:42.640 right now I'm going through a course on deal structure. 304 00:10:42.640 --> 00:10:43.880 I was like, this is great. 305 00:10:43.880 --> 00:10:47.040 I love it, I truly love it. 306 00:10:47.040 --> 00:10:49.080 And so in terms of challenges, 307 00:10:49.080 --> 00:10:50.760 the way that I have skinned at the challenges 308 00:10:50.760 --> 00:10:52.160 for me at least in my current season 309 00:10:52.840 --> 00:10:55.560 is pursuing bigger goals than I did before, 310 00:10:55.560 --> 00:10:59.560 monetarily, but with massive constraints. 311 00:10:59.560 --> 00:11:01.600 Right now my actual like mental target 312 00:11:01.600 --> 00:11:03.640 is I'd like to do 100 million in profit a year. 313 00:11:03.640 --> 00:11:04.680 So that's my, 314 00:11:04.680 --> 00:11:06.960 that's my up between all the portfolio companies, right? 315 00:11:06.960 --> 00:11:08.440 That's my next target. 316 00:11:08.440 --> 00:11:11.600 And so if I do 100 million in profit per year, 317 00:11:11.600 --> 00:11:13.480 I don't want to do that as a slave. 318 00:11:13.480 --> 00:11:16.400 I would like to do that as an owner advisor 319 00:11:16.400 --> 00:11:19.640 and working two to three days a week with them. 320 00:11:19.640 --> 00:11:20.480 And I say work. 321 00:11:20.480 --> 00:11:22.680 So for me, the work is like meetings. 322 00:11:22.680 --> 00:11:24.440 So that's meeting with the CEOs and companies, 323 00:11:24.440 --> 00:11:26.040 meeting with a handful of leadership. 324 00:11:26.040 --> 00:11:27.960 That's what I consider like work work. 325 00:11:27.960 --> 00:11:31.960 And then the rest of my time is making the YouTube stuff, 326 00:11:31.960 --> 00:11:33.840 writing the books, making the courses 327 00:11:33.840 --> 00:11:35.280 that we're going to be publishing, 328 00:11:35.280 --> 00:11:36.760 doing podcasts like this. 329 00:11:36.760 --> 00:11:37.760 Like these are all just, 330 00:11:37.760 --> 00:11:39.440 this is, you know, I enjoyed the, 331 00:11:39.440 --> 00:11:41.040 I enjoyed this a ton. 332 00:11:41.040 --> 00:11:41.880 Nice. 333 00:11:41.880 --> 00:11:43.720 Yeah, so well, the reason I asked is, 334 00:11:43.720 --> 00:11:46.240 because I could imagine people who are listening, 335 00:11:46.240 --> 00:11:48.800 who are very enviable of your life, 336 00:11:48.800 --> 00:11:50.680 the fact that you are an advisor, 337 00:11:50.680 --> 00:11:52.880 who buys businesses, who has more money 338 00:11:52.880 --> 00:11:54.920 than almost anybody on the planet. 339 00:11:54.920 --> 00:11:56.640 Like they want to get where you're getting, 340 00:11:56.640 --> 00:11:59.040 but maybe they don't feel the same way you do 341 00:11:59.040 --> 00:12:00.480 when they first pick up entrepreneurship. 342 00:12:00.480 --> 00:12:01.920 So maybe they were a great athlete 343 00:12:01.920 --> 00:12:04.720 who doesn't find the business books exciting 344 00:12:04.720 --> 00:12:05.880 or whatever it is. 345 00:12:05.880 --> 00:12:06.920 Maybe they're an incredible musician 346 00:12:06.920 --> 00:12:09.600 who when they try to go into the online course world, 347 00:12:09.600 --> 00:12:11.240 they find it aggrined. 348 00:12:11.240 --> 00:12:13.920 Have you had any success with yourself 349 00:12:13.920 --> 00:12:16.640 with other people learning to love the game 350 00:12:16.640 --> 00:12:18.320 or do you find that it's kind of like 351 00:12:18.320 --> 00:12:20.760 how some people like art and some people like sports 352 00:12:20.760 --> 00:12:22.080 and you like it if you like it and you don't, 353 00:12:22.080 --> 00:12:23.800 if you don't, so if business is your game, 354 00:12:23.800 --> 00:12:25.920 you're set up for success and if it's not, 355 00:12:25.920 --> 00:12:28.520 then you don't get to be Alex from Ozzy. 356 00:12:28.520 --> 00:12:29.800 Yeah. 357 00:12:29.800 --> 00:12:32.440 So first off, I just want, like for the audience, 358 00:12:32.440 --> 00:12:35.320 you've been saying the 35 million thing, 359 00:12:35.320 --> 00:12:37.760 I literally feel pangs have been security. 360 00:12:37.760 --> 00:12:40.640 That is not that much money, just so you know. 361 00:12:40.640 --> 00:12:41.480 Really? 362 00:12:41.480 --> 00:12:43.840 I just want to get everyone like that. 363 00:12:43.840 --> 00:12:46.000 Like I'm like, my God, it's not over a hundred. 364 00:12:46.000 --> 00:12:47.160 I'm such a poor person. 365 00:12:47.160 --> 00:12:49.920 Like I hope no one hears this. 366 00:12:49.920 --> 00:12:51.800 Like I'm still like, I can tell you the thoughts 367 00:12:51.800 --> 00:12:53.240 that I'm having while we're talking about this. 368 00:12:53.240 --> 00:12:54.480 Wow. 369 00:12:54.480 --> 00:12:56.320 By respect yourself awareness and your willingness 370 00:12:56.320 --> 00:12:59.640 to share that, I'm happy to tell you all the things 371 00:12:59.640 --> 00:13:00.960 that are just flawed within me. 372 00:13:00.960 --> 00:13:04.680 But the other part, which is if you don't inherently 373 00:13:04.680 --> 00:13:06.120 love the game, right? 374 00:13:06.120 --> 00:13:08.400 So my perspective on this is shifted, 375 00:13:08.400 --> 00:13:10.040 which then makes it hard for me to even talk 376 00:13:10.040 --> 00:13:10.960 because then I think about some things 377 00:13:10.960 --> 00:13:11.960 that say five years ago in my wish, 378 00:13:11.960 --> 00:13:13.720 I just never said anything, but then it's like 379 00:13:13.720 --> 00:13:16.360 that I wouldn't speak anymore and then whatever. 380 00:13:16.360 --> 00:13:19.920 And so my viewpoint on it is that I do think 381 00:13:19.920 --> 00:13:22.600 that there's a lot more luck than I used to give credit for. 382 00:13:22.600 --> 00:13:24.600 And the luck is not from outside circumstance 383 00:13:24.600 --> 00:13:26.560 of like things happening in meeting people, 384 00:13:26.560 --> 00:13:29.240 but more luck of the draw, the initial draw of like, 385 00:13:29.240 --> 00:13:31.160 what were my genetics, what was the initial upbringing 386 00:13:31.160 --> 00:13:33.160 that I had where the stimuli was exposed to? 387 00:13:33.160 --> 00:13:34.640 That gave me these proclivities. 388 00:13:34.640 --> 00:13:35.440 Because if you think about it 389 00:13:35.440 --> 00:13:37.200 from a large number standpoint, right? 390 00:13:37.200 --> 00:13:38.360 With a large enough pool of people, 391 00:13:38.360 --> 00:13:40.800 which most people just about everybody's within a system 392 00:13:40.800 --> 00:13:41.840 where the money is involved, right? 393 00:13:41.840 --> 00:13:44.840 And if we just said only capitalist systems shore, 394 00:13:44.840 --> 00:13:46.280 there's still a billion plus people 395 00:13:46.280 --> 00:13:47.760 or two billion plus people that are, 396 00:13:47.760 --> 00:13:50.360 I guess including a three, half the world's populations 397 00:13:50.360 --> 00:13:52.880 and a capitalist system of some sort, right? 398 00:13:52.880 --> 00:13:55.640 And so with that many numbers, 399 00:13:55.640 --> 00:13:57.360 lots of people will work hard, 400 00:13:57.360 --> 00:14:00.320 but the people who have a proclivity and work hard 401 00:14:00.320 --> 00:14:02.960 and have some level of natural talent towards it 402 00:14:02.960 --> 00:14:05.440 will just excel better and faster. 403 00:14:05.440 --> 00:14:08.880 And so I think that everybody can be in the top one percent. 404 00:14:08.880 --> 00:14:10.400 That I believe, which means you'll 405 00:14:10.400 --> 00:14:12.360 one to five million investment assets. 406 00:14:12.360 --> 00:14:14.800 I believe everyone can do that in their lifespan, 407 00:14:14.800 --> 00:14:17.600 a hundred percent, but most people don't have 408 00:14:17.600 --> 00:14:19.400 the character traits in the discipline to do that. 409 00:14:19.400 --> 00:14:22.000 Now is that luck, is that, you know, who knows? 410 00:14:22.000 --> 00:14:25.840 But the question that my closest friend, Dr. Trevor Cashy, 411 00:14:25.840 --> 00:14:28.920 who's a scientist and studies behavior stuff all the time, 412 00:14:28.920 --> 00:14:32.720 is like, is it useful to ask the question? 413 00:14:32.720 --> 00:14:35.280 Because it's not under our control at all. 414 00:14:35.280 --> 00:14:37.280 He's like, so you might as well tell yourself 415 00:14:37.280 --> 00:14:41.000 that you do have a natural proclivity to being in business 416 00:14:41.000 --> 00:14:42.920 if you want to be successful in business. 417 00:14:44.960 --> 00:14:46.160 Real quick, guys, if you can think about 418 00:14:46.160 --> 00:14:47.680 how you found this podcast, 419 00:14:47.680 --> 00:14:50.200 somebody probably tweeted it, told you about it, 420 00:14:50.200 --> 00:14:52.480 shared it on Instagram or something like that. 421 00:14:52.480 --> 00:14:54.920 The only way this grows is through word of mouth. 422 00:14:54.920 --> 00:14:57.160 And so I don't run ads, I don't do sponsorships, 423 00:14:57.160 --> 00:14:58.160 I don't sell anything. 424 00:14:58.160 --> 00:15:00.520 My only ask is that you continue to pay it for, 425 00:15:00.520 --> 00:15:02.280 do you ever showed you or however you found out 426 00:15:02.280 --> 00:15:04.440 about this podcast that you do the exact same thing. 427 00:15:04.440 --> 00:15:07.000 So if it was a review, if it was a post, 428 00:15:07.040 --> 00:15:08.320 if you do that, it would mean the world to me, 429 00:15:08.320 --> 00:15:09.480 and you'll throw some good karma out there 430 00:15:09.480 --> 00:15:10.640 for another entrepreneur. 431 00:15:12.400 --> 00:15:14.720 My question was only like, what do I do if that's, 432 00:15:14.720 --> 00:15:16.120 I'm just making up an example, 433 00:15:16.120 --> 00:15:19.200 but what do I do if I'm incredibly talented guitarist 434 00:15:19.200 --> 00:15:22.560 who wants to start a business where I've been teaching 435 00:15:22.560 --> 00:15:24.200 people music and I've been trying for two years 436 00:15:24.200 --> 00:15:25.640 and it's just not working. 437 00:15:25.640 --> 00:15:28.280 And I don't think I have that proclivity. 438 00:15:28.280 --> 00:15:30.560 Can I acquire that, I guess? 439 00:15:30.560 --> 00:15:31.400 I think you could. 440 00:15:31.400 --> 00:15:32.800 I think you'd probably be smarter for that person 441 00:15:32.800 --> 00:15:35.320 to go find someone who loves that game. 442 00:15:35.320 --> 00:15:37.880 And then the only skill you'd have to have is 443 00:15:37.880 --> 00:15:39.600 how do I have the perspective 444 00:15:39.600 --> 00:15:41.920 from which to make a judgment that this person actually is good 445 00:15:41.920 --> 00:15:43.560 and then do I have enough skill and negotiation 446 00:15:43.560 --> 00:15:45.720 so I can make a favorable deal for myself. 447 00:15:45.720 --> 00:15:46.920 And so if you can do those two things, 448 00:15:46.920 --> 00:15:50.040 you can be Justin Bieber, who's not a business guy, 449 00:15:50.040 --> 00:15:51.160 but he's still a sure and early wealthy. 450 00:15:51.160 --> 00:15:52.320 Eminem is not a business guy, 451 00:15:52.320 --> 00:15:53.280 he's still a sure and early wealthy. 452 00:15:53.280 --> 00:15:55.840 So I think there's still ways to play it 453 00:15:55.840 --> 00:15:58.160 without necessarily having business be the game, 454 00:15:58.160 --> 00:15:59.440 which I find kind of interesting too, 455 00:15:59.440 --> 00:16:02.080 because I'm not Kylie Jenner, you know what I mean? 456 00:16:02.080 --> 00:16:04.720 And Kylie's younger than me and wealthy than me, 457 00:16:04.720 --> 00:16:06.120 which I'll tell you another one. 458 00:16:06.120 --> 00:16:07.440 When I found out she was a billionaire 459 00:16:07.440 --> 00:16:08.520 and she was younger than me, 460 00:16:08.520 --> 00:16:10.840 I literally like had a day where I was like, 461 00:16:10.840 --> 00:16:12.880 I just felt like I felt horrible though myself. 462 00:16:12.880 --> 00:16:16.040 Oh, no, oh no, I like that it was like, I suck. 463 00:16:16.040 --> 00:16:18.040 It's like, wow, man. 464 00:16:18.040 --> 00:16:19.880 So I've just told you like the insecurities 465 00:16:19.880 --> 00:16:21.400 run deep to get here, right? 466 00:16:21.400 --> 00:16:22.240 Sure. 467 00:16:22.240 --> 00:16:24.640 Well, you know, you had an Instagram post 468 00:16:24.640 --> 00:16:26.640 and I really appreciate this is one of the reasons 469 00:16:26.640 --> 00:16:27.640 I want to talk to you. 470 00:16:27.640 --> 00:16:30.320 Your candidness, there's an Instagram post 471 00:16:30.320 --> 00:16:33.080 where you said you were in text conversation with a friend 472 00:16:33.120 --> 00:16:35.000 and you said something to the effect of like 473 00:16:35.000 --> 00:16:37.000 the bigger the whole in your heart, 474 00:16:37.000 --> 00:16:38.640 the bigger the stuff required to fill it. 475 00:16:38.640 --> 00:16:40.840 So I have millions of dollars 476 00:16:40.840 --> 00:16:42.360 read what you will into that. 477 00:16:42.360 --> 00:16:45.560 I think, I just, I appreciate you saying it 478 00:16:45.560 --> 00:16:47.840 and separately for if you have, 479 00:16:47.840 --> 00:16:51.200 have you ever done anything like therapy 480 00:16:51.200 --> 00:16:53.640 or psychedelic medicine or anything like that? 481 00:16:53.640 --> 00:16:55.040 And have you found it? 482 00:16:55.040 --> 00:16:57.360 Have you found it helpful? 483 00:16:57.360 --> 00:17:00.040 Because I mean, I appreciate you sharing all of your knowledge, 484 00:17:00.040 --> 00:17:02.120 but and then when I hear those things as well, 485 00:17:02.120 --> 00:17:05.640 I mean, dude, I can, I, I can totally relate to that 486 00:17:05.640 --> 00:17:07.040 smaller number of values. 487 00:17:07.040 --> 00:17:10.040 And I guess at some point, I'm appreciative 488 00:17:10.040 --> 00:17:12.400 that the stubbornness in me quit 489 00:17:12.400 --> 00:17:14.320 and it went, this is fucking stupid. 490 00:17:14.320 --> 00:17:16.080 Like a hundred thousand subscribers, 491 00:17:16.080 --> 00:17:17.320 a million subscribers, five million, 492 00:17:17.320 --> 00:17:19.000 there's like when I get that diamond play button 493 00:17:19.000 --> 00:17:21.880 at 10 million, then people will see me differently. 494 00:17:21.880 --> 00:17:24.080 And I, and I hear that same. 495 00:17:24.080 --> 00:17:26.320 And as his business partner and best friend, 496 00:17:26.320 --> 00:17:27.640 it's been a mixed blessing. 497 00:17:29.480 --> 00:17:31.560 Like as a friend, I'm like, that's great. 498 00:17:31.560 --> 00:17:33.280 And as the business partner, I'm like, 499 00:17:33.280 --> 00:17:34.760 remember when you had all those insecurities? 500 00:17:34.760 --> 00:17:37.560 Yes, it's taken the, it's taken the wind out of my sales. 501 00:17:37.560 --> 00:17:38.400 It's taken the wind out of my sales. 502 00:17:38.400 --> 00:17:41.080 So yeah, have you, have you addressed it other than 503 00:17:41.080 --> 00:17:43.000 filling it with success and achievement? 504 00:17:43.000 --> 00:17:44.680 Have you, have you taken other ways of looking 505 00:17:44.680 --> 00:17:46.120 at that, that internal feeling? 506 00:17:46.120 --> 00:17:47.080 Yes. 507 00:17:47.080 --> 00:17:47.840 And how is that gone? 508 00:17:47.840 --> 00:17:49.920 Like what, what is, what is soos or AF? 509 00:17:49.920 --> 00:17:53.000 Yeah, I would say that I think time dulls the sting of pain, 510 00:17:53.000 --> 00:17:55.160 but you know, over a long enough time horizon. 511 00:17:55.160 --> 00:17:58.560 But for me, I don't think pain, the pain changes 512 00:17:58.560 --> 00:18:01.200 when we look back on it until we understand it. 513 00:18:01.240 --> 00:18:04.840 And I think that's, I think for me defining 514 00:18:04.840 --> 00:18:08.600 what the objective was for quote therapy or self work 515 00:18:08.600 --> 00:18:13.240 or whatever, simply as my, I seek to understand. 516 00:18:13.240 --> 00:18:16.200 And I think it becomes far less intimidating 517 00:18:16.200 --> 00:18:17.920 to go explore some of these things. 518 00:18:17.920 --> 00:18:20.200 If you're like, I'm not, I'm not here to change anything. 519 00:18:20.200 --> 00:18:21.280 Like you're telling yourself, right? 520 00:18:21.280 --> 00:18:23.840 You're like, I just want to understand it, right? 521 00:18:23.840 --> 00:18:26.040 And so for me, the conclusion that I've made, 522 00:18:26.040 --> 00:18:27.920 and candidly, this is also just the story 523 00:18:27.920 --> 00:18:30.920 that I might just be telling myself, so hey, who knows? 524 00:18:30.920 --> 00:18:33.360 But the story that I tell myself at least is that 525 00:18:33.360 --> 00:18:36.960 I had these massive insecurities 526 00:18:36.960 --> 00:18:38.840 about my father's approval, right? 527 00:18:38.840 --> 00:18:40.800 So that was the thing that was withheld for me, 528 00:18:40.800 --> 00:18:43.080 my childhood adulthood. 529 00:18:44.320 --> 00:18:46.920 I mean, in for context, my father called me 530 00:18:46.920 --> 00:18:50.760 and he, he pretty much said all the things that I'd done 531 00:18:50.760 --> 00:18:53.120 up to, you know, every, every decision that I had made 532 00:18:53.120 --> 00:18:54.840 was not a good decision after I decided 533 00:18:54.840 --> 00:18:56.960 to view off the path of the job, right? 534 00:18:56.960 --> 00:18:58.840 Everything after that was a bad decision. 535 00:18:58.840 --> 00:19:01.240 And it was only when I had literally made more money 536 00:19:01.240 --> 00:19:03.400 than he'd ever made in his entire life 537 00:19:03.400 --> 00:19:05.800 that he said, you know, you're going to want to hear this 538 00:19:05.800 --> 00:19:07.600 and I stepped out and it was like, what? 539 00:19:07.600 --> 00:19:08.440 I'm not like dinner. 540 00:19:08.440 --> 00:19:10.520 He was like, I'm sorry, and I was like, for what? 541 00:19:10.520 --> 00:19:12.720 And he was like, you know, for, for saying 542 00:19:12.720 --> 00:19:14.600 that you shouldn't have done this. 543 00:19:14.600 --> 00:19:16.680 And I was like, okay. 544 00:19:16.680 --> 00:19:19.560 And, and he was like, no, I think it was, 545 00:19:19.560 --> 00:19:21.040 he's like, but for the record, he's like, 546 00:19:21.040 --> 00:19:23.720 if it had been 30 years ago, when I was coming up, 547 00:19:23.720 --> 00:19:24.720 I would have been right. 548 00:19:25.560 --> 00:19:26.400 Yeah. 549 00:19:26.400 --> 00:19:30.480 And I remember thinking to myself, one, 550 00:19:30.480 --> 00:19:33.840 if I cared about your opinion, I wouldn't have done it. 551 00:19:33.840 --> 00:19:36.880 And so I had to break the sting of your approval 552 00:19:36.880 --> 00:19:39.160 when I was literally on my balcony thinking 553 00:19:39.160 --> 00:19:42.320 about killing myself in my consulting career. 554 00:19:43.400 --> 00:19:45.280 That was what was the painful enough 555 00:19:45.280 --> 00:19:46.720 to force me to make the change for us. 556 00:19:46.720 --> 00:19:48.600 Like, well, if the alternative is death, 557 00:19:48.600 --> 00:19:50.520 then I can at least disappoint my father. 558 00:19:50.520 --> 00:19:52.000 That was really what it had to come to, 559 00:19:52.000 --> 00:19:54.560 like it sounds ridiculous, but that is what I had to, 560 00:19:54.560 --> 00:19:56.440 and that's why you probably often hear me measure 561 00:19:56.440 --> 00:19:57.680 a lot of decisions against death 562 00:19:57.680 --> 00:19:58.960 because it helps me gain perspective 563 00:19:58.960 --> 00:20:00.200 on what is important. 564 00:20:00.200 --> 00:20:02.200 And so for me, I was like, well, I am guaranteed 565 00:20:02.200 --> 00:20:03.800 to be, to be miserable forever on, 566 00:20:03.800 --> 00:20:04.920 if I'm gonna be miserable forever, 567 00:20:04.920 --> 00:20:06.560 we're doing this, then I might as well die. 568 00:20:06.560 --> 00:20:08.040 And if death is what this is, 569 00:20:08.040 --> 00:20:09.120 then I might as well choose this 570 00:20:09.120 --> 00:20:10.600 and live with the disapproval. 571 00:20:10.600 --> 00:20:12.160 And so I explained that. 572 00:20:12.160 --> 00:20:14.720 And the piece that I think I delivered that I think stung, 573 00:20:14.720 --> 00:20:16.760 but I think the audience might appreciate was like, 574 00:20:16.760 --> 00:20:18.440 I was like, you know that moment, I was talking to my dad. 575 00:20:18.440 --> 00:20:19.960 I was like, you know that moment when people get on stage 576 00:20:19.960 --> 00:20:21.680 and like, I just wanna thank my mom and my dad 577 00:20:21.680 --> 00:20:23.440 for always being there and always being supportive of me. 578 00:20:23.440 --> 00:20:25.440 And I was like, I'm not going to say that. 579 00:20:25.440 --> 00:20:27.000 I was like, cause you weren't. 580 00:20:27.000 --> 00:20:29.000 And so you could probably hear it in my voice, 581 00:20:29.000 --> 00:20:31.400 like I still have the anger that's there. 582 00:20:31.400 --> 00:20:34.480 But what I had to realize was, 583 00:20:34.480 --> 00:20:36.400 what I had done up to that point, 584 00:20:36.400 --> 00:20:38.920 and up until maybe a couple of years ago was, 585 00:20:40.120 --> 00:20:44.440 I wanted to beat my father so badly at his game 586 00:20:44.440 --> 00:20:48.520 that it would be that Nolan, 587 00:20:48.520 --> 00:20:51.480 that he could not claim that I had not won. 588 00:20:51.560 --> 00:20:53.600 And so every aspect of my life 589 00:20:53.600 --> 00:20:57.080 has been built to be impenetrable. 590 00:20:57.080 --> 00:20:59.280 And so it's like, I don't wanna just be in shape. 591 00:20:59.280 --> 00:21:00.680 I want to be so jack fit. 592 00:21:00.680 --> 00:21:02.440 No one says that I am not in shape. 593 00:21:02.440 --> 00:21:04.480 I don't want my wife to be just a girl. 594 00:21:04.480 --> 00:21:06.840 I want her to be incredibly hot, incredibly cool 595 00:21:06.840 --> 00:21:09.240 and fucking good at business and making money, right? 596 00:21:09.240 --> 00:21:11.920 I want, I can't just make money or have a living 597 00:21:11.920 --> 00:21:13.400 or just being the top 1%, 598 00:21:13.400 --> 00:21:15.600 like I want so much money. 599 00:21:15.600 --> 00:21:16.640 And the real reason is, 600 00:21:16.640 --> 00:21:18.160 cause I just want everyone to leave me alone 601 00:21:18.160 --> 00:21:19.720 and not hurt me, right? 602 00:21:19.720 --> 00:21:20.560 Yeah, yeah. 603 00:21:20.560 --> 00:21:23.360 So I built my defenses up. 604 00:21:23.360 --> 00:21:26.600 And so it was to be just an unheardable machine, 605 00:21:26.600 --> 00:21:28.800 but it was just because deep down I was, right? 606 00:21:28.800 --> 00:21:31.600 And so the game that I did was to play a game 607 00:21:31.600 --> 00:21:33.520 that he had built for me. 608 00:21:34.920 --> 00:21:37.720 And so now the question that I had to ask myself 609 00:21:37.720 --> 00:21:39.640 was what game do I want to play? 610 00:21:39.640 --> 00:21:42.440 And so it's been illuminating for me 611 00:21:42.440 --> 00:21:44.000 to try and redefine my own game. 612 00:21:44.000 --> 00:21:46.080 And I think that for me, my decision, 613 00:21:46.080 --> 00:21:47.840 acquisition.com is the first business 614 00:21:47.840 --> 00:21:50.880 that is spawned from my desires, 615 00:21:50.880 --> 00:21:54.480 rather than from the games and the variables 616 00:21:54.480 --> 00:21:55.920 that were set out by, 617 00:21:55.920 --> 00:21:58.120 you could say, society, dad, whatever, 618 00:21:58.120 --> 00:21:59.720 that I had to win, right? 619 00:21:59.720 --> 00:22:02.600 And so the new games that I'm trying to play are 620 00:22:02.600 --> 00:22:04.720 to die the person who gave the most. 621 00:22:04.720 --> 00:22:07.280 And so those are the things that feel lined with my values, 622 00:22:07.280 --> 00:22:11.960 not the values that I was trying to prove to other people. 623 00:22:12.960 --> 00:22:18.440 Yeah, I mean, this is your conversation interview, 624 00:22:18.440 --> 00:22:21.440 but I just did MDMA with my dad. 625 00:22:21.440 --> 00:22:22.280 Oh, right. 626 00:22:22.280 --> 00:22:26.480 So that's like, yeah, and it was not exactly the same. 627 00:22:26.480 --> 00:22:28.000 I would say everything that I hear about you, 628 00:22:28.000 --> 00:22:29.880 I have like an order, it's the same for me, 629 00:22:29.880 --> 00:22:32.200 but an order of magnitude less, 630 00:22:32.200 --> 00:22:36.120 but it was that competitive thing going on 631 00:22:36.120 --> 00:22:38.920 and the deep seeking of approval. 632 00:22:38.920 --> 00:22:41.200 And you know, he told me the same thing 633 00:22:41.200 --> 00:22:43.200 when I did my business. 634 00:22:43.200 --> 00:22:47.280 And understanding him, it was because for him, 635 00:22:47.280 --> 00:22:49.400 it didn't work in his era. 636 00:22:49.400 --> 00:22:50.840 That wasn't how you did things. 637 00:22:50.840 --> 00:22:53.480 So I totally relate and separately, 638 00:22:53.480 --> 00:22:55.520 we'll try to convince you to do MDMA, 639 00:22:55.520 --> 00:22:58.440 but for now, for now, 640 00:22:58.440 --> 00:23:00.520 I actually, unless you want to stay on this, 641 00:23:00.520 --> 00:23:02.600 I wanted to sort of talk about a little bit about 642 00:23:02.600 --> 00:23:05.080 the book that you've got and offers and stuff like that. 643 00:23:05.080 --> 00:23:06.880 Is that, did you want to stay on this pen? 644 00:23:06.880 --> 00:23:07.720 No, go for it, 645 00:23:07.720 --> 00:23:08.560 circle back to business, 646 00:23:08.560 --> 00:23:10.080 but it feels really shallow. 647 00:23:10.080 --> 00:23:11.080 Come back to what we're talking about. 648 00:23:11.080 --> 00:23:12.640 So I'm like, do you do that? 649 00:23:12.640 --> 00:23:14.760 And then I'll bring up a topic that's a tie 650 00:23:14.760 --> 00:23:16.160 with how shallow you go. 651 00:23:16.160 --> 00:23:17.440 I'm happy to talk more money. 652 00:23:17.440 --> 00:23:19.280 Mine, you're like, I enjoy making money 653 00:23:19.280 --> 00:23:20.200 and all the things about it. 654 00:23:20.200 --> 00:23:21.520 So I'm happy to talk about it. 655 00:23:21.520 --> 00:23:23.440 This is, this is my life, man. 656 00:23:23.440 --> 00:23:24.720 I love going in and out. 657 00:23:24.720 --> 00:23:26.960 Like I love sitting up here and talking about like, 658 00:23:26.960 --> 00:23:28.680 dude, this whole game is bullshit. 659 00:23:28.680 --> 00:23:30.760 Like this, this is all silly and it doesn't matter. 660 00:23:30.760 --> 00:23:32.800 And then fucking screaming when I'm losing. 661 00:23:32.800 --> 00:23:35.840 Like, how do I get better at this game? 662 00:23:35.840 --> 00:23:37.080 So that's how I live. 663 00:23:37.120 --> 00:23:38.120 And that's everything. 664 00:23:38.120 --> 00:23:41.040 But in terms of the game, in terms of the offer, 665 00:23:41.040 --> 00:23:43.640 one of the like learning, listening to you is, 666 00:23:43.640 --> 00:23:44.480 you're very pithy. 667 00:23:44.480 --> 00:23:47.400 You've got a lot of useful frameworks that are helpful. 668 00:23:47.400 --> 00:23:50.880 And one of them that as I watched a video was the, 669 00:23:50.880 --> 00:23:52.640 it's like an equation for what an offer is. 670 00:23:52.640 --> 00:23:53.520 And I don't want to mess it up, 671 00:23:53.520 --> 00:23:55.200 but essentially on the top part of it, 672 00:23:55.200 --> 00:23:56.040 you know better than I do. 673 00:23:56.040 --> 00:23:57.520 I'll let you introduce it. 674 00:23:57.520 --> 00:23:59.760 Yes, so I think the contribution of that book 675 00:23:59.760 --> 00:24:00.880 to maybe the marketing community 676 00:24:00.880 --> 00:24:02.400 or business community as a whole, 677 00:24:02.400 --> 00:24:04.040 like if it were summarized into one thing, 678 00:24:04.040 --> 00:24:05.000 it would probably be that equation, 679 00:24:05.000 --> 00:24:06.560 which is the value equation. 680 00:24:06.560 --> 00:24:09.080 And the reason that it actually came to be 681 00:24:09.080 --> 00:24:10.360 was because I was trying to, 682 00:24:10.360 --> 00:24:13.480 I was actually, this came to me like three years ago. 683 00:24:13.480 --> 00:24:15.280 I was building our supplement company. 684 00:24:15.280 --> 00:24:17.280 And when I was doing research on supplements, 685 00:24:17.280 --> 00:24:20.320 it turns out that supplements sell, 686 00:24:20.320 --> 00:24:21.280 there's twice as much revenue 687 00:24:21.280 --> 00:24:23.560 and supplements as there are in gyms as a whole. 688 00:24:23.560 --> 00:24:25.160 And I was like, how can that be, right? 689 00:24:25.160 --> 00:24:28.160 Because like gyms obviously help way more people get in shape. 690 00:24:28.160 --> 00:24:30.200 I was like, but if that were, 691 00:24:30.200 --> 00:24:32.640 but the marketplace values with the marketplace values. 692 00:24:32.640 --> 00:24:35.280 So it was like that was kind of the data point 693 00:24:35.280 --> 00:24:37.840 that set me on this kind of little path to figure this out. 694 00:24:37.840 --> 00:24:40.560 And so, and trying to compare like, 695 00:24:40.560 --> 00:24:43.440 why is this thing, they both solve the same problem. 696 00:24:43.440 --> 00:24:45.600 Why is this one worth more? 697 00:24:45.600 --> 00:24:47.440 Why do people pay more for this than this? 698 00:24:47.440 --> 00:24:49.320 And so it came with these four variables 699 00:24:49.320 --> 00:24:50.640 and then organized them to an equation 700 00:24:50.640 --> 00:24:52.520 that became a fraction, which was the value equation. 701 00:24:52.520 --> 00:24:55.120 So if we're, I think we have a video too, 702 00:24:55.120 --> 00:24:56.120 so people can see this, right? 703 00:24:56.120 --> 00:24:58.400 So if you draw a line on the middle of the screen, 704 00:24:58.400 --> 00:25:00.280 which is just the fractional line, 705 00:25:00.280 --> 00:25:02.000 there's the top of the equations to numerator. 706 00:25:02.000 --> 00:25:03.720 I know everybody's remembered from grade school, right? 707 00:25:03.720 --> 00:25:05.760 The denominators, the one underneath, okay? 708 00:25:05.760 --> 00:25:08.640 So the first part of the equation is dream outcome, 709 00:25:08.640 --> 00:25:10.360 which is what is the experience of transformation 710 00:25:10.360 --> 00:25:11.400 that a customer is going to go through 711 00:25:11.400 --> 00:25:13.080 that we are pro, that rather we are promising 712 00:25:13.080 --> 00:25:14.720 that they are going to go through, right? 713 00:25:14.720 --> 00:25:20.200 And so this is more to speak that in general, 714 00:25:20.200 --> 00:25:22.440 if you have, if I'm talking to men, for example, 715 00:25:22.440 --> 00:25:24.000 and I say I can help you make a million dollars 716 00:25:24.000 --> 00:25:26.400 versus I can help you beat handsome, right? 717 00:25:26.400 --> 00:25:29.560 In general, most men will value making a million dollars 718 00:25:29.560 --> 00:25:30.600 more than being handsome. 719 00:25:30.600 --> 00:25:33.120 And you can see that by the size of the men's beauty market 720 00:25:33.120 --> 00:25:35.840 in comparison to making money market for men, right? 721 00:25:35.840 --> 00:25:38.520 So it's not that all things, but just in general, 722 00:25:38.520 --> 00:25:40.880 this category of items will be higher valued 723 00:25:40.880 --> 00:25:42.280 than this category of items. 724 00:25:42.280 --> 00:25:44.640 And so that is the only purpose of this first one 725 00:25:44.640 --> 00:25:46.640 is what is the experience that we're actually going to be giving 726 00:25:46.640 --> 00:25:48.200 and how much value that comforts 727 00:25:48.200 --> 00:25:49.640 the ultimate price will be able to charge. 728 00:25:49.640 --> 00:25:51.600 So that is variable number one. 729 00:25:51.600 --> 00:25:54.240 Now, if two things are the same outcome, 730 00:25:54.240 --> 00:25:56.400 let's say it's weight loss, right? 731 00:25:56.400 --> 00:25:58.480 And I've got a nine dollar ebook 732 00:25:58.480 --> 00:26:00.920 and I've got a $50,000 liposuction surgery, 733 00:26:00.920 --> 00:26:02.240 they both have the same outcome. 734 00:26:02.240 --> 00:26:04.720 Why is $150,000 in one nine dollars? 735 00:26:04.720 --> 00:26:06.400 Because of the other three variables. 736 00:26:06.400 --> 00:26:08.920 So variable number two, now that we're talking about 737 00:26:08.920 --> 00:26:13.080 two types of solutions to the same vehicle, right? 738 00:26:13.080 --> 00:26:14.680 Or should I try the same destination 739 00:26:14.680 --> 00:26:16.080 but different ways of getting there? 740 00:26:16.080 --> 00:26:19.840 So number two is perceived likelihood of achievement. 741 00:26:19.840 --> 00:26:21.800 And to use the liposuction example, 742 00:26:21.800 --> 00:26:24.600 if I have two doctors, right? 743 00:26:24.600 --> 00:26:28.200 And one of them has not done a surgery yet, 744 00:26:28.200 --> 00:26:29.160 they're fresh out of medical school. 745 00:26:29.160 --> 00:26:31.280 And the other guy's done 10,000 surgeries 746 00:26:31.280 --> 00:26:33.320 and they're both going to do a liposuction surgery. 747 00:26:33.320 --> 00:26:37.520 Which of these guys would we be more likely to want to work with? 748 00:26:37.520 --> 00:26:40.400 Which of them would we be more likely to want to pay? 749 00:26:40.400 --> 00:26:41.240 More. 750 00:26:41.240 --> 00:26:43.520 The 10th out, we probably asked this guy to pay us 751 00:26:43.520 --> 00:26:45.600 to be his first patient, right? 752 00:26:45.600 --> 00:26:47.200 And here's what's even funnier, 753 00:26:47.200 --> 00:26:49.200 is that of these two people, 754 00:26:49.200 --> 00:26:50.640 it'll probably take this guy longer. 755 00:26:50.640 --> 00:26:52.440 So it has nothing to do with time, right? 756 00:26:52.440 --> 00:26:53.720 We're going to get more work out of this guy. 757 00:26:53.720 --> 00:26:54.760 It's probably harder for this guy 758 00:26:54.760 --> 00:26:56.640 than it is for this guy, he does it in his sleep. 759 00:26:56.640 --> 00:26:58.520 But still, our perceived likelihood 760 00:26:58.520 --> 00:27:00.920 of getting what we want when we buy 761 00:27:00.920 --> 00:27:04.160 and the important point is that it confers value 762 00:27:04.160 --> 00:27:07.520 to the prospect prior to the purchasing decision. 763 00:27:07.520 --> 00:27:10.080 So the knowledge that this guy's done 10,000, 764 00:27:10.080 --> 00:27:12.240 versus the knowledge that this guy's done zero, 765 00:27:12.240 --> 00:27:15.360 actually provides value that can be translated 766 00:27:15.360 --> 00:27:17.800 into increased pricing power to a prospect. 767 00:27:17.800 --> 00:27:19.960 So when you start your business 768 00:27:19.960 --> 00:27:22.560 and you've done 100 testimonials, 769 00:27:22.560 --> 00:27:23.400 I used to joke, I was like, 770 00:27:23.400 --> 00:27:25.760 oh, we raised our prices over time. 771 00:27:25.800 --> 00:27:27.640 And I was like, well, that was my 100 testimonial price. 772 00:27:27.640 --> 00:27:30.400 I was like, this is my 4,000 testimonial price. 773 00:27:30.400 --> 00:27:31.760 Because the likelihood that you achieve this, 774 00:27:31.760 --> 00:27:32.960 it would be unreasonable for you to believe 775 00:27:32.960 --> 00:27:36.240 that our solution will not work, right? 776 00:27:36.240 --> 00:27:37.080 So those are the first. 777 00:27:37.080 --> 00:27:38.720 It also seems to be, especially in the internet, 778 00:27:38.720 --> 00:27:42.000 it's almost, I don't, it appears exponential, right? 779 00:27:42.000 --> 00:27:44.240 I guess there's, when you're number one in a category 780 00:27:44.240 --> 00:27:46.200 and people just trust that it's you, 781 00:27:46.200 --> 00:27:48.120 given the time is finite, especially if there's 782 00:27:48.120 --> 00:27:50.320 any time like the liposuction doctor, 783 00:27:50.320 --> 00:27:52.360 he's not just charging three times, 784 00:27:52.360 --> 00:27:55.240 like he's charging at its same amount of money more 785 00:27:55.240 --> 00:27:56.960 than his clientele are willing to pay for it. 786 00:27:56.960 --> 00:27:59.360 And part of that's because the delicate dance of desire, 787 00:27:59.360 --> 00:28:01.240 right, the supply to ban curve, right? 788 00:28:01.240 --> 00:28:02.160 But we can get in that way. 789 00:28:02.160 --> 00:28:03.000 Yeah. 790 00:28:03.000 --> 00:28:03.840 So, sure. 791 00:28:03.840 --> 00:28:05.040 Number one for everybody is dream outcome 792 00:28:05.040 --> 00:28:07.480 with the experience was the thing that we're providing. 793 00:28:07.480 --> 00:28:08.960 Number two is the perceived likelihood 794 00:28:08.960 --> 00:28:11.280 that the prospect believes that they believe 795 00:28:11.280 --> 00:28:13.160 that they will achieve it upon purchase, right? 796 00:28:13.160 --> 00:28:15.000 Same thing, if you get the $9 ebook, 797 00:28:15.000 --> 00:28:16.000 what do you think the likelihood is 798 00:28:16.000 --> 00:28:17.000 that you're gonna lose fat under your stomach? 799 00:28:17.000 --> 00:28:18.000 Probably pretty small. 800 00:28:18.000 --> 00:28:19.800 If you get liposuction, what percentage likely 801 00:28:19.800 --> 00:28:21.080 do you think that you're gonna actually lose fat 802 00:28:21.080 --> 00:28:21.920 under your stomach? 803 00:28:21.920 --> 00:28:22.760 Pretty fucking high. 804 00:28:22.760 --> 00:28:23.600 So. 805 00:28:23.960 --> 00:28:25.080 You mentioned testimonials. 806 00:28:25.080 --> 00:28:27.800 Is this the variable most influenced by marketing 807 00:28:27.800 --> 00:28:29.720 than in terms of like if you have a sales page 808 00:28:29.720 --> 00:28:30.560 on the internet? 809 00:28:30.560 --> 00:28:31.880 Is that what a sales page does? 810 00:28:31.880 --> 00:28:34.240 Is it like tries to confer certain marketing? 811 00:28:34.240 --> 00:28:35.080 So many ways. 812 00:28:35.080 --> 00:28:38.160 The whole that word of mouth does not have for business. 813 00:28:38.160 --> 00:28:40.040 Because if you think about what just word of mouth is, 814 00:28:40.040 --> 00:28:42.000 if you have three friends who read the book, right, 815 00:28:42.000 --> 00:28:43.240 and said the book was good, 816 00:28:43.240 --> 00:28:44.600 I don't really have a sales page for the book 817 00:28:44.600 --> 00:28:46.600 because you already have a perceived likelihood 818 00:28:46.600 --> 00:28:49.200 of achieving a desirable result from reading the book. 819 00:28:50.640 --> 00:28:51.480 Right. 820 00:28:51.600 --> 00:28:54.880 So it fills the hole if you don't have word of mouth. 821 00:28:54.880 --> 00:28:55.720 But yes. 822 00:28:55.720 --> 00:28:56.560 Yeah, if I tell my friend to read the book, 823 00:28:56.560 --> 00:28:57.400 I'll just read it. 824 00:28:57.400 --> 00:28:59.360 Yeah, and you're already filling out that value 825 00:28:59.360 --> 00:29:00.720 part of the equation for them. 826 00:29:02.240 --> 00:29:03.880 But yes, 100% to your point. 827 00:29:03.880 --> 00:29:06.040 Yes, for people who do, for a new prospect, 828 00:29:06.040 --> 00:29:06.840 you doesn't know who you are. 829 00:29:06.840 --> 00:29:08.080 You're marketing, you're messaging your sales, 830 00:29:08.080 --> 00:29:09.960 your stories, you're positioning in the marketplace. 831 00:29:09.960 --> 00:29:10.800 So for all this gonna be the thing, 832 00:29:10.800 --> 00:29:13.680 it's gonna confer the perceived likelihood of achievement. 833 00:29:13.680 --> 00:29:14.560 So there's the top two. 834 00:29:14.560 --> 00:29:15.400 Got it. 835 00:29:15.400 --> 00:29:17.080 For us as business owners and entrepreneurs and marketers, 836 00:29:17.080 --> 00:29:19.600 our goal is to increase the highest of our ability, right? 837 00:29:19.600 --> 00:29:21.840 We want them to have a beautiful experience, 838 00:29:21.840 --> 00:29:24.600 a beautiful beach and Maui that they're envisioning themselves on 839 00:29:24.600 --> 00:29:26.800 and a very high likelihood of achievement, 840 00:29:26.800 --> 00:29:29.640 if they buy this thing, they're going to get the Maui, right? 841 00:29:29.640 --> 00:29:31.720 Now come the other two parts of the equation, 842 00:29:31.720 --> 00:29:32.560 which is the bottom half. 843 00:29:32.560 --> 00:29:33.520 These are the detractors. 844 00:29:33.520 --> 00:29:34.560 These are the things that take away, 845 00:29:34.560 --> 00:29:36.520 increased out, increased risk, all right? 846 00:29:36.520 --> 00:29:39.120 So the first is time to light. 847 00:29:39.120 --> 00:29:41.400 So between when I purchase and when I'm going to experience 848 00:29:41.400 --> 00:29:45.400 the result, and so as a fun anecdote for anybody, 849 00:29:45.400 --> 00:29:46.760 if you wanna create value in a marketplace, 850 00:29:46.760 --> 00:29:47.800 look at what everyone else is doing 851 00:29:47.800 --> 00:29:49.880 and provide the same thing in half the time. 852 00:29:49.880 --> 00:29:51.960 Easiest way to provide value, right? 853 00:29:51.960 --> 00:29:53.960 But for most people, 854 00:29:53.960 --> 00:29:55.800 and I wanna demonstrate this, right? 855 00:29:55.800 --> 00:29:57.120 So if we had a weight loss example, 856 00:29:57.120 --> 00:29:58.840 and I use weight loss because everyone understands it, 857 00:29:58.840 --> 00:30:02.440 if you were to click a button and buy a thousand dollar thing 858 00:30:02.440 --> 00:30:03.760 for weight loss and you're a guy, 859 00:30:03.760 --> 00:30:05.480 and all of a sudden you look down at your abs 860 00:30:05.480 --> 00:30:07.480 or your stomach and there's just a six pack there, 861 00:30:07.480 --> 00:30:10.680 how unbelievably valuable would that thing be? 862 00:30:10.680 --> 00:30:12.280 Wild, right? 863 00:30:12.280 --> 00:30:13.560 And if you were marketing agency, 864 00:30:13.560 --> 00:30:15.040 which I feel like a lot of the marketing world 865 00:30:15.040 --> 00:30:17.600 and lots of people have their SMMAs or whatever it is, right? 866 00:30:17.600 --> 00:30:21.320 If someone signed up and as soon as their credit card ran, 867 00:30:21.320 --> 00:30:23.280 their phone rings and they pick it up, 868 00:30:23.280 --> 00:30:25.240 while they're on the phone with you after just buying, 869 00:30:25.240 --> 00:30:26.760 and it's like, hey, this is Mark, 870 00:30:26.760 --> 00:30:27.600 I heard about your company. 871 00:30:27.600 --> 00:30:29.280 I just saw some of your advertisements. 872 00:30:29.280 --> 00:30:30.920 I'd like to, you know, I'm interested. 873 00:30:30.920 --> 00:30:32.560 They'd be like, holy crap. 874 00:30:32.560 --> 00:30:35.760 And the thing is, is that the only thing that changed, 875 00:30:35.760 --> 00:30:36.840 that might still happen, 876 00:30:36.840 --> 00:30:38.640 60 days from now, 877 00:30:38.640 --> 00:30:40.520 but how much more valuable is the service 878 00:30:40.520 --> 00:30:42.800 or the product if it happens fast, right? 879 00:30:42.840 --> 00:30:45.680 And so the goal is that time is a huge component 880 00:30:45.680 --> 00:30:47.920 of value, fast beats free. 881 00:30:47.920 --> 00:30:49.920 The reason Spotify was able to take over, 882 00:30:49.920 --> 00:30:54.040 even though there was this huge rampant piracy in the market, 883 00:30:54.040 --> 00:30:56.200 was that it was fast. 884 00:30:56.200 --> 00:30:57.880 That's how they beat free. 885 00:30:57.880 --> 00:31:00.240 And I've got a friend of mine who has, 886 00:31:00.240 --> 00:31:02.680 I think they probably have 20 locations now, 887 00:31:02.680 --> 00:31:07.680 who created like the MVD rather than the DMV in New Mexico. 888 00:31:07.800 --> 00:31:09.840 And so they got licensed through the state 889 00:31:09.840 --> 00:31:14.040 to provide DMV renewal services as a private company. 890 00:31:14.040 --> 00:31:17.160 And their whole stick is, you come in, you pay $50, 891 00:31:17.160 --> 00:31:19.080 you pay 50 bucks to not have to wait. 892 00:31:19.080 --> 00:31:22.600 That's the entire value prop and they kill it. 893 00:31:22.600 --> 00:31:24.040 Yeah, that's a TSA pre-check. 894 00:31:24.040 --> 00:31:25.440 That's all 100% just that. 895 00:31:25.440 --> 00:31:27.120 And so I wish there was more of that. 896 00:31:27.120 --> 00:31:29.280 But it's one of the easiest value things to think of 897 00:31:29.280 --> 00:31:30.120 as an entrepreneur is like, 898 00:31:30.120 --> 00:31:31.280 how can I do this thing faster? 899 00:31:31.280 --> 00:31:34.240 So that's the third in the value equation. 900 00:31:34.240 --> 00:31:36.880 And the fourth and final is effort and sacrifice. 901 00:31:36.880 --> 00:31:38.800 And I didn't talk about this as much in the books. 902 00:31:38.800 --> 00:31:41.320 I'll be able to give the listener something that's unique here. 903 00:31:41.320 --> 00:31:42.400 Is that effort and sacrifice, 904 00:31:42.400 --> 00:31:44.600 I see them as two sides of the same coin. 905 00:31:44.600 --> 00:31:48.520 Effort is things that a prospect has to begin doing 906 00:31:48.520 --> 00:31:50.960 that they were not doing, that they do not enjoy 907 00:31:50.960 --> 00:31:53.080 as a result of the purchase. 908 00:31:53.080 --> 00:31:55.640 So this might be, if I had a marketing agency, 909 00:31:55.640 --> 00:31:57.600 all of a sudden I've got to start working leads. 910 00:31:57.600 --> 00:31:59.680 I have to make ads that I have to give this person, 911 00:31:59.680 --> 00:32:02.160 I have to make creative, I have to have weekly meetings with the team 912 00:32:02.160 --> 00:32:04.840 and blah blah blah, all this other stuff 913 00:32:04.840 --> 00:32:08.560 that comes as a consequence of the purchase, right? 914 00:32:08.560 --> 00:32:10.400 The flip side, sacrifice, 915 00:32:10.400 --> 00:32:13.000 or what are the things that I enjoy doing 916 00:32:13.000 --> 00:32:15.840 that I no longer am able to do as a result of the purchase. 917 00:32:15.840 --> 00:32:17.640 And so a lot of times they're flips out of the coin 918 00:32:17.640 --> 00:32:19.200 like if I'm Susie and I got to wake up early 919 00:32:19.200 --> 00:32:20.200 because I got to go to the gym now 920 00:32:20.200 --> 00:32:21.240 because I'm trying to lose weight. 921 00:32:21.240 --> 00:32:23.600 Well, I used to sleep in, so that's a sacrifice. 922 00:32:23.600 --> 00:32:24.840 I'm no longer able to sleep in. 923 00:32:24.840 --> 00:32:26.480 The effort is that I now have to wake up. 924 00:32:26.480 --> 00:32:28.280 So it's kind of two sides of the same thing. 925 00:32:28.280 --> 00:32:30.120 But I like delineating the two 926 00:32:30.120 --> 00:32:32.360 because I think you think differently about things 927 00:32:32.360 --> 00:32:33.920 when you hear both sides of it. 928 00:32:33.920 --> 00:32:35.920 And so the idea for us as business owners 929 00:32:36.320 --> 00:32:38.680 how can I get the effort and sacrifice 930 00:32:38.680 --> 00:32:41.000 as close to zero as humanly possible? 931 00:32:41.000 --> 00:32:43.760 Because in theory, and as I've kind of evolved 932 00:32:43.760 --> 00:32:46.360 in the business world, I used to spend the beginning 933 00:32:46.360 --> 00:32:47.640 part of my entrepreneurial career 934 00:32:47.640 --> 00:32:49.240 always focused on the top side. 935 00:32:49.240 --> 00:32:50.720 It was always about bigger promises, 936 00:32:50.720 --> 00:32:52.880 bigger claims, lots of testimonials, right? 937 00:32:52.880 --> 00:32:56.000 That was, it was all the marketing side of it, right? 938 00:32:56.000 --> 00:32:58.560 But as I got older and we started making more money 939 00:32:58.560 --> 00:32:59.720 and I started observing the people 940 00:32:59.720 --> 00:33:01.160 who were making far more money than me 941 00:33:01.160 --> 00:33:02.760 and the companies are much bigger, 942 00:33:02.760 --> 00:33:05.040 it became realizing that the way 943 00:33:05.080 --> 00:33:06.560 that those guys were providing value 944 00:33:06.560 --> 00:33:09.840 was on the more competitively defensible side 945 00:33:09.840 --> 00:33:11.040 because anyone can make claims 946 00:33:11.040 --> 00:33:12.520 and anyone can have testimonials 947 00:33:12.520 --> 00:33:15.280 and big marketing and great copy and words and stuff. 948 00:33:15.280 --> 00:33:16.760 That's the easy part. 949 00:33:16.760 --> 00:33:20.040 The hard part is actually having the operational advantage 950 00:33:20.040 --> 00:33:23.320 of figuring out the way to provide the thing faster 951 00:33:23.320 --> 00:33:25.120 and provide the thing without effort 952 00:33:25.120 --> 00:33:26.960 and sacrifice on behalf of the prospect. 953 00:33:26.960 --> 00:33:28.520 And so that's why in the book, 954 00:33:28.520 --> 00:33:30.920 I thought of this section getting the bottom to zero, 955 00:33:30.920 --> 00:33:33.760 which is like in theory for us as entrepreneurs, 956 00:33:33.760 --> 00:33:36.480 if we could have anything on the top side 957 00:33:36.480 --> 00:33:37.760 of the equation that's positive, 958 00:33:37.760 --> 00:33:41.120 but the effort and sacrifice and time delay was instant, 959 00:33:41.120 --> 00:33:43.520 right, as soon as they purchased it, it was instant. 960 00:33:43.520 --> 00:33:45.160 You would have an infinitely valuable product. 961 00:33:45.160 --> 00:33:47.600 And if you think about like Amazon, Netflix, 962 00:33:47.600 --> 00:33:49.360 each of these, each of these Uber, 963 00:33:49.360 --> 00:33:50.920 whatever, each of these companies 964 00:33:50.920 --> 00:33:54.080 has this value proposition in all of the effort 965 00:33:54.080 --> 00:33:57.080 in Amazon and their reinvestment strategy 966 00:33:57.080 --> 00:33:59.720 has been on decreasing effort and sacrificing 967 00:33:59.720 --> 00:34:01.600 and decreasing time delay, making things faster. 968 00:34:01.600 --> 00:34:02.800 Yeah, yeah. 969 00:34:02.800 --> 00:34:05.120 So as I'm going through this, 970 00:34:05.120 --> 00:34:06.960 I was thinking of our own business. 971 00:34:06.960 --> 00:34:10.240 And I love it when I find ways that, 972 00:34:11.200 --> 00:34:12.760 I don't know if it's cut the gourding and not, 973 00:34:12.760 --> 00:34:15.760 or like find a, oh my gosh, if I just frame it differently, 974 00:34:15.760 --> 00:34:17.200 one of the things that I was coming up against, 975 00:34:17.200 --> 00:34:18.920 at least in my head, if it's not a limiting belief, 976 00:34:18.920 --> 00:34:21.160 is the physics of transformation. 977 00:34:21.160 --> 00:34:23.600 And so like take weight loss, for instance, 978 00:34:23.600 --> 00:34:24.840 you're doing gym stuff. 979 00:34:24.840 --> 00:34:27.800 And you can always promise seven minute and six minute abs. 980 00:34:27.800 --> 00:34:30.120 Can you talk about designing a product 981 00:34:30.120 --> 00:34:31.760 that fulfills these? 982 00:34:31.760 --> 00:34:34.080 Like, it would seem that finding an offer 983 00:34:34.080 --> 00:34:38.600 that did it a bigger thing, more reliably, faster, 984 00:34:38.600 --> 00:34:40.880 and like that, that's just hard to do. 985 00:34:40.880 --> 00:34:43.840 So operationally, and it's sort of creating these products. 986 00:34:43.840 --> 00:34:47.120 Like, I know, I know how I might love to talk about what I do, 987 00:34:47.120 --> 00:34:48.880 but how do I make that a thing? 988 00:34:48.880 --> 00:34:51.120 What are the skills that one does in order to actually 989 00:34:51.120 --> 00:34:54.400 devise a product that you can realistically handle 990 00:34:54.400 --> 00:34:55.840 being talked about in this awesome one? 991 00:34:55.840 --> 00:34:56.480 Totally. 992 00:34:56.480 --> 00:34:59.160 So in the book, you know, the section 993 00:34:59.160 --> 00:35:00.160 I'm going to go over this, and so hopefully, 994 00:35:00.160 --> 00:35:01.160 it's not repetitive for you guys, 995 00:35:01.160 --> 00:35:03.560 but the audience, I haven't read it, so I'm going to go over this. 996 00:35:03.560 --> 00:35:07.040 So I think, I think thinking about product improvement 997 00:35:07.040 --> 00:35:09.760 is really hard, because what does that mean, right? 998 00:35:09.760 --> 00:35:11.600 But just thinking about what are the problems, 999 00:35:11.600 --> 00:35:14.640 every single problem, and as nuanced details I possibly 1000 00:35:14.640 --> 00:35:16.160 can about the customer experience, 1001 00:35:16.160 --> 00:35:19.640 both perceived and actual, that the customer is going through 1002 00:35:19.640 --> 00:35:22.720 from before they start to use the products, 1003 00:35:22.720 --> 00:35:25.040 all the way through the end and after the result, 1004 00:35:25.040 --> 00:35:26.960 or experiencing the result of the product, 1005 00:35:26.960 --> 00:35:29.840 every single micro step that occurs on that process, 1006 00:35:29.840 --> 00:35:31.480 how can I lubricate that? 1007 00:35:31.480 --> 00:35:34.400 How can I make it faster and easier for them, 1008 00:35:34.400 --> 00:35:37.040 so that when they get to that, they just click cheat code 1009 00:35:37.040 --> 00:35:38.680 and then they move through, right? 1010 00:35:38.680 --> 00:35:42.520 And so with services, this is probably easier, right? 1011 00:35:42.520 --> 00:35:46.040 But this is where great product and design comes into play, 1012 00:35:46.040 --> 00:35:48.120 is like, okay, I'm used if you had software, right? 1013 00:35:48.120 --> 00:35:49.760 It's like, how many clicks do I need to get here? 1014 00:35:49.760 --> 00:35:52.280 Is there a way that we can reorganize the UX, 1015 00:35:52.280 --> 00:35:53.840 so that we can do this in fewer clicks? 1016 00:35:53.840 --> 00:35:56.480 How can we display the information differently? 1017 00:35:56.520 --> 00:35:57.360 You know what I'm saying here? 1018 00:35:57.360 --> 00:35:58.960 Like, how can we make it so the effort and sacrifice 1019 00:35:58.960 --> 00:36:00.720 in terms of training their team, 1020 00:36:00.720 --> 00:36:03.560 and all of that stuff is decreased and minimized, 1021 00:36:03.560 --> 00:36:05.800 so that ultimately the experience is improved. 1022 00:36:07.240 --> 00:36:08.520 Hope you guys enjoyed the first part 1023 00:36:08.520 --> 00:36:10.960 of the two part interview with those guys. 1024 00:36:10.960 --> 00:36:12.680 Charlie and Ben are really awesome dudes, 1025 00:36:12.680 --> 00:36:14.640 and I think you guys will really dig 1026 00:36:14.640 --> 00:36:16.840 what is coming into part two of this, 1027 00:36:16.840 --> 00:36:18.360 where we dive even deeper.